Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

General HiFi discussion, using the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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u252agz
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by u252agz » 2018-10-23 22:09

lejonklou wrote:I'd really appreciate some more opinions on that set of comparisons Robert Lake posted.

Why? Because I suspect that while everyone hears the difference in sound character, some of you will be totally unbothered by what beck labels "tune and timing spread out", Charlie "deconstructed" and I "fragmented".

Am I right?

First clip - Neither is good but Naim more musical .

Second , Third and Fourth - Both units are really bad- so little musicality that i find it pointless commenting on the sound

Kataylyst perhaps marginally less bad than without.

Space optimisation significantly worse.

I can’t believe that either are that bad in real life - is there a major problem with the recording?

I will definitely stay with my Sneaky /Boazu / Komponent 110s
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Ozzzy189 » 2018-10-24 11:58

Perhaps in this day and age of modern recordings and 're-masters' that sound significantly worse than the originals, people and hi fi manufacturers have forgotten what constitutes good sound.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by bonzo » 2018-10-25 01:45

Wow. How great is the tune method! Two 30 second clips.. not necessary.. could tell the difference with maybe 5-7 seconds. Linn struck out!
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by sunbeamgls » 2018-10-25 09:29

To castigate two products on the back of mobile phone clips seems to be over reaching to me. Did no one think that 2 non-musical clips might be more about the clips than the equipment? I see that u252agz has questioned the recordings.

Better to hear them in real life before making such significant judgments. I think of the clips as possibly useful to compare (although still very skeptical about that). To take them as absolutes is, for me, way beyond their capabilities.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Ozzzy189 » 2018-10-25 09:43

There's some recordings on YouTube Vince Bruzzese has done with his speakers and macintosh labs amps, and with headphones in they're stunning, so I think there's an opinion to be formed by such listening. However I appreciate the fact that you have to hear them in person to get a clearer picture.
I remember going to the kds 1 event back in the day at Hedon. The difference was not small yet my mate couldn't tell the two apart! What was stark however was the room was just god-awful for listening to the music and it sounded much more pleasant in the adjacent corridor. I'm not sure if such clips will be pure and not tampered with in that regard.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by beck » 2018-10-25 09:56

It has been said before and I can say it again. For people who value the musical aspects above all the video clips are a gift and far better at creating relevant discussions than “I think that.....”.

It does however take some learning to “decode” the differences. Without the clips on this forum I would never have grasped the small things that makes the biggest difference.
............in our thoughts.............

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by sunbeamgls » 2018-10-25 11:13

beck wrote:It has been said before and I can say it again. For people who value the musical aspects above all the video clips are a gift and far better at creating relevant discussions than “I think that.....”.
I think its wrong to say both systems don't sound musical, on the basis of a chain of equipment that is unknown and likely to be non-musical in itsself. If the communication path is not musical then the kit at the other end is irrelevant. Is it better than speculation? Possibly not.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by beck » 2018-10-25 11:37

The good thing is people can make up their own mind as you have done.
............in our thoughts.............

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by sunbeamgls » 2018-10-25 12:46

beck wrote:The good thing is people can make up their own mind as you have done.
:)

I've made up my mind to keep my mind open until the kit is heard in real life :)
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by beck » 2018-10-25 13:28

....and we end in agreement
............in our thoughts.............

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Spannko » 2018-10-25 14:08

This has been discussed many times. The playground recordings are only intended to be used for determining relative differences in musicality between recordings.

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by tokenbrit » 2018-10-25 15:08

Spannko wrote:This has been discussed many times. The playground recordings are only intended to be used for determining relative differences in musicality between recordings.
Isn't that the point, though? Linn targeted the Naim for comparison to highlight the relative difference, which is what we're doing here through the clip... It's a single clip, which should make it more consistent - the presentation, if not the recording, was on Linn's terms. Not taking the clip as absolute but, to me, Linn's presentation was more telling than the musical(?) & SOnic comparison.

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by mbabst » 2018-10-27 17:05

Does anyone know how to show the SO2 calculations in Konfig on a MacBook?
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by u252agz » 2018-10-27 18:05

sunbeamgls wrote:To castigate two products on the back of mobile phone clips seems to be over reaching to me. Did no one think that 2 non-musical clips might be more about the clips than the equipment? I see that u252agz has questioned the recordings.

