General Discussion about Källa

[sunbeamgls]

Without going too much off-topic, but connecting a Källa to the analogue input of an Exakt system is going to be inferior and more expensive than abandoning Exakt.

Exakt primarily makes sense with an Exakt source, otherwise I would strongly advice against it.

Its not a given at all. There are still benefits with an analogue source, if one is of the opinion that there are benefits with Exakt, which spannko may recognise, having invested.

Personally, I'd be listening before deciding.

Plugging a Källa into an Exakt system makes no sense at all! I don’t believe Katalyst/Exakt has the finesse to allow the Källa’s output to be amplified without totally skrewing up what it does well. It’ll turn an unbelievably musical presentation into a wall of sound with reasonably tuneful and rhythmical sound effects thrown in for good measure.

Källa has introduced a paradigm shift. It’s re-written the rule book. Forget what you think you knew. It doesn’t apply any more!

Benefits with Exakt? Maybe, although that’s never been a consideration for me. After all, “Exakt” is nothing more than marketing speak for a digital crossover with dsp. It’ll have its disadvantages too.

You might've noticed I don't have a view on this because I haven't heard Kalla through an Exakt system. Yet. I prefer to listen rather than guess, an approach which I think this forum is generally supportive of. I was also cautious enough to say that some don't appreciate what Exakt does and that's fine. Its worth noting that there are many LP12 owners who feed their deck into an Exakt system. Some will say that makes no sense, others rather like it.
I just think it is worth listening before deciding.

[sunbeamgls]

I have to disagree that this would be a breakthrough.

May we have this noted in the records for future reference please!

Even if Kalla is supremely musical (which seems to be the case reported here) and more musical than any other digital player, that is an improvement, not a breakthrough. A breakthrough would be the case if it was an absolute to say there are no musically engaging digital players. Given that I enjoy up to 3 hours of musical engagement pretty much every evening and am always eager to get started on the evening's music tells me that there are already nusically engaging players.
That's all.

[sunbeamgls]

20211008_105317.jpg

Is the change to grey lettering just for Kalla, or a change of direction for all new builds please Fredrik?

All new products/builds will have the grey logo.

Thanks Fredrik. Sorry for pushing on the detail but do you mean all new models or all newly built products from now on?

Having seen it in the flesh now, I like the added subtlety.

[Defender]

I think we have to differentiate between relative and absolute here - there are relatively musical digital players out there. However if a digital player can challenge a Klimax level LP12 that is for me a breakthrough situation.

But that surely depends what your opinion is about if there is a difference between outstanding analog and outstanding digital in the first place. I have the opinion so far I never heard any digital system which could challenge best analog.

However, so far we only have only one example so the statistical relevance is not given ... but I already see a pattern ;)

[jajo]

I prefer to listen rather than guess, an approach which I think this forum is generally supportive of

Still there are some basic rules that are rarely broken by a different combination of equipment. No doubt the Exakt system will play better than ever with Källa connected. But since Exakt is musically worse than pure analogue alternatives (in my opinion - of course), connecting a Källa will not change the fact that you can get a much higher performance at a lower cost by keeping pre-amp, power amp and speakers analogue. Källa opens up this possibility and it should be considered if possible in my humble opinion.

JBL 308/708 could also be a good route because of their excellent performance at a low price point (especially the 308).

Again, these are only my personal opinions. It is perfectly fine to like Exakt. But the musical performance of Exakt really has almost nothing in common with what you experience from Källa. Worth noting. It is very different. Exakt-users who end up loving their Källa should probably try non-Exakt again.

[Charlie1]

Also, the sense of synergy was quite clear to my mind, when partnered with Lejonklou amplifiers. The source being the most important component, you really got much clearer Lejonklouness coming through than ever before - sorry, can't think of a better word and I don't want to use ''sound'.

[FairPlayMotty]

I have to disagree that this would be a breakthrough.

May we have this noted in the records for future reference please!

