My new system

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JSL
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My new system

Post by JSL »

Hello Folks!
It is with great pleasure and satisfaction that I can announce that I have upgraded my musical system with the enigmatic Lejonklou Sagatun Mono and Tundra Mono.
That is why I am now thinking of upgrading my DS player in order to get closer to my LP12.

I have discovered that the software in the DS player hasn't been getting any better - worse actually! ( and that's thanks to this forum)
This makes me wonder if it's the same with the hardware?
Does anyone know which KlimaxDS - new or used- would fit my system best?
Or - should one wait and pray for a Lejonklou DS?

All advice appreciated.

My system today contains:
LP12 Cirkus, Lingo2, Ekos II, Klyde,
LInto, - here we go again: I hope and pray for a Lejonklou MC riaa
Klimax renew ds/1
Sagatun mono
Tundra mono
Akudorik
K400 single wire 2,48m
Silver interconnect
Blue jeans cable cat 6a
Qnap 269 pro, MinimServer
Netgear GS108T-200
Last edited by JSL on 2016-05-03 12:31, edited 7 times in total.
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lejonklou
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Re: My new system

Post by lejonklou »

Very cool!

And looks great!
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Re: My new system

Post by Charlie1 »

Yes, very cool indeed. I really like the way you've arranged the system around the LP storage. Never seen that before - looks great.
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Re: My new system

Post by ThomasOK »

Congratulations! That should be a quite nice sounding system.

I haven't compared all the alternatives so I can't completely answer your question. However, I can give some help. The KDS/1 is a definite musical improvement over the original KDS. There are also Renew versions of the KDS/0 and KDS/1 (KRDS/0 and KRDS/1) and they are also excellent. I haven't compared a lot of these units but one KRDS/1 that I did the torque tuning on was actually very slightly more musical than a regular KDS/1 that had also been torqued. That same KRDS/1 was also easily more musical than my own KRDS/0 which had been fine tuned as well. Considering the price difference I consider a KRDS to be a very high value for the money and I can tell you that the KRDS/0 totally blew away the musicality of the ADS/0 that I had before it. With the KRDS/0 I can actually sit down and listen to music through it on my system and not feel like I am losing something. Of course, if I then put on a record of the same music the improvement is obvious, but the KRDS/0 is still really good.

I have heard of people who felt the KDS/2 was in some ways better and in other ways not as good as a KRDS/1 but I have no personal experience of this. Hopefully others can chime in with personal experience.
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

Thank you Thomas for your feedback!
It was actually exactly the answer I wanted to hear.
I'm really eager to find a KRDS due to the price and design.
I find the case better looking then the KDS- less "bling,bling"
But if the price is right I guess I could live with a KDS :)

Regards
Stefan
Last edited by JSL on 2016-04-23 21:21, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My new system

Post by stefan »

Cool guitar, Burns?
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Re: My new system

Post by jewa »

Nice looking system, and bet it sounds great as well. Where did you get the vinyl shelf, is it custom made?

Regards,
Jerry
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

stefan wrote:Cool guitar, Burns?
Hi Stefan - indeed it's a Burns.
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

jewa wrote:Nice looking system, and bet it sounds great as well. Where did you get the vinyl shelf, is it custom made?

Regards,
Jerry
Hi Jerry,
Yes, they are costum made.
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Re: My new system

Post by Ron The Mon »

JSL wrote: I am now thinking of upgrading my DS player in order to get closer to my LP12.

My system today contains:
LP12, Lingo [3?], Ekos II [SE?], Klyde, Majik pre-amp for RIAA...

Akurate DS/1 [with:]...
Blue jeans cable cat 6a
Qnap 269 pro,...
Netgear GS108T-200

...All advice appreciated.
JSL,
Interestingly, your Akurate streamer is of a higher caliber than your "Majik" level LP12!

I have several strategies to recommend. The first is not do any component upgrades at all. Your system looks really cool and every component you have is a who's-who of recommended items on this forum. However, your set-up is quite lacking and is holding back the capabilities of every component in your system except the speakers.

Think of it this way, your Akudoriks are on dedicated stands designed to extract their maximum performance. Yet every other component of yours is being held back substantially!

I'd suggest borrowing proper racks from your dealer and listening. When you hear with your own ears the improvement ahead of you, you can develop your own strategy for appearance and sound. An alternative is mount a quality wall mount shelf, ie. Quadraspire, above the shelf your LP12 is currently on. Try the LP12, the DS, your modem/switch/server, and Sagatuns (stacked) to hear the benefits. Source-first is king. You aren't even close to releasing the musical quality from your DS or LP12 as they currently stand.

What electrical strips are you using? Are you using the Lejonklou recommended plugged-in order on each one?

As to the Tundra Monos, what exactly are they sitting on? It looks like it is 1X6 pine boards on cinder blocks. Both Tundras on the same boards is bad. Cut two pieces of MDF roughly the same size as each Tundra and rest each Tundra on its' own board with a piece of fleece between the MDF and floor. Use fleece, not flannel, felt, or cotton. I'd also recommend putting the speaker wire on fleece vs. directly on the hard wood. This experiment will cost less than $20 and look smarter and more minimalistic. By the way, is your K400 2.48 meters?

