Playground for practical listening exercices

General HiFi discussion, using the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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El Mero Mero
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by El Mero Mero » 2020-01-15 14:26

First clip for me. More foot tapping and enjoyment.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2020-01-15 17:26

So, it’s pretty much conclusive so far then:

Just one GS108T with its own power supply, straight into the DS is the favourite setup when streaming from Qobuz. I’d agree with that, from what I’m hearing at home too.

Just as a check, I did the test again but kept all the cables the same after the first GS108T. The result was the same: sound-wise, smoother, cleaner, “nicer”, tighter bass etc, but musically, it just didn’t engage me. I think that I was really lucky to have started with just one 108T with it’s own ps when Anthony mentioned that he was getting good results by removing his nas. If I’d known that the Friwo was working ok and used it first I might not have been so enthusiastic to continue experimenting!

Anyway. To finish off this series of experiments, I’ve done a video of:

Web (Qobuz 320k stream) -> bjc -> GS108T -> Meicord -> DS
v
Web -> bjc -> GS108T -> Meicord -> Melco (96/24 download from Qobuz) -> Meicord -> DS.

I’ve had to change the cables to the speakers to a pair of ‘no name’ in order to make the comparison between the stream and the download as comparable as possible. Unfortunately, this worsened the sound, but the Meicords are the only cables I’ve got three of. Hopefully the difference will still show through though.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/eh7w326rzh5 ... 8gBta?dl=0

PS. I’ve just realised that the final, final test should be a high res stream v high res download. I’ll sign up for a free trial later!

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-15 22:00

Sorry, I do not like any of these clips. Slow “vibrato” clinging to the body of the sound from the first clip. Quicker vibrato “clinging” to the body of the sound from the second clip. Best heard listening to my ipad speakers.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by tokenbrit » 2020-01-15 23:30

I prefer 1 ... but what do I know? (Friwo; schmiwo ;)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2020-01-16 10:59

1 for me too.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2020-01-16 14:52

beck wrote:
2020-01-15 22:00
Sorry, I do not like any of these clips. Slow “vibrato” clinging to the body of the sound from the first clip. Quicker vibrato “clinging” to the body of the sound from the second clip. Best heard listening to my ipad speakers.
Don’t you just hate it when a sound offends your ears? I certainly do, and I can tell you that it was a mighty relief to put my usual cables back on the speakers!

Would you say that one was more offensive than the other, or are they both beyond salvation? :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-16 18:04

Hard pressed I might pick the first clip but I would rather not! :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2020-01-16 23:19

I'm pretty much with beck. I'm not too thrilled with either of them but I did find the first clip somewhat preferable.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2020-01-17 00:09

That’s great. Thanks everyone.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Defender » 2020-01-17 09:21

for me the second one sounded more forward and offensive - that made me also prefer the first one more

Its good that there is also a feedback if none of the clips sound right because that might save one or the other to start a wrong path.

for the power supplies: did you checked both Netgear and Friwo for the better polarity (might be not possible because of your power plugs in the UK)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-17 11:31

Defender wrote:
2020-01-17 09:21

Its good that there is also a feedback if none of the clips sound right because that might save one or the other to start a wrong path.
I agree.

As a rule I will try to be polite but to the point and stress that it is my personal view that is being presented. In this case it is easier to dismiss the clips as Spannko has produced other clips that worked well.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2020-01-17 15:43

Defender wrote:
2020-01-17 09:21
for me the second one sounded more forward and offensive - that made me also prefer the first one more

Its good that there is also a feedback if none of the clips sound right because that might save one or the other to start a wrong path.

for the power supplies: did you checked both Netgear and Friwo for the better polarity (might be not possible because of your power plugs in the UK)
Good points Defender, it’s far too easy to be led down the garden path. I should know, I’ve been there a few times!

You’re right about the polarity in the UK - it’s not possible to reverse it unless the equipment has a reversible plug, like a ‘figure of 8’.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Defender » 2020-01-18 14:58

here are two clips from my side - its about my LP12 belt
is rough side inside sounding better or smooth side inside sounding better
... with my belt its very difficult to „see“ or „feel“ what the smooth side is even rubbing between your fingers or trying what feels more smooth on the lips or forehead or finding it out with which side it is bouncing better.
However I am fairly sure I know what which side is as I checked with a magnifying glass and also in sunlight

Clip 1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pnof2cu4luy5l ... 6.mov?dl=0

Clip 2
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nyixcv9u25olp ... 1.mov?dl=0

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-18 15:02

Lovely Defender.

