The Linnofil Super NAS!

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-22 23:26

jiddu_k wrote:Hi all,

decided to give "The Linnofil Super NAS" a try myself.
Great, fantastic news! Welcome aboard!

jiddu_k wrote:Like David Neel I was not able to get hold of the Deltaco SATA-1000 cables here (germany in my case) - so any help with that will be much appreciated.
I'll see what I can do. A solution should be possible. We can sort this out with PM's.

jiddu_k wrote:It may be that I ordered the gold series of Seasonic SS-460FL instead of the platinium series by accident. The gold series seem to be the previous model with the same name SS-460FL/SS-460FL2. Will this be a problem - or is anyone using the gold series as well?
I don't know if there is a difference. I will be a bit expensive to find out. If you can find a friend that want to build a L.S. NAS you can buy one of each and test them against each other. But be aware that the PSU takes some time to burn in.
jiddu_k wrote:As I will compare the 120GB Intel 320 series SSD to a 120GB Samsung 840 SSD first (in a small one-bay Nas and then probably in my NV+) there is still time to order a platinium one before I start.
Interesting, I can't imagine anything but a Intel victory. But the 840 (not pro) is new technology (triple level cell) so it could surprise. Please report back as soon as you know more. Since the Samsung can be used as a OS drive there is nothing to lose.

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Re: The first UK LSNAS!

Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-23 00:53

ThomasOK wrote:A question that David Neel had mirrored one I wanted to ask: whether it would be a good idea to put a ripping drive inside the Linnofil Super NAS. I gather from Linnofil's comment that this isn't the highest recommendation. I do have to wonder, however, if one could get close to the performance of an external CD ripping drive with something internal. I'm sure a number of customers would really love it if they could get the best NAS and the best ripping, or close to it, in one chassis.
I used to be hesitant to use an external rip drive. Since the external drives I had tested wasn't any good. One LG drive even swapped the left and right channels! But when I bought a new Samsung CD/DVD writer drive, a SE-224Q USB (2), I realised that was the best drive I yet had tried. It was also ripping very fast. I still have it and use it for ripping. By working with this drive, level surface, different rubber feet and turning the wall plug the right way, I got really good results, better than any interrnal drive I had tried. The 224 drives are still avaliable as an intenal drive: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-SATA-Re ... 009DF373A/

I do think that the L.S. NAS can be a good rip-PC. I have a feeling that moving files around makes them worse. So ripping directly to the intended location sounds very good. I think that what make a good NAS Is mostly the same thing that makes a good rip-PC.

I would still have an external drive. I think that the Plextor 950 can be a good compromise. It has USB3 as well as eSATA and should be as good as an internal drive when it comes to connectivity and have all the advantadges of a external drive. It can also be completely disconnected when not in use. The option to try two different interfaces and the possiblility of experimenting with power supplies makes it a very tempting option!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plextor-PX-B950 ... 0075D0RJE/

Having a DVD capable drive makes installing the L.S. NAS (or any PC) much easier! So if buying a new ripdrive is on the table for you builders, now is the time to do it.

ThomasOK wrote:I also think it would be a good idea to redress CD ripping as the quality of the rip certainly relates to getting the best out of the NAS.
I totally agree!
Last edited by Linnofil on 2013-01-23 09:27, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The first UK LSNAS!

Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-23 01:26

David Neel wrote:Linnofil, is your recommendation of an external drive based on better performance in ripping, or better performance from the SuperNAS because the CD drive doesn't affect it?
As Lejonklou mentioned, based on performance. The tweaking possibilities makes it easier to get more out of an external drive. But it's also nice that it can be completely disconnected when not in use.

David Neel wrote:How did you chose the Plextor 310, and how is it better? And can anybody else offer any suggestions?
This particular drive is untested. *sorry...* But all the tests done in Sweden indicates that the Plextor Blu Ray drives are the best for ripping. The readers have in some cases been better than the writers. I'm still very tempted by the 950 writer, as that have eSATA as well as USB3. The 310 is also cheaper at £107 than the 950 at £165.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plextor-PX-B310 ... 001J8V7CW/
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plextor-PX-B950 ... 0075D0RJE/

It's difficult to have a real rip drive shotout, since the PC and local conditions likely affect the result, as does the transfer of files over the internet. But me and a friend (also with a L.S. NAS) discussed that we should try that anyway. By sending a CD and a USB stick around to some of the NAS builders in Sweden. We all have different rip drives. One external and one internal Plextor BR, one external Plextor DVD and me with the external Samsung 224 DVD.)