As to your LP12, what tonearm do you really have? I don't recall seeing anything like it. It has a silver head-shell, silver arm-tube, yet black tracking force dial assembly? Not any EkosII I've seen! What is your LP12 bearing and chassis? What version Lingo?

Regardless of your answers, I'd recommend a black Akurate Radikal, Cirkus if you don't have it, Basik tone-arm, AT95E cartridge, and Slipsik6. You can sell/trade-in your Lingo, Ekos, Klyde, and Majik pre-amp and buy the above items for close to the same price. I own the above spec Radikal LP12 and it blows the socks off your version!!! You would also end up with the world's best MM phono stage and it matching your Sagatuns and Tundras; bonus!

In order for me to finance my Radikal, I was forced to "temporarily" downgrade my tone-arm and cartridge; I also ran a Klyde for a dozen plus years. It was very difficult for me to get my head around listening to a "cheap" moving magnet cartridge again; I went from Supex 900 to ASAK to Karma to Troika to Klyde since 1982ish. Get over it. An AT95E is awesome! I had a friend over last weekend who was in the hi-fi business for decades and was blown away that Spotify on my hi-fi sounded better than any streamer he's heard, and my lowly AT95E better than any moving-coil ever. Tune-dem is supreme, source-first is king, and set-up puts it all together. You need to stop spending money and start experimenting. You have a $45K hi-fi, yet I've put together hi-fis costing $5K which sound better.

You haven't asked but I'd recommend an Oppo 105D to improve your (huge TV) video (Blu-ray, Netflix, etc.). Use optical output from your TV. It is my experience that the Oppo sounds better than the Linn Akurate DS when you pay attention to source files, stands, and electrical. Oppo has improved the sound quality or their firmware over the past year, Linn has gone sideways or backwards.

Ron The Mon
Needle-Freak

P.S.
What ethernet cables have you compared your Blue Jeans to? How many Blue Jeans do you have and what are their lengths? Blue Jeans have been on my radar for some time, and I've been meaning to send them the cables I've found best sonically for them to test. I have found several cables I consider better than those recommended here. However, as I've mentioned, set-up/cable dressing is more important than the cables themselves.
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Re: My new system

Post by sunbeamgls »

Lovely looking system and room.

I would suggest a decent wall shelf for the turntable before any other changes, this will make a big difference. You could arrange it so that it looks like its just floating about your current furniture if that works for you.

As for the DS, given that you already have an ADS/1, then the KDS/0 or KRDS/0 will be merely a change and not an improvement. Aim for a KDS/1 or KDS/2 as an upgrade from where you are. I've never heard a KRDS/1 but it could be worth a try for less money.

Some of RTM's ideas on racks, isolation etc. are worth considering, amongst others along similar lines. But consider that the look of your room can be a very important factor in your ability to relax into your music. If you have racks you don't like and wires dangling about that you don't want to see, then maybe this is more annoying than a less then perfectly supported set of components. If you want to stay with your existing furniture, you can try some low cost changes like sorbothane pads under their feet or many other options.

Enjoy your music :)
KSH/0; KEBox/2; 3x Tundra Stereo 2.5; PMC fact.12. Blogger. Exakt Design. SO measuring.
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

Ron The Mon,

Thank you for all good advice!

First thing on my "to do list" is to build shelf that both makes the sound great and looks good.
What would be your opinion for material and also thickness of the shelf?
I think Hifi furniture looks really boring so that is no alternative before I've tried building my own.
Right now it's a temporary solutions.

Ron The Mon - you have the eyes of a hawk! - it's a EKOS II unvarnished. One of the two existing ones.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/axs918spzhabg ... .jpeg?dl=0

My LP12 is due to be upgrade, but it rocks the shirt out of the DS. It doesn't matter what kind of surface I have it on. Earlier I had both placed on a Qudraspire shelf.

I heard a lot of people recommend OPPO so guess I have to try that. Right now I am testing a Mac Mini.

Concerning the Networks cables - I have only compared them with some I bought in a computer store ( not a Hifi store ) and I don't remember the name of the cables. But so far I do think Blue Jeans has been far better than others that I have tried. I have several different lengths and I am going to see which length is best when I have arranged everything with the shelf.
Which cable do you find best?

I do appreciate you taking your time to comment on my post.
Regards Stefan
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Re: My new system

Post by magnuska »

Hi Stefan,

If you are in Sweden or close you should consider Harmonihyllan shelves.
I have tried building my own but they have never even come close to what a good rack can do for the
music.

