Claus

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-08-26 13:18

Hi, I am Claus, I am new to this forum.

I own a DS-I since beginning of this year and am very happy with it. Phantastic concept! Since I've heard some 242 I am looking for a used pair of them, but thats quite hard in Germany where I live. If there are any all of those are in maple :shock: I Don't like maple ...

Further I own some Audio Physic Spark 3 and an old Thorens 320 with OC9ML2 and Ortofon T30

Cheers Claus

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-08-26 18:34

Welcome Claus!

Yet to hear the DS-I but agree it's a great idea and I expect a great sounding product.

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-08-26 19:51

Welcome to the forum Claus!

Yes, DS-I is a smart product, but not good enough to drive a pair of 242's, in my opinion.

I wasn't completely happy with 242 until they were upgraded and I heard them driven by Klimax DS, Kontrol and Chakra Twin. At that moment, I realised what a potential that speaker has. But when driven by a Majik-I, I think the result is quite a tiresome sound.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-08-26 20:00

lejonklou wrote:when driven by a Majik-I, I think the result is quite a tiresome sound.

Was that pre-Dynamik Fredrik?

Claus, in case you don't already know, the latest version of 242 was implemented from s/n 1144285.

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-08-26 20:23

Charlie1 wrote:Was that pre-Dynamik Fredrik?

Yes, it was. Might work a bit better with a Dynamiked one.

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-08-26 20:35

lejonklou wrote:Welcome to the forum Claus!

Yes, DS-I is a smart product, but not good enough to drive a pair of 242's, in my opinion.

I've heard the 242 with a DS-I which was quite nice in the mid and treble, but the bass was not really precise and a bit boomy. This surely has to do with amplification. I know getting a 242 is going to lead either to a 2200 or activated with x100. I think I'll go the 2200 way giving me more potential for grading up in the future.

Thanks for the nice welcome :-)

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-08-26 20:39

Charlie1 wrote:[quote="lejonklou"
Claus, in case you don't already know, the latest version of 242 was implemented from s/n 1144285.

I already know, but thanks anyway :)

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-08-27 09:28

If you plan to upgrade the electronics, I agree that it can make sense getting the speakers you really want right away. Especially if you happen to find that rare second hand pair of maple 242's...

I can't remember having seen a pair in maple in real life, but a couple of times they've appeared on ebay etc. Maybe you'll just have to be patient.

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-08-27 09:37

lejonklou wrote:If you plan to upgrade the electronics, I agree that it can make sense getting the speakers you really want right away. Especially if you happen to find that rare second hand pair of maple 242's...

I can't remember having seen a pair in maple in real life, but a couple of times they've appeared on ebay etc. Maybe you'll just have to be patient.

No, sorry, the other way around, everything but maple is fine to me!!! 8)

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-08-27 11:38

Well that should make it easier! Black and cherry is what seems most popular.

Is it the other way around in Germany?

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-08-27 11:40

lejonklou wrote:Well that should make it easier! Black and cherry is what seems most popular.

Is it the other way around in Germany?

It seems so ... I've had light maple as my boys furniture, since then .. no way ;)

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-09-03 09:02

After lots of seesaw and listening to 242 as well as 212 I decided for a pair of Mk2 212 which are now placed in my living room :-) Beautifull rosenut ones, near mint condition :D

Bass is OK in my small room, not extremly deep but satisfying. Had not that much time to listen to them last night, but will do so the next days! Happy (for a while ;-) )

Cheers Claus

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-09-03 13:29

Interested in your decision making process if you don't mind sharing... 4200s/212s or KCT/242s are my aim (for one fine day) so just building up information that might come in useful for that time.

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-09-03 15:38

Hi Charlie,

I first listened to a pair of 242 mk1, I was very impressed, but a little disappointed of the bass. It was not really precise. This may have its reason that it was driven passively by a DS-I which I have. The bass was to boomy, an other reason is surely my room which is quite small (5,5m x 3,3m).

Then I listened the 212 in an other place which has the same charakteristik as the 242, just a much tighter/thinner bass. Having it at home I recognized, that the bass was OK for me, the rest anyway. I listen lots to Jazz and Classic Music, not so much to Rock, Electro.

This speaker is no bass monster as you may expect ;-)

But for acustic instruments just perfect! Great stage, very neutral, very precise!

Next step will surely be an other amplification (2200)but no hurry, and maybe activating later on. But for the moment I am happy with what I have.

Cheers Claus

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-09-03 19:55

clasch66 wrote:Hi Charlie,
Then I listened the 212 in an other place which has the same charakteristik as the 242, just a much tighter/thinner bass. Having it at home I recognized, that the bass was OK for me, the rest anyway. I listen lots to Jazz and Classic Music, not so much to Rock, Electro.

