Krystal Suspension

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Charlie1
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Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-01 00:36

Perhaps I'm imagining it but the needle on my Krystal seems to move more than I recall it doing when it lands on the vinyl. It's less than 1mm movement but at least 0.5mm. My AT VM95 styluses don't move as much.

Does this sound like it might have failed or be in the process of failing?

It's 16 months old so out of warranty.

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Krystal Suspension

Post by Ron The Mon » 2019-12-01 02:25

Charlie1 wrote:
2019-12-01 00:36
Perhaps I'm imagining it but the needle on my Krystal seems to move more than I recall it doing when it lands on the vinyl. It's less than 1mm movement but at least 0.5mm. My AT VM95 styluses don't move as much.

Does this sound like it might have failed or be in the process of failing?

It's 16 months old so out of warranty.
Charlie1,
Out of all the videos you've taken, do you have one to compare at the same tracking force?

If the Krystal has a longer cantilever, it will appear to have more movement. If you're still running the AT at the low end of recommended tracking force, that will be stressing the suspension less, causing less movement. Try the Audio Technica at 2.2 grams and see what happens.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-01 10:44

Thanks for responding Ron.

Good shout ref the tracking force as they are quite different. I've checked the VM95C at 1.75 and it doesn't sink as much as my krystal - my estimate is that the Krystal sinks about 3 times as much.

My plan was to video the stylus for my dealer but last night I tried and the minimal focal distance of my phone was too long and it was useless. However, tried again this morning with an iPhone and it's much better, hence the link below.

When the stylus initially lands, it seems fine but it then continues to sink afterwards in a way I don't recall it doing previously.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/djeeurkl96t35 ... D.MOV?dl=0

But, perhaps I never noticed this behaviour before and it's the mark of a superior suspension.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by beck » 2019-12-01 18:22

I too find it suspicious. I hope Lejonklou or ThomasOK can help you with a more solid answer.....
Humans need passion in their life and music....

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Krystalized Suspension of Disbelief

Post by Ron The Mon » 2019-12-01 22:43

beck wrote:
2019-12-01 18:22
I too find it suspicious. I hope Lejonklou or ThomasOK can help you with a more solid answer.....
beck,
I don't find it suspicious because I just did the the exact same demo Charlie1 did in his video. Does anyone have specific measurements of fulcrum point to needle measurements of Krystal to AT? I think it is an illusion. Another test to try is the Krystal at a gram or so of tracking. If it sinks down at such a low force, then I'd be suspicious.

I do like the bit of fuzz stuck to the Krystal in the video sweeping the record clean before the diamond traces it. Nice mod!

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by beck » 2019-12-01 23:05

I think and hope you are right.... :-)
Humans need passion in their life and music....

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Tendaberry » 2019-12-03 12:53

Couldn't it just be that the AT and the Krystal have different compliances?
See here e.g. https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_f ... 19&t=80573

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-12-03 19:01

It doesn't look to me like the Krystal is running any lower than I would expect it to. Then again, we don't have a Krystal on demo in the store so Fredrik would be a better source for that info. I did just check our Kandid and it settles a bit, as they all do, but not quite as much as the Krystal. However, I believe the Kandid cantilever is shorter than the Krystal one so it probably shouldn't settle as much.
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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by lejonklou » 2019-12-03 22:31

I've looked at the video and zoomed in on the cantilever when it hits the record. I do see that delayed sinking and when I try it on mine, it can't see it doing that. It sinks and then stops. So I can notice a slight difference, but I couldn't say whether anything is wrong.

The height of the body doesn't seem excessively low. It's probably possible to measure that with the platter standing still, but I'm not sure which way is the best. Perhaps with loose feeler gauges?

I would also expect you to hear a significant drop in musical quality if the suspension is faulty. Unless you've noticed that (and I feel pretty confident you would), I'd just leave it alone.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-03 23:14

Thanks Tom and Fredrik.

I've not noticed a decline in musical enjoyment.

Hopefully I can get at least another year out of it.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Defender » 2019-12-03 23:47

how do you clean your needle - do you do wet cleaning?

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-03 23:56

Nope, not once. My dealer warned me not to and, besides, I'd seen all the forum posts about the issues it can cause.

Green paper at the end of each side and the old AT vibrating doobry after several LPs.

Very occasionally use silly putty if there's something that doesn't want to shift.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Defender » 2019-12-04 00:07

good that was the reason for my question

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Spannko » 2019-12-04 00:16

It’s been a long time since I’ve had a turntable, so I’m relying on my poor memory, but there doesn’t seem to be anything unusual about how your Krystal is settling. Nearly all cartridges have a bit of compliance so will settle to one degree or another. The difficulty is deciding whether your particular cartridge is settling within spec. One thing you could do is look at the cartridge from the front as it settles into the groove. Does it look as though the cantilever is sitting centrally in the hole it’s poking through, or is it sitting towards the top? However, as Fredrik has said, if the suspension is collapsing, you’d probably have noticed a change in the sound by now. Sorry for the non technical description, I can’t remember what the metal bit with a hole in it is called!

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-04 10:07

Thanks Spannko. It's very hard to see, even with glasses, and the loupe can get close enough when the stylus is on a record. Also, any difference must be tiny where it goes through the hole cos it's much nearer the fulcrum - if that's the correct term. Good idea though.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Defender » 2019-12-04 11:45

how about this: you can send your video to the linn helpline - asking for their opinion
they have been always very helpfull to me

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Spannko » 2019-12-04 11:47

I’ve just found this close-up of the Krystal. Does yours look like this?

https://www.adventuresinhifi.com/linn- ... cartridge/

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-04 12:38

That was certainly taken with a very nice macro lens. Shame my eyes are not up to anything like that these days. However, my cart does look like the one in the photo when viewed through a x40 loupe. Shame there isn't a similar close up with it on the vinyl.

I tried to compare online pics to mine but, cos the camera lenses are different, the images are distorted in different ways. Here's my pic for reference:

Image

My dealer has also confirmed that it looks broadly similar to one of his but difficult to be certain without seeing the deck in person.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Spannko » 2019-12-04 16:49

Yours looks to be settling in nicely tbh. If you look at the Adventures in HiFi pic, you can see the cantilever sitting low in the hole. On your pic, the cantilever is sitting centrally. BUT whether it’s right or not depends on how Linn designed the cantilever to sit when playing a record. It makes sense that it would have been designed that way, but only Linn know for sure.
Last edited by Spannko on 2019-12-04 17:50, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Ianw » 2019-12-04 17:05

From your photo the cantilever seems to be OK assuming it has tracking force applied. Be. Aware it will drop a small amount when operating due to drag of moving record.

In the Adventures in hi fi pic the cantilever is completely unloaded hence the cantilever sitting bottom centre on the cartridge body.


If it still sounds good then I’d roll with it but keep it under observation from time to time?

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-12-04 17:20

Thanks gents.

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Re: Krystal Suspension

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-12-04 17:34

Charlie1 wrote:
2019-12-04 12:38
That was certainly taken with a very nice macro lens. Shame my eyes are not up to anything like that these days. However, my cart does look like the one in the photo when viewed through a x40 loupe. Shame there isn't a similar close up with it on the vinyl.

I tried to compare online pics to mine but, cos the camera lenses are different, the images are distorted in different ways. Here's my pic for reference:

Image

My dealer has also confirmed that it looks broadly similar to one of his but difficult to be certain without seeing the deck in person.
Based on this photo I would certainly think yours is just fine.
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