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Re: The first UK LSNAS!

Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-23 01:30

David Neel wrote:Done!
David Neel wrote:Also done!
Your are one fast acting Brit, I like it! :-)

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Re: The first UK LSNAS!

Post by David Neel » 2013-01-23 21:54

Linnofil wrote:
David Neel wrote:Done!
David Neel wrote:Also done!
Your are one fast acting Brit, I like it! :-)
Maybe too fast acting? Anyway I've cancelled the ripping drive for the time being. I'll live with the existing rips while the other thread develops a bit, and see what ideas come forward.

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Post by k_numigl » 2013-01-24 09:39

jiddu_k wrote:It may be that I ordered the gold series of Seasonic SS-460FL instead of the platinium series by accident. The gold series seem to be the previous model with the same name SS-460FL/SS-460FL2. Will this be a problem - or is anyone using the gold series as well?
I don't know if there is a difference. I will be a bit expensive to find out. If you can find a friend that want to build a L.S. NAS you can buy one of each and test them against each other. But be aware that the PSU takes some time to burn in.
Is it really true that the swedish NASs are built with the 'platinum' version? this seems to be so new, that most dealers here still offer the 'gold' variant (differences in 80plus efficiencies, see '80plus' at wiki). At present, both types seem to be availalbe, but the 'gold' will soon run out and is not listed any longer at the manufacturer. It is not the same electrical design. The writing on the PSU case is either gold or silver (platinum), so its easy to see. If the swedish use the 'gold' variant, we should rush to get one.

An alternative case fot the miniITX mainboard could be Lian Li's Q08 and Q18, with the advantage that one 5,25 inch is available, too, for a CD/DVD drive.

As is perhaps evident, I find the described solution extremely interesting. I expect, that this system is good for any music application (as mentioned, I use FW recording and playing), as sensitivity against different HDD is similar (btw, my best conventional drive is a 2.5 inch Seagate ST9500325AS), and it seems only the PCI-to Ethernet resp. FW is what is different in the DS application.

BR, Klaus

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Post by Music Lover » 2013-01-24 12:13

k_numigl wrote:
jiddu_k wrote:It may be that I ordered the gold series of Seasonic SS-460FL instead of the platinium series by accident. The gold series seem to be the previous model with the same name SS-460FL/SS-460FL2. Will this be a problem - or is anyone using the gold series as well?
I don't know if there is a difference. I will be a bit expensive to find out. If you can find a friend that want to build a L.S. NAS you can buy one of each and test them against each other. But be aware that the PSU takes some time to burn in.
Is it really true that the swedish NASs are built with the 'platinum' version? this seems to be so new, that most dealers here still offer the 'gold' variant (differences in 80plus efficiencies, see '80plus' at wiki). At present, both types seem to be availalbe, but the 'gold' will soon run out and is not listed any longer at the manufacturer. It is not the same electrical design. The writing on the PSU case is either gold or silver (platinum), so its easy to see. If the swedish use the 'gold' variant, we should rush to get one.
Going to check my PSU late tonight!
This is the text on the invoice;
Seasonic PowerSupply (PSU) X-460FL 460W
It's all about musical understanding!

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Post by paolo » 2013-01-24 16:43

Hi Linnofil and all,
first of all thank you for your very detailed and informative reply to my message.

I've been quite busy these days but in the meantime I managed to purchase the ASUS motherboard which arrived today.

I've also bought a Samsung SH-224BB DVD drive which I'm very curious to compare to my best ripping drive at the moment (Sony/Optiarc AD7200 - latest 72X0 versions are not as good). I will report the results. Looking forward to hear more about Plextor external drives.

So now it's time to buy quickly all other items and start building. I'm going to take one 160GB Intel 320 SSD and for now use it both for O.S. and for music together with one 2TB Constellation ES.2. This seems quite a good deal if someone else is interested: http://www.ebay.it/itm/Intel-SSD-320-Se ... 2970wt_905.

Back soon, ciao!