Better to hear them in real life before making such significant judgments. I think of the clips as possibly useful to compare (although still very skeptical about that). To take them as absolutes is, for me, way beyond their capabilities.

I agree - better to hear in real life , on a home dem preferrably.

I have heard perfectly good Linn equipment sound awful at some dealers whereas at others the same units sounded good.

Dealer installations , especially with streaming in my experience is very variable and the worst offenders can reduce Klimax level equipment to non musical noise.

Once heard a great Digital system rendered much less musical by just switching the old Ripnas to a new expensive one.

Majik DSM is quite good and I would be very surprised if Selekt is not significantly better.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Wolfie » 2018-10-27 20:18

mbabst wrote:Does anyone know how to show the SO2 calculations in Konfig on a MacBook?
One of the members on the ‘new’ Linn forum on the Wam has been doing something like that. I don’t know if he uses a pc or a Mac, but I think the files are .xml so it shouldn’t matter which OS you have.
Have a look at the Space Optimisation threads there.

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Tendaberry » 2018-10-28 15:48

mbabst wrote:Does anyone know how to show the SO2 calculations in Konfig on a MacBook?
But I doubt they can be shown in Konfig. Phino has described how to visualise them, however, like Mick said.

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Animal » 2019-02-08 12:14

I was lightly interested in Selekt as a possibility to reduce box count versus ADSM but now I've been informed by Linn that the headphone module will NOT happen and that's a deal-breaker for me!

Louis.

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-10-10 20:04

Well, Linn have just announced an interesting change. By popular demand they are reinstating the Klimax DS and the Akurate DS into the line! The Klimax DS remains at $23,375, the same price as the KDSM and what it was selling for when discontinued. However, the Akurate DS has increased from $8500 to $8925 which puts it a fair bit closer to the $10,500 ADSM.

I guess I wasn't the only one who complained to Linn that they were now a source first company that had discontinued their best digital source. Glad to see these products return, although I would like to have seen the KDS go down a bit to reflect the decreased complexity of its design compared to the KDSM.
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Matteo » 2019-10-10 20:34

Good news

When they’ll give up insisting on DVC?

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Matteo » 2019-10-10 20:45

LP12/Kore/Akito 2b/ARadikal/Adikt/Slipsik 7-ND5 XS 2-AK/1-A2200-M109 [Silver-K200]

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Matteo » 2019-10-11 10:59

LP12/Kore/Akito 2b/ARadikal/Adikt/Slipsik 7-ND5 XS 2-AK/1-A2200-M109 [Silver-K200]

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by u252agz » 2019-10-11 14:03

ThomasOK wrote:
2019-10-10 20:04
Well, Linn have just announced an interesting change. By popular demand they are reinstating the Klimax DS and the Akurate DS into the line! The Klimax DS remains at $23,375, the same price as the KDSM and what it was selling for when discontinued.

I guess I wasn't the only one who complained to Linn that they were now a source first company that had discontinued their best digital source. Glad to see these products return, although I would like to have seen the KDS go down a bit to reflect the decreased complexity of its design compared to the KDSM.
Thats great - good to see Linn are listening to you, and reinstating their top end digital source..

Now I don't feel under any pressure to upgrade my KDS/2 - before this I felt I could miss the window if they decided to stop producing new KDS katalyst boards without due notice..
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Defender » 2019-10-11 16:57

thats really good news ... that might also mean there is still hope for a Klimax Renew Katalyst to be available for those of us who can not afford a Klimax DS

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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by linesrg » 2019-10-11 22:04

Good Evening All,

I've just seen this almost simultaneously via Peter Swain and here.

Yes it is good news BUT there is a bigger picture here.

This is the same firm that announced a price rise and then cancelled it and allowed themselves to stop producing streamers and have now re-introduced them.

As I'm a seafarer the analogy of this being a rudderless ship comes to mind - time for a new man to be put in charge.

Regards

Richard
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Re: Linn announcements 9/2018, Selekt, etc.

Post by Matteo » 2019-10-11 22:18

Leaving alone the disband of analogue preamps ...

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