Even if Kalla is supremely musical (which seems to be the case reported here) and more musical than any other digital player, that is an improvement, not a breakthrough. A breakthrough would be the case if it was an absolute to say there are no musically engaging digital players. Given that I enjoy up to 3 hours of musical engagement pretty much every evening and am always eager to get started on the evening's music tells me that there are already nusically engaging players.
That's all.

+1

[matthias]

However if a digital player can challenge a Klimax level LP12 that is for me a breakthrough situation.

+1

Matt

[ThomasOK]

However if a digital player can challenge a Klimax level LP12 that is for me a breakthrough situation.

+1

Matt

+2

[springwood64]

However if a digital player can challenge a Klimax level LP12 that is for me a breakthrough situation.

+1

Matt

+2

If a digital player costing around £6000 can be as rewarding for vinyl enthusiasts as a Klimax LP12, that is more than a break through.

[ThomasOK]

I have to disagree that this would be a breakthrough.

May we have this noted in the records for future reference please!

Even if Kalla is supremely musical (which seems to be the case reported here) and more musical than any other digital player, that is an improvement, not a breakthrough. A breakthrough would be the case if it was an absolute to say there are no musically engaging digital players. Given that I enjoy up to 3 hours of musical engagement pretty much every evening and am always eager to get started on the evening's music tells me that there are already nusically engaging players.
That's all.

A streamer that people who spend much of their time listening to digital reproduction find to be a much better rendition of digital reproduction would be an improvement, maybe even a major improvement, depending on the size of the difference. When people who have generally shunned digital streaming as not being truly rewarding (or digital reproduction in general) and have stuck with primarily analog find a streamer equally enjoyable and gripping, that I would call a breakthrough.

I haven't heard a Källa yet but the first reports certainly are promising.

If I were to put it another way, a faster Charger (Corvette, 911, M3. etc.) would be an improvement. My Tesla 3 is a breakthrough.

[FairPlayMotty]

However if a digital player can challenge a Klimax level LP12 that is for me a breakthrough situation.

+1

Matt

The Taiko Extreme didn't?

[sunbeamgls]

May we have this noted in the records for future reference please!

Even if Kalla is supremely musical (which seems to be the case reported here) and more musical than any other digital player, that is an improvement, not a breakthrough. A breakthrough would be the case if it was an absolute to say there are no musically engaging digital players. Given that I enjoy up to 3 hours of musical engagement pretty much every evening and am always eager to get started on the evening's music tells me that there are already nusically engaging players.
That's all.

A streamer that people who spend much of their time listening to digital reproduction find to be a much better rendition of digital reproduction would be an improvement, maybe even a major improvement, depending on the size of the difference. When people who have generally shunned digital streaming as not being truly rewarding (or digital reproduction in general) and have stuck with primarily analog find a streamer equally enjoyable and gripping, that I would call a breakthrough.

I haven't heard a Källa yet but the first reports certainly are promising.

If I were to put it another way, a faster Charger (Corvette, 911, M3. etc.) would be an improvement. My Tesla 3 is a breakthrough.

I much better understand your perspective now TOK, thank you. Is it also possible that those who find an existing digital product musically engaging could find it a backwards step for exactly the same reasons those who have stuck with analogue find it a breakthrough?
This question is a bit devil's advocate, as I think this is unlikely, but its a scenario that might be possible.

FYI I've now heard Kalla, I'll write up something soonish, but I'll get to it after writing about the UK Audio Show which is pretty lengthy.

[matthias]

The Taiko Extreme didn't?

I listened to the Taiko under show conditions only but after reading the now over 400 pages long Taiko thread on WBF I can say:

>The Taiko is 25k, optimized for USB output and sold without a DAC, so you must find a musical sounding DAC at extra cost.
>The Taiko is optimized for Qobuz etc. and local storage, but NOT for Spotify.
>The people I trust on WBF who have a Taiko and "high rated" turntables prefer vinyl playback even when the gap gets smaller.
>With the Taiko local storage seems to be a tiny bit better than music from streaming services.
>In my understanding the Taiko is not optimized with the tune method.

