Ethernet regenerator

General HiFi discussion, using the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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matthias
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Ethernet regenerator

Post by matthias » 2019-11-14 22:01

Music at Home wrote:
2018-03-28 21:58
Completely coincidental, but after posting that link in an earlier post to an explanation of how/why that USB regenerator device offers audible improvements in a USB interface, I came across an announcement from the same company, Uptone Audio, to say that they're working on an Ethernet regenerator, based in the same principles as the USB regen.
Tentative details here: https://www.computeraudiophile.com/foru ... ent=798379
It doesn't look like it will be cheap, but I've used the USB Regen in the past and thought it extremely effective and worthwhile, so I'll be keeping on eye on this. I'd be keen to evaluate it against my Netgear G105 with Teddy Pardo power supply and/or an 8-port Cisco Catalyst 2960 that arrived here recently
EDIT: New link here: https://www.computeraudiophile.com/foru ... tions-yet/
There is a thread now with listening impressions with the etherRegen:

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topi ... /#comments

Two of the contributors have KDS: EVOLVIST and Evo1668

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Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-15 08:29

OK, so I’ve had an EtherRegen since Tuesday.
It is superb and still improving so there is some burn in.

For me, it does the same thing as Fredrik’s amps, making the music easier to understand and follow what the musicians are doing and how they are interacting with each other. Taking it out, the music becomes harder to follow, and seems slightly out of focus. I have to concentrate to pick out individual instruments which were just there before ( I hope this makes sense).

As a specific example, I can now effortlessly make out individual cymbal hits in Propellerheads SpyBreak and they have a regular accent. Take out the ER and they’re blurred together.

It seems Voodoo Chile Slight Return is a favourite in the reviews and I have to agree that I have never heard Jimi’s guitar playing sound so real and in the room.

I could go on about more more controlled and sometimes deeper bass, and extra nuances to individual notes, but I’m sure you get the picture.

£650 plus thirty day money back guarantee. Try it!
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Ethernet regenerator

Post by Spannko » 2019-11-15 09:33

Sounds interesting macrotech2. Any chance of a couple of videos?

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Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-15 10:36

Sorry, no. After my initial listening comparisons, I've removed the old switch completely (a Netgear GS108 by the way), so comparisons are no longer straightforward.

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Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-15 10:39

Moderators - perhaps this should come out into a new thread?

I see Melco have released a Network Switch for £2k! Anyone tried this?
Unlike the EtherRegen, the technology in it doesn't seem to be anything different though.
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Ethernet regenerator

Post by matthias » 2019-11-15 15:36

macrotech2 wrote:
2019-11-15 08:29
For me, it does the same thing as Fredrik’s amps, making the music easier to understand and follow what the musicians are doing and how they are interacting with each other. Taking it out, the music becomes harder to follow, and seems slightly out of focus.
Thank you for sharing your impressions.
With this quality it would make sense to start a thread about.
Do you post on AS forum as well?
Thanks

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Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-15 16:27

matthias wrote:
2019-11-15 15:36
Thank you for sharing your impressions.
With this quality it would make sense to start a thread about.
Do you post on AS forum as well?
Thanks

Matt
No, I don't Matt.
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by matthias » 2019-11-17 15:49

macrotech2 wrote:
2019-11-15 10:36
Sorry, no. After my initial listening comparisons, I've removed the old switch completely (a Netgear GS108 by the way), so comparisons are no longer straightforward.
According to the thread on AS there seems to be an improvement with the ER as a replacement for other switches like in your case but maybe not as an add-on switch when a switch is not needed.

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Catweazle » 2019-11-17 17:31

Interesting concept, and I'd love to lend one from my trusted dealer to audition it in my system. Does anyone here have an idea, how this thingy differs drom Melco's NAS products, who also promise to "cleanse" the Ethernet signal for the DSM?
There has been a lot of praise of Melco around. But when I tried a Melco at home, I was not convinced. Maybe my neighbor is not into clown porn that much? 😜
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-17 18:45

Catweazle wrote:
2019-11-17 17:31
Interesting concept, and I'd love to lend one from my trusted dealer to audition it in my system. Does anyone here have an idea, how this thingy differs drom Melco's NAS products, who also promise to "cleanse" the Ethernet signal for the DSM?
There has been a lot of praise of Melco around. But when I tried a Melco at home, I was not convinced. Maybe my neighbor is not into clown porn that much? 😜
The Uptone Audio EtherRegen is a "from the ground up design" of a switch, which you can read about in detail here https://uptoneaudio.com/products/etherregen (hopefully it is OK to post links to other company's products?).

In contrast, Melco's products are mainly NAS drives with carefully designed Ethernet and USB outputs. They have just released their own switch, detailed here https://www.melco-audio-masters.com/upl ... eet_v3.pdf. Unlike the EtherRegen there doesn't appear to be any different technology in use, basically using a buffer and high grade components. This costs three times the price of an EtherRegen. I haven't heard one, so can't comment on its effectiveness. However, my personal view is that their marketing claims are rather woolly, in contrast to the extensive technical details provided by Uptone Audio. Proof is always in the listening of course.

If you'd like to read page after page of negative and sometimes quite aggressive views, from the typical crowd of "can't possibly make a difference. I haven't tried it myself, but I know science / I'm a network expert / if it can't be measured you're imagining it", look here. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/foru ... egen.9260/.
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by fatjulio » 2019-11-19 23:20

How much of an improvement is it compared to the investment? Or could you equate it with a component upgrade? I'm keen to hear one, but there won't be any available until next year

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by matthias » 2019-11-21 15:31

This is a very interesting article about networking I want to share with you.
At the end it is referring to the EtherRegen too.