This speaker is no bass monster as you may expect ;-)

But for acustic instruments just perfect! Great stage, very neutral, very precise!

Next step will surely be an other amplification (2200)but no hurry, and maybe activating later on. But for the moment I am happy with what I have.

Thanks for your helpful response.

A friend of mine has 212s aktiv with a pair of 4200s and says they are very musical and give him the 'live' sound he enjoys so much with Jazz music.

Like you, the type of music does affect how much I miss deep bass in stand mounts. Jazz, classical, accoustic no problem, but rock music and some pop just isn't right. I hope 212s have just enough bass but somehow doubt it. Only a listen will tell now for sure of course.

Have a good weekend.

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-09-03 20:02

I'd say it depends on the room, Charlie. The 212 tend to sound a bit thin, but in some locations they really rock.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-09-03 20:35

Thanks Fredrik. You mentioned the importance of the room recently and I'd already forgot. From what you say, it should be the first consideration. Makes things tricky unless you home dem though. Is it more critical with small rooms though or no such firm rules apply? Any suggestions on the best way to go about things other than a home dem of course?

Post by **lejonklou** » 2010-09-03 23:29

In general, small rooms, especially when closed, amplify the bass and can make small speakers sound big. If the sound pressure escapes to other nearby rooms, I often find that speakers with bigger bass drivers are needed. Modern open architecture designs usually demand big speakers, because they need to drive all that open space.

I've installed Keltiks in tiny student rooms of 10 square meters with concrete walls all around. That becomes very powerful and impressive (and exact speaker placement is necessary to reduce booming tendencies). In giant rooms, speakers like Majik 140 and Ninka can sound like quite small.

The above is about bass and sound pressure, quality of reproduction isn't necessarily affected.

Music Lover · Post by **Music Lover** » 2010-09-04 06:21

lejonklou wrote:If you plan to upgrade the electronics, I agree that it can make sense getting the speakers you really want right away. Especially if you happen to find that rare second hand pair of maple 242's...

I can't remember having seen a pair in maple in real life

really?
I've seen many 242 pairs in maple, nothing to write home about, honestly. In early June Linn dealer P&S in gothenburg had a pair, not sure if they are sold now...
Prefer them in black myself.

Claus - FWIW, owned 212 active with C4200 and they were thin even with a 345sub (30m2). But I used active Keltik before...
I prefer big speakers as they are less dependent of room layout and size imho.
My music rooms have been tiny to huge (80m2) and speaker performance have been quite consistent. My present room is just 16m2 and big speakers are NOT creating bass issues if installed correctly.

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2010-09-05 16:23

Charlie and all. Have you had a chance to listen to some active ATCs? Charlie you've mentioned the need for low volume listening and the ATCs perform well at any level. Also the entire speaker system cost is in line with just the cost of Linn amps. And since you will be buying so much more music you might need to keep cost in mind.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2010-09-05 19:05

Thanks Salty. Yes, I must check them out before taking the next step, but that won't be anytime soon. Cheers for the reminder though.

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-09-19 14:14

Update after some weeks ...

I am still very impressed by the 212. In my room < 20 sqm the can really rock, no kidding :) But this really depends on the music. Of course music which is dependent on very low bass tunes are not the right thing.

But rocking is not my focus anyway. Jazz tunes and chamber music is so great, my cheeks hurt from smiling all the time 8)

But I was not myself, if I wouldn't look for further improvements :mrgreen:
Though "source first" would direct me towards an Akurate DS and a new preamp, my focus is "short term affordable first", which means first of all I am going to look for a bargain s/h 2200 power amp which could either replace the power amp section of my DS-I (fully passive) or complement to a semi active configuration with activ bass (DS-I) and passive 3K Array (2200). We'll see ...

I think a 2200 is no mistake at all no matter what the further steps will be ... what do you think?

Cheers Claus

optics · Post by **optics** » 2010-09-19 16:53

Hi Claus,

related to the 2200 i am not really sure, as you might know i am also searching for bargain akurate amps ;-)

It seems the price difference between 2200 and 4200 is not that large (€ 700,-), so maybe its a better move to go for a 4200.

Next step ADS (sell your DSi), next step preamp (Kikkin ?)

gruß

johannes

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-09-19 18:10

Hi Johannes,

Agree with the power amp, if a 4200 comes along which I can't resist who knows what happens :?

Besides my DS-I I have a turntable as well, so having no pre is not really an option.

Claus

clasch66 · Post by **clasch66** » 2010-10-11 09:55

As I found a bargain c2200 I just bought it and will now upgrade a Dynamik. For then this should last the next time until ... well let's see ... ;-)