Playground for practical listening exercises
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Now when both files on the website are working like they should and can be streamed and compared, I instead prefer B.
It was only when listening to these files saved locally on my PC that I did prefer A. That was caused by Windows Media Player. After switching to VLC, B did win.
It was only when listening to these files saved locally on my PC that I did prefer A. That was caused by Windows Media Player. After switching to VLC, B did win.
- markiteight
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I finally managed to get the clips to play reliably. This time I experimented a bit. Rather than listening through headphones at a reasonable volume I played the clips through my laptop's internal speakers at a relatively low volume, just above ambient noise, to see if I could detect a difference. Surprisingly I could, and it was quite clear. Under less-than-ideal conditions B was much easer to follow and understand.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Playing with MBP/Firefox/HP I prefer B
Matt
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Very interesting comparison.lejonklou wrote: ↑2023-12-01 15:09Thank you all for sharing your opinions and votes!lejonklou wrote: ↑2023-11-28 23:09 Two songs: 1 and 2.
Two preamps: A and B.
What do you think? Will tell you more the 1st of December!
https://lejonklou.com/1A.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/1B.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/2A.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/2B.MOV
Preamp A is Superkikkin.
Preamp B is Sagatun stereo 1.7.
1.7 is a new version for both Sagatun stereo and Sagatun Mono. It consists of many small changes to power supplies, chassis ground, hardware parts like screws and cable clips, new internal torques, recalibration of power supplies and new feet. The upgrade costs SEK 4000, EUR 360 or USD 400 per unit.
What did I think of the clips when listening in the room? I think Superkikkin is better than Sagatun stereo 1.4 (I’m sorry, but I messed up the recording of it) and from credible sources Superkikkin also outperforms Sagatun Mono 1.0.
I think Sagatun stereo 1.7 is a little better than Superkikkin. They both have their different strengths, though, and on some tracks I hesitated and went back and forth repeatedly. Overall I prefer Sagatun stereo 1.7.
Volume was exactly the same on all recordings.
I thought Sagatun stereo 1.7 was better, everything is more in tune, and the musicians expressions are better.
- springwood64
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
What were we listening to ?Azazello wrote: ↑2023-12-06 21:51 A or B?
A: https://photos.app.goo.gl/LBoqeVVbJ7v6WxBfA
B: https://photos.app.goo.gl/pWH27ffyf6cfJbnz6
Pete
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Sorry!springwood64 wrote: ↑2023-12-08 21:45What were we listening to ?Azazello wrote: ↑2023-12-06 21:51 A or B?
A: https://photos.app.goo.gl/LBoqeVVbJ7v6WxBfA
B: https://photos.app.goo.gl/pWH27ffyf6cfJbnz6
It was a bunch of wall damping modules I bought on Temu vs. nothing on the walls. 😄
A was with damping and B was without.
I should probably try with fewer, but now I’ve put them in the office instead where they do a good job of limiting the echo of the room while I’m in online meetings.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I preferred Sagatun 1.7 - I had a clear preference and did not feel I needed to listen twice .lejonklou wrote: ↑2023-12-01 15:09Thank you all for sharing your opinions and votes!lejonklou wrote: ↑2023-11-28 23:09 Two songs: 1 and 2.
Two preamps: A and B.
What do you think? Will tell you more the 1st of December!
https://lejonklou.com/1A.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/1B.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/2A.MOV
https://lejonklou.com/2B.MOV
Preamp A is Superkikkin.
Preamp B is Sagatun stereo 1.7.
1.7 is a new version for both Sagatun stereo and Sagatun Mono. It consists of many small changes to power supplies, chassis ground, hardware parts like screws and cable clips, new internal torques, recalibration of power supplies and new feet. The upgrade costs SEK 4000, EUR 360 or USD 400 per unit.
What did I think of the clips when listening in the room? I think Superkikkin is better than Sagatun stereo 1.4 (I’m sorry, but I messed up the recording of it) and from credible sources Superkikkin also outperforms Sagatun Mono 1.0.
I think Sagatun stereo 1.7 is a little better than Superkikkin. They both have their different strengths, though, and on some tracks I hesitated and went back and forth repeatedly. Overall I prefer Sagatun stereo 1.7.
Volume was exactly the same on all recordings.
Maybe I should have, but I thought the Sagatun was just more musical on both tracks.
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Expecting this one to divide opinion a little but let's see...