To me clip 2 is music.... :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by V.A.MKD » 2020-01-18 15:09

Clip 2, for me is better.

Clip 1 is more "flat" ...
Music First ...

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-18 15:13

........and what a lovely looking turntable Defender. Congratulation! :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2020-01-18 17:13

Yep, clip 2 sounds like the correct side.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Defender » 2020-01-18 17:51

good to have you guys and thank you for your help

all is in right order smooth side in is Clip 2
the strange thing is when I sit in front of the system I am 95% sure its the other way around.
If I hear the clips through my phone I also prefer the second clip. This is really confusing.

here is the test for right direction
Clip 1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/riuvxs9718c9v ... 4.mov?dl=0

Clip 2
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z2o2uk8d3sfa4 ... 6.mov?dl=0

and yes I really enjoy the turntable

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-18 18:49

Second clip again for me. Sounding gooooooooood! :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2020-01-18 19:08

Did you test top and bottom as well?
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2020-01-18 19:41

2nd clip for me as well.

Looking smart too.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Defender » 2020-01-18 19:49

thank you for all your input - really singing now

that was where I couldnt get my head around ... are there more than 4 options?
smooth side in - one direction (top)
smooth side in - other direction (bottom)
rough side in - one direction (top)
rough side in - other direction (bottom)

I think when I change the direction the top comes down. Independent if I move the right side to left or pulley side to inner platter side

second clips have been
Clip 1 smooth side in (top)
Clip 1 smooth side in (bottom)
I only tested the best side out of the first 2 clips further ... meaning smooth side in.

edited to make my writing more meaningfull

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2020-01-19 16:11

Finally completed my vintage Naim search for a more powerful Nait, thanks to much appreciated input on this thread plus additional feedback from some forum friends via PM. Thanks to everyone!

I've settled on 12/110. The CB-era pre-amps were a problem. They just don’t seem to cut it for me - too laboured and unflowing. Never got to hear the bolt-down 22 or 32 though. Interestingly, it was never an issue with the cards - using CB32 or 32.5 cards in the 12 sounds almost as good, better in some ways (i.e. cleaner).

I also couldn’t get on with the Naim separate PSU architecture for some reason - where everything is earthed via the SNAPS or HiCap. Therefore, the very nice sounding 250 didn’t make it through :(

The 110 has had a service and so has the Nait but I prefer the unserviced cards in the 12.

So here are the final clips of 12/110 vs Nait, starting off with some cool music and quickly descending in coolness, but they put a smile on my face nonetheless.

12/110:
Clip 1 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/6e8ihj390lfe5 ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 2 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/cfonl3m99hthk ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 3 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/dqwlea1b87v5x ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 4 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/942ktee6gzsqy ... D.MOV?dl=0

Nait:
Clip 1 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/v520j13edn6f1 ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 2 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/0d441qg4n09zv ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 3 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/qfauql22fri2g ... D.MOV?dl=0
Clip 4 - https://www.dropbox.com/s/wq9z9rclhcs49 ... D.MOV?dl=0

Everything was properly warmed up and set-up for each amp.

I know these aren't the most musical Kan 1s but they don't distract me by often sounding 'weird' at a certain frequency.
Last edited by Charlie1 on 2020-01-19 21:01, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2020-01-19 17:03

I am in love with flat earth sound! :-)

I am smiling, nodding and having a great time listening to your clips.

It is possible to hear the slight lack in power from the Nait1 compared to the 12/110 but it is still a charming amp. The 12/110 is more head on the music.

I would keep both and simply enjoy their slightly different qualities.


Sitting here listening to Billy Ocean for the third time on the 12/110! :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by V.A.MKD » 2020-01-19 20:47

Second Clip for me ... More tune in the voice ...
Defender wrote:
2020-01-18 17:51
good to have you guys and thank you for your help

all is in right order smooth side in is Clip 2
the strange thing is when I sit in front of the system I am 95% sure its the other way around.
If I hear the clips through my phone I also prefer the second clip. This is really confusing.

here is the test for right direction
Clip 1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/riuvxs9718c9v ... 4.mov?dl=0

Clip 2
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z2o2uk8d3sfa4 ... 6.mov?dl=0

and yes I really enjoy the turntable
Music First ...

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