Taking these points into account and what people who were able to listen to Källa reported:
>>>Källa is in my view a breakthrough.

Matt

[cortina]

Taking these points into account and what people who were able to listen to Källa reported:
>>>Källa is in my view a breakthrough.

Matt

Exciting times ahead!
The final verdict whether it is a true breakthrough should not be that far away (less than a year at least) via the sales figures! A true breakthrough in digital streaming should result in a drastically new customer base outside the typical Lejonklou customer base if the cards are played right.

[matthias]

The final verdict whether it is a true breakthrough should not be that far away (less than a year at least) via the sales figures! A true breakthrough in digital streaming should result in a drastically new customer base outside the typical Lejonklou customer base if the cards are played right.

This is not always the case, many people prefer typical "hifi criteria" over musicality and playing the tune.
Sometimes even "high rated" reviewers do not recognize real quality.

Matt

[cortina]

Sorry but cannot look upon it as a breakthrough then.

We are not talking mainstream consumer product sales volume but huge sales in relation to all previous Lejonklou products.

[springwood64]

Looks like we need a new thread to debate the definition of breakthrough :)

[matthias]

Sorry but cannot look upon it as a breakthrough then.
We are not talking mainstream consumer product sales volume but huge sales in relation to all previous Lejonklou products.

Sorry I disagree,
breakthrough for me is that is has a certain musical quality, has nothing to do with sales volume.

Matt

[Defender]

Sorry but cannot look upon it as a breakthrough then.

My experience is that is not necessarily true. Here is why: customers dont only decide on the performance of the product. Some would only buy from known brands for image reasons, for reasons that they think they get better service through a broad network of dealers. Some dont want to mix brands because of synergy reasons.

For many people Lejonklou as a brand is not even on the radar. And some think a streamer for this price can not sincerely compete with a product from a known, long time in digital business brand which sells their streamer for 3times the money.
And finally some customers simply would not expect/want to use it the way it is used which is different to what they are used to.

And as Matt said some have different views about what is important - sound impression vs. musicality.

[cortina]

So if you have launched a breakththrough product with a huge number of potential customers and play your cards right, it will not show in very significant increase sales numbers..? Extreme nisch product then... or it is just a few hundred of the millions of people that do streming that both appreciate vinyl and then (potentielly at least) should appreciate a ”musical” streamer focused on the rather popular Spotify streaming..

[matthias]

Most people in "audiophile circles" do not regard Spotify as high quality in comparison to other streaming services and most probably will not appreciate a streamer which is optimized for the replay of Spotify.
And people who typically listen to Spotify with their smartphones can not afford or do not buy a Källa for other reasons.
All "audiophiles" of the world together are "niche" in comparison to all people who listen to Spotify.

Matt

[Rudi64]

Most people in audiophile circles do not regard Spotify as high quality in comparison to other streaming services and most probably will not appreciate a streamer which is optimized for the replay of Spotify.
And people who typically listen to Spotify with their smartphones can not afford or do not buy a Källa for other reasons.

Matt

And they are right, no?
In my opinon compairing spotify with my music stored on my nas, i can easily tell the difference..but maybe kalla is a different story?
i would not doubt kalla could be a amazing streamer looking at Fredrik as developer and deserves all the respect..but a streamer with the only option of streaming from spotify is a no go for me...i cherish my files stored on my asustor nas with a 4T samsung ssd and miminserver...

[lejonklou]

Källa is not optimized for Spotify. You can play any streaming service with it and also play the music stored on your NAS.

[matthias]

streamer with the only option of streaming from spotify

Not the only option but Källa is optimized for playback from streaming services.
I like that but YMMV.
At least David Neel found that music from a NAS is not far behind.

Matt