Secondly- I have a NUC pc today with uptone regen and powersupply connected to a Didit 212 dac. Very good but
I am planning to go for ethernet streaming and have found this coming product from sonore in US.
As I have a DAC you can connect it directly with usb.

http://www.microrendu.sonore.us/


Regards Magnus
Sonore Mr streamer/Teddy Powersupply/Didit DAC 212/ Teddy PR/MB100 Rega P 3/Slipsik Klångedang T1
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Re: My new system

Post by matthias »

magnuska wrote: I am planning to go for ethernet streaming and have found this coming product from sonore in US.
As I have a DAC you can connect it directly with usb.
http://www.microrendu.sonore.us/
Regards Magnus
Hi Magnus,

yes, this RoonReady device is very interesting:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f26-s ... put-27389/

I am considering to buy it as well.

KR

Matt
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Re: My new system

Post by magnuska »

matthias wrote:
magnuska wrote: I am planning to go for ethernet streaming and have found this coming product from sonore in US.
As I have a DAC you can connect it directly with usb.
http://www.microrendu.sonore.us/
Regards Magnus
Hi Magnus,

yes, this RoonReady device is very interesting:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f26-s ... put-27389/

I am considering to buy it as well.

KR

Matt
Hi Matt, Great then I´m not alone.
Sonore Mr streamer/Teddy Powersupply/Didit DAC 212/ Teddy PR/MB100 Rega P 3/Slipsik Klångedang T1
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Fugly Tonearm

Post by Ron The Mon »

Image
JSL wrote: Ron The Mon - you have the eyes of a hawk! - it's a EKOS II unvarnished. One of the two existing ones.
Stefan,
That is one butt-ugly Ekos! However, I mean that in a kind way as it surely is a "form follows function" item and I would suspect it sounds better than a painted version.

Have you set the Klyde up yourself? I ask as it is a pet-peeve of mine when I see too long of screws used to mount a cartridge. First of all, I think yours looks a bit tacky and ruins the "form follows function" look of that tone-arm. Second, it sounds worse for no reason other than someone found it more expedient to use whatever was handy rather than the proper hardware. Or worse, the installer didn't know longer screws sound worse.

Longer screws add more mass to the furthest extension of the tone-arm making it not respond as quickly to groove modulation. It is the easiest way to remove mass without losing rigidity. Also, reducing steel screw mass means the counter-weight (weird unfinished brass [?] in your case!) ends up closer to the pivot point of the Ekos, which also allows it to respond in a more agile way to groove modulations.

Proper length screws can be bought for a few dollars. Wire cutters with a screw cutter built-in cost about 15 bucks. Or if you're as anal as me, you grind them to the perfect length and buff them smooth with a fine wire wheel. In your caliber hi-fi, you'll realize far more than $15 in musical improvement. Be advised this means all things being equal; excess screw length is far less important than proper set-up, alignment, or torques.

Ron The Mon
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Re: My new system

Post by beck »

To Ron: I really like your approach to your system. If you are up to it you could start a new tread (Rons system :-)) where you explain the things you have done to get the best out of your system (pictures would be nice) so we all can learn from your experience. This forum is all about "radikal" approach to get the best out of what we have at home. :-)
Playing cd’s…………
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Re: My new system

Post by stefan »

JSL's screws looks like the same as on my Klyde. I use the screws that came with it (bought s/h quite recently). I also have a 20yo Klyde in a drawer, the screws in that box are the very same length. Conclusion: this is the length that Linn supplied with the cartridge.
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Re: My new system

Post by beck »

Just changed my mounting screws for my Klyde to the shorter Rega standard screws losing 0.2 grams. It does make a difference. To be recommended!
Playing cd’s…………
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

Thank you Beck for a good tip

Regards
Stefan
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Re: My new system

Post by Ron The Mon »

beck wrote:Just changed my mounting screws for my Klyde to the shorter Rega standard screws losing 0.2 grams. It does make a difference. To be recommended!
beck,
As was posted prior to you, all Klydes came with longer than necessary screws for install in a Linn arm. This is not surprising as Linn has always made their cartridges "universal" for installations in other brand tone-arms. Like you, I also used "Rega" screws in comparison to my original "Linn" screws and they sounded better. The question becomes, "Is it better because of metal or weight or set-up differences.". There is no doubt to my answer but it needs to be made clear that I would rather have longer, over-weight screws properly torqued by Tom O'Keefe than shorter ones hand-tightened by me.

As I mentioned above, everything makes a difference to improving a hi-fi. However, attention to detail means it is important to assure all set-up remains exactly the same pre and post experiment.

Ron The Mon
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Re: My new system

Post by stefan »

JSL wrote:Thank you Beck for a good tip

Regards
Stefan
+1 thanks for the tip. I am a bit reluctant to change the screws myself though as I quite recently had Kore installed and everything is newly setup by the dealer. Right, I can visit him again. We'll see.
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Re: My new system

Post by JSL »

Hello people
I have just upgraded my Sagatun mono with Tarandus - what a joy! It feels like the system has become active, more understandable and with added dignity which is so good.
I have had several Linn systems before both passive, active and exakt but they have not been near this.
One wonder what will happen when one update Tundra - I am super excited to find out. But right now I'm enjoying the Sagatun update
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Re: My new system

Post by lejonklou »

Thank you JSL!

Reading things like this really makes my day.
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