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Post by k_numigl » 2013-01-24 17:09

Thanks for the link, Paolo. It is indeed a tempting offer. It was only the '8MB-bug' (obviously not cured to date) which pushed me to a vendor where I get a regular invoice. I'm starting with this disk and proceed later. The disk has to win against my Seagate 500 MB 2.5 inch first! I'm more than curious. BR Klaus

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Post by paolo » 2013-01-24 18:27

k_numigl wrote:Thanks for the link, Paolo. It is indeed a tempting offer. It was only the '8MB-bug' (obviously not cured to date) which pushed me to a vendor where I get a regular invoice.
Good point Klaus, I see Intel says they've fixed the bug with latest firmware but it's still occuring anyway. Anybody of you guys knows if it's been addressed?

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-24 20:18

paolo wrote:I'm going to take one 160GB Intel 320 SSD and for now use it both for O.S. and for music together with one 2TB Constellation ES.2.
Are you going to use the 320 for music replay and transfer files from the "music storage" ES.2 when you want to listen to it? I don't think that you will listen to any music from the HDD after testning the SSD. If you only have 160 GB of Intel 320, I would not "waste" it on OS and SW. My advice would be to buy a cheap small 64 GB SSD for the OS.

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Post by David Neel » 2013-01-24 21:07

Music Lover wrote:
k_numigl wrote:
I don't know if there is a difference. I will be a bit expensive to find out. If you can find a friend that want to build a L.S. NAS you can buy one of each and test them against each other. But be aware that the PSU takes some time to burn in.
Is it really true that the swedish NASs are built with the 'platinum' version? this seems to be so new, that most dealers here still offer the 'gold' variant (differences in 80plus efficiencies, see '80plus' at wiki). At present, both types seem to be availalbe, but the 'gold' will soon run out and is not listed any longer at the manufacturer. It is not the same electrical design. The writing on the PSU case is either gold or silver (platinum), so its easy to see. If the swedish use the 'gold' variant, we should rush to get one.
Going to check my PSU late tonight!
This is the text on the invoice;
Seasonic PowerSupply (PSU) X-460FL 460W
ML, I await your report with interest. My X-460FL arrived today. To order it, I had to ignore the majority of listings which were for the Gold version. Maybe I will need to send it back and get the Gold instead? Or is it the SS rather than the X which is critical?

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Post by Music Lover » 2013-01-24 21:50

Relax you have the same, I also have a Platinum PSU
It's all about musical understanding!

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Post by jiddu_k » 2013-01-24 22:49

Hi all,

today a Platinum Seasonic SS-460FL has been delivered instead of the accidently ordered Gold version. It seems that in spite of the (old/gold) description most stores have the Platinum version in stock.

The Intel SSD 120GB arrived yesterday and I had time to compare it to a Samsung 840 SSD 120GB in two simple SilverStone one-bay NAS. The Samsung SSD had been better than a Kingston V200 SSD 256GB when compared in the same one-bay NAS, but had not been as good as my ReadyNas NV+ (Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 1.5TB) placed on a special rack.
Listening to seven tracks (five CD rips and two 24/192 LP12 rips) it was very clear that the Intel SSD is the musically superior harddisc. The difference between the two drives was even bigger than I remember the difference between the Samsung and Kingston drive.
From a short test against the ReadyNas I´d say the Intel SSD in the one-bay NAS is just as good, if not slightly better. Will have to listen again to be sure.

@Linnophil:
Does it make a difference to the musical performance if another SSD is used as OS drive? If not, I might get a cheap one for that.

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Post by David Neel » 2013-01-24 22:50

Thanks, ML. Despite ordering a X-460FL Platinum, the box says SS-460FL, with the X designation in brackets. Anyway, I think I've got the right one!

Now I've got all the bits I need, except some cables which I should be able to get at the weekend, the CD drive and the OS SSD, both of which should arrive next week. So I will part build this Sunday, then complete it next weekend. The first UK SuperNAS is getting closer!

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 00:01

k_numigl wrote:Is it really true that the swedish NASs are built with the 'platinum' version?
At least three L.S. NAS'es in Sweden are built with the Platinum PSU. The Gold may still be better. Nobody knows until somebody tries it out. I have tested 10+ PSU's, bought 6 of them myself. So hopefully someone else can try that one out. But it really would be better to test something completely different (that also will be on sale for a while). I have been wanting to try the PicoPSU with a high quality 12v PSU (homemade?). I also would like to test the Silverstone Nightjar series.
k_numigl wrote:btw, my best conventional drive is a 2.5 inch Seagate ST9500325AS
Interesting! I have not tested many 2.5" drives. Would be fun to try this one. But with good SSD's, my apetite for HDD's are not that big. I may try this as a media drive for my kids TV.