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/ ... ost-609784

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by fatjulio » 2019-11-27 08:13

https://uptoneaudio.com/blogs/news/ethe ... ts-reviews

Looks like they're flying out the door. The January shipment is sold out

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Re: Ethernet Insults

Post by Ron The Mon » 2019-11-28 02:38

macrotech2 wrote:
2019-11-17 18:45
Catweazle wrote:
2019-11-17 17:31
If you'd like to read page after page of negative and sometimes quite aggressive views, from the typical crowd of "can't possibly make a difference. I haven't tried it myself, but I know science / I'm a network expert / if it can't be measured you're imagining it", look here. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/foru ... egen.9260/.
WOW! This is not "typical". "Aggressive" is being quite polite.

I mean WOW!!~~~~~~~

I have written some drunken dumb things on internet forums over the years, but the folks on that forum are vile and outright evil. I still can't get over the accepted behavior there. I completely read all 23 pages referenced and didn't learn anything about hi-fi. At about page 20, a moderator berated a poster for continuing to state ethernet switches sound different and threatened to close the thread for that! Yet no moderator stopped pages and pages of personal insults of physical attributes and intelligence. One member showed photos of a guy who didn't ever post on that forum with others insulting his physical appearance.

Apparently their forums' founder has some magic $25,000 piece of test equipment which proves everything. But don't tell him Blue Jeans Cable has a more expensive tester which proves better sounding ethernet cables actually measure better because he knows only stupid fat balding guys with hair in their ears believe ethernet cables sound different.

Like I said above, WOW!

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by macrotech2 » 2019-11-28 09:26

Wow indeed. It was only three pages in when I made my initial post.

As a scientist, I have sympathy with the goal of being able to measure differences that matched user's findings. However, one of the ways science progresses is that observations are made that don't match existing theories and a way has to be found to explain them.

I have no sympathy with the aggression and general lack of willingness to concede that there might be something there that hasn't been thought of. It always seems to be the "I know I'm right" and close-minded folk who are the most aggressive about these matters. The same happens whenever a company like Qobuz advertise on Facebook, and you're told you can't possibly hear an improvement over mp3 and you're wasting your money, and the company are selling snake oil.

I don't know what these people gain from this - they're stressing themselves and wasting time that they could be using to listen to music. Perhaps they don't listen to music because they're constantly worrying that they might be imagining something they can't measure!
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Spannko » 2019-11-28 11:45

Orrrderrr! ........ order! May I remind the honourable gentleman that BJC’s analyser costs £7500 and BJC make no claims for the sound quality of their cables, only that they guarantee the cables will pass the relevant CAT spec.

Proceed!

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by beck » 2019-11-28 12:39

Spannko wrote:
2019-11-28 11:45
Orrrderrr! ........ order! May I remind the honourable gentleman that BJC’s analyser costs £7500 and BJC make no claims for the sound quality of their cables, only that they guarantee the cables will pass the relevant CAT spec.

Proceed!
https://youtu.be/H4v7wddN-Wg
In need of good ears

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Spannko » 2019-11-28 13:39

Thanks beck. He was one of the UK’s most popular public figures and I’m sure the House of Commons won’t be anywhere as entertaining as it has been. We’ll miss him.

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Geoff » 2019-12-29 06:34

I'm always curious what the nattering nabobs of negativity have for a system, if they took the time to tunedem it to the millimeter, and what music they listen to. There are super tasters and super smellers, so I have no doubt that there is a range of hearing from average to super. Maybe they need to step away from the keyboards and find some kind bud and some kinder poontang?

They should be forced to spend time at Frederik's kitchen table selecting acceptable resistors! Zen penance.
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-12-31 18:59

Geoff wrote:
2019-12-29 06:34
They should be forced to spend time at Frederik's kitchen table selecting acceptable resistors! Zen penance.
:-)

(It is done in a lab, by the way!)
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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Spannko » 2020-01-23 18:49

I’ve read that The Chord Company are introducing their own network switch in the next couple of months too. No details or prices yet.

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Tendaberry » 2020-01-24 12:47

Given their record, we'll probably be looking at € 1.000,- upwards :-(

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by Animal » 2020-01-24 15:35

There's always a more expensive way.

Ansuz Acoustics PowerSwitch X-TC (Ansuz is a sub-brand from Danish speaker brand Børresen) for around 2000 euro's.
According to the guys at LowBeats.de it results in clearly better sound when compared to the Silent Angel Bonn N8 switch.
They have not yet tested the EtherRegen unfortunately.

BTW, this is Ansuz Acoustics entry-level switch and their top-of-the-line D-TC Supreme is around 12000 euro's.

Regards, Louis.

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by matthias » 2020-02-01 12:35

Regarding the EtherRegen there are very serious reports that all devices connected to the A-side sounds best.
Going across the ER from A to B or B to A seems to reduce the performance.

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Re: Ethernet regenerator

Post by donuk » 2020-02-01 14:08

Forgive me if you have noticed it already, but my recent thread about the Melco S100 could, I suppose, have gone in this thread. But if you have not read it, do, because it all adds to our body of knowledge.....

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