1.) K400/Majik 109: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/r7yrm52c ... vymoz&dl=0
2.) K20/Kan (serial 16,xxx): https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xybkkfp1 ... 5l04g&dl=0
The Kans are back from a light touch service by Andrew at Anapeach Restoration and had 50 hours run-in. One tweeter needed replacing with an original from same era. And the caps were replaced with Alcaps (50v as before). Resister was only a fraction off so left alone.
1.) K400/Majik 109: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/r7yrm52c ... vymoz&dl=0
2.) K20/Kan (serial 16,xxx): https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xybkkfp1 ... 5l04g&dl=0
The Kans are back from a light touch service by Andrew at Anapeach Restoration and had 50 hours run-in. One tweeter needed replacing with an original from same era. And the caps were replaced with Alcaps (50v as before). Resister was only a fraction off so left alone.
- springwood64
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Well they sound a bit different, but I like them both equally and both engaged me.Charlie1 wrote: ↑2023-12-11 13:47 1.) K400/Majik 109: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/r7yrm52c ... vymoz&dl=0
2.) K20/Kan (serial 16,xxx): https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xybkkfp1 ... 5l04g&dl=0
Pete
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
For me, the 2) reproduces music better. It's easier to listen to, while 1) sounds pleasing but unclear.
Trust your ears
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Played with the big rig I prefer 2.
Last edited by matthias on 2023-12-11 21:50, edited 2 times in total.
Matt
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I’ve had both speakers in the past, and I’m surprised by the margin of my preference for the kans.
The search for knowledge is not nourished by certainty, but by a radical distrust in certainty
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
It's two different presentations where 1 is refined and 2 is more direct. Both are great though.
Edit: Isn't this the song that Paddy from the band Prefab Sprout really likes, and wished he’d written himself?
Edit: Isn't this the song that Paddy from the band Prefab Sprout really likes, and wished he’d written himself?
Last edited by Whatsmynaim on 2023-12-11 21:37, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
2 for me - much preferred the Kans. just more musical.
If I could find a pristine example - would love to give them a try in my system.
Although I would still worry about someone knocking stand mounted speakers off their stands . This is a hangover from when my children were small and I switched to Floor standers .( first Ninkas , then 242s)
If I could find a pristine example - would love to give them a try in my system.
Although I would still worry about someone knocking stand mounted speakers off their stands . This is a hangover from when my children were small and I switched to Floor standers .( first Ninkas , then 242s)
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I feel the same. I enjoy both.springwood64 wrote: ↑2023-12-11 15:16Well they sound a bit different, but I like them both equally and both engaged me.Charlie1 wrote: ↑2023-12-11 13:47 1.) K400/Majik 109: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/r7yrm52c ... vymoz&dl=0
2.) K20/Kan (serial 16,xxx): https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xybkkfp1 ... 5l04g&dl=0
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Agree, both sound very nice and tuneful, but I'd have to give the nod to the Kans with their ability to greater get the listener more involved emotionally.
Rega NAIA, Aphelion II, Aura. Naim CB 32.5/HC, Naxo 3-6/HC, 3x250 into K20/DMS.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Thanks for listening everyone.
Expected a few more 109 votes.
Agree with all comments really.
Need to see how I get on in the long term but they will most likely replace the 109s.
Expected a few more 109 votes.
Agree with all comments really.
Need to see how I get on in the long term but they will most likely replace the 109s.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Reminds me of the comparison I did between a modern Majik-i (with Dynamik) vs Wakonda/LK140. The modern Linn amp was nice but a bit boring somehow. I recall you preferred the LK amps that time too.David Neel wrote: ↑2023-12-11 18:25 I’ve had both speakers in the past, and I’m surprised by the margin of my preference for the kans.
I find the 109s easier to follow (in a way) but less interesting with it, so not what you'd expect from a tune dem developed speaker.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I can hear how 109’s might appeal to some, particularly with the opening bass line, but like most here, I just find the Kans more engaging.
- markiteight
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I lean toward the Kans as well, but perhaps that's because I'm surprised at how much I liked them in these clips. I enjoyed both a lot...these clips are possibly the best showing I've heard from both speakers.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
I like the Kans too. What version do you have?
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Thanks Mi8 - that's encouraging to knowmarkiteight wrote: ↑2023-12-12 02:15 I lean toward the Kans as well, but perhaps that's because I'm surprised at how much I liked them in these clips. I enjoyed both a lot...these clips are possibly the best showing I've heard from both speakers.
Re: Playground for practical listening exercises
Kan, by a great margin I must say. Takes 1-2 second to hear how much more engaging they reproduce sound. Having written that, I did'nt find the M109 engaging at all in this clip with this set up. Have heard them significantly better (read tunefull) with different set-up, both active and passive.