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 00:12

paolo wrote:I see Intel says they've fixed the bug with latest firmware but it's still occuring anyway. Anybody of you guys knows if it's been addressed?
I don't know, but I don't see any alternative. I think the risk is something we have to live with. But it may be a reason to not have it as a OS drive.

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Post by paolo » 2013-01-25 00:13

Linnofil wrote: If you only have 160 GB of Intel 320, I would not "waste" it on OS and SW. My advice would be to buy a cheap small 64 GB SSD for the OS.
Thank you Linnofil. I've looked for a cheap 64GB among the ones you suggested in this thread (Samsung 830, 840 Pro and of course Intel 320) but it seems there's none costing less than around 80 euro. So probably buying the Intel 320 160GB @ 120 euros that I pointed to in my previuos message is a better deal. The only concern is 8MB bug. Should I use something more reliable at least for the O.S.? Any experience or suggestion about that?
jiddu_k wrote: today a Platinum Seasonic SS-460FL has been delivered instead of the accidently ordered Gold version. It seems that in spite of the (old/gold) description most stores have the Platinum version in stock.
Interesting....So it would be nice to know which is the best sounding version of the two. M.L. is using the Platinum version, what about Linnofil and the other Sweedish guys?

Good night!

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Post by paolo » 2013-01-25 00:21

You're much faster than I am Linnofil, while I was writing my message you had already posted replies to most of my qs.. :)
So thank you and good night again!

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 00:31

jiddu_k wrote:The Intel SSD 120GB arrived yesterday
...
it was very clear that the Intel SSD is the musically superior harddisc.
Told you so... ;-)

jiddu_k wrote:Does it make a difference to the musical performance if another SSD is used as OS drive? If not, I might get a cheap one for that.
I don't think so, but I can't know for sure. I have tested OS drives with a Crucial Real SSD300 vs. a Samsung 830 (that I have now). Despite having very different performance as FLAC drives I could not hear a difference. The Crucial is very bad for music (as bad as the Sandforce SF-2281 based drives) and the Samsung is decent for music. But I have not tested the Samsung 830 vs. a Intel 320 (for OS, they are only tested for FLAC). One Swede has a Intel 330 (Sandforce SF-2281 ) in his L.S. NAS as the OS drive. He is very happy with it.

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 00:52

paolo wrote:Thank you Linnofil. I've looked for a cheap 64GB among the ones you suggested in this thread (Samsung 830, 840 Pro and of course Intel 320) but it seems there's none costing less than around 80 euro.
Just get anything reasonably good. (Intel 330 60 GB?) A 64 SSD is about €70 in Sweden. Well worth it not to waste precious Intel 320 space.

paolo wrote:So probably buying the Intel 320 160GB @ 120 euros that I pointed to in my previuos message is a better deal.
I would get at least two! :-) (+a OS SSD)

paolo wrote:it would be nice to know which is the best sounding version of the two. M.L. is using the Platinum version, what about Linnofil and the other Sweedish guys?
I have the Platinum. I can't figure out the differennce between X or SS. The same?

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 01:01

paolo wrote:You're much faster than I am Linnofil
I'm working hard to keep everybody happy in this thread! I usually don't post this much here. But I feel I have to take some responsibility for my "creation". My wife is not superhappy with my new life in front of the PC. But I'm glad that my true music friends are. :-)

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Post by Linnofil » 2013-01-25 01:05

David Neel wrote:The first UK SuperNAS is getting closer!
Great stuff, we look forward to it!

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Post by Music Lover » 2013-01-25 07:11

Linnofil wrote: One Swede has a Intel 330 (Sandforce SF-2281 ) in his L.S. NAS as the OS drive. He is very happy with it.
And fyi, I have 4 * Intel 320 in my LS NAS.

jiddu_k nice that you also notice the Intel SSd performance
It's all about musical understanding!

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Post by Music Lover » 2013-01-25 07:13

Linnofil wrote:
David Neel wrote:The first UK SuperNAS is getting closer!
Great stuff, we look forward to it!
Me too!
It's all about musical understanding!

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