Ferrites

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2011-02-02 15:49

IMHO removing the ferrite from the KDS is bigger improvement than adding dynamic to KK/1. Then ferrite removed from KK/1/D :D

No experience with Sneaky.

The ferrites clearly are filtering out music.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-02 16:17

And I presume this is not reversable?

I guess I could first try it out on my old non-Dynamik PSU for the KK. With 'some' of these performance claims, it should be better than the Dynamik (without mod). But then Fredrik found the Dynamik Exotik clearly worse so my motivation is borderline.

Salty, are you sure the mod to the KK was also more tuneful and not just better sound?...

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2011-02-02 18:21

Voices and piano are the easiest to know well as I hear both live most days. I am absolutely sure.

The ferrite can be put back, if it's removed as I described earlier in this thread. The only thing is the paper tag folded and glued on the cable is not undamaged. I did not bother trying to feed it through the ferrite.

No I did not check the tune after removing the paper tag, but before removing the ferrite :lol:

The "I don't want to get out of my chair because it sounds so enjoyable" test results are clear.

Better or worse? Better. Period. My ears, my system.

Post by **lejonklou** » 2011-02-02 19:09

Charlie1 wrote:But then Fredrik found the Dynamik Exotik clearly worse so my motivation is borderline.

I have also tried removing the ferrite on a Unidisk 1.1 with Dynamik. More noise and exaggerated dynamics, far less musical.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-02 19:16

Thanks Salty and Fredrik for prompt replies. I am still enjoying new KK Dynamik (40th Birthday present :D) , so will leave it for now, but am not ruling it out altogether. I would try the old PSU first though.

anthony · Post by **anthony** » 2011-02-02 20:43

My pet rabbit doesn't like ferrets.

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2011-02-02 21:56

Just to clarify. The KDS has always had a dynamik and has always been on 230V. The removal of the ferrite was similar to changing the KK/1 from 115V to 230V.

The dynamik upgrade to the KK/1 was not as big as either of the two changes above. Neither was the removal of the ferrite from the KK/1/D.

The best changes I made are KK to 230V and KDS to no ferrite. Both are clearly better.

KK/1 adding dynamik and removing ferrite would both benefit from a proper Tune Dem. I was not as sure about these changes as I was about the changes in the paragraph above.

I don't know how I can perform a proper Tune Dem of these changes. I am satisfied with keeping things as they are. If someone performs some actual Tune Dem testing of the KK, I will consider revisiting this issue, if the results differ from my setup. The KDS will remain as is in my system. The 230V is here to stay as well.

Tony Tune-age · Post by **Tony Tune-age** » 2011-02-03 15:02

anthony wrote:My pet rabbit doesn't like ferrets.

Most understandable indeed... 8)

Music Lover · Post by **Music Lover** » 2011-02-03 20:54

Charlie1 wrote:I guess I could first try it out on my old non-Dynamik PSU for the KK. With 'some' of these performance claims, it should be better than the Dynamik (without mod). But then Fredrik found the Dynamik Exotik clearly worse so my motivation is borderline.

Hi Charlie, great idea using the old PSU!
When do you think we can get feedback on the test?

Regarding Exotik and Unidisk 1.1 these were not Klimax units and also older designs so get on with it now

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-03 22:07

Music Lover wrote:Hi Charlie, great idea using the old PSU!
When do you think we can get feedback on the test?

Regarding Exotik and Unidisk 1.1 these were not Klimax units and also older designs so get on with it now

Oh man! - I've got two girls under 3 to deal with - I'm lucky to play one LP a day! I'll see what I can do but no promises.

What about you anyway? You must have an attic full of old hi-fi and Linn PSUs by now

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-04 00:22

I think it is external to the actual PSU (i.e. outside all the componets in the PSUs clear plastic tray). This is a KDS below, but must be similar to KK:

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/linn2/14.jpg

I am guessing it's the grey tube wrapped round the mains cable with white cable tie across the middle?

ThomasOK · Post by **ThomasOK** » 2011-02-04 00:24

Yep, that would be the ferrite!

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-04 00:26

Thanks Thomas. In that case my old PSU is of no help. I am enjoying the new Dynamik at the moment and am quite busy so will duck out for now. Maybe come back to it when I fancy a tweak and have time/motivation to try things.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-04 00:29

My mistake - Anthony was right after all...

ThomasOK · Post by **ThomasOK** » 2011-02-04 01:03

Charlie1 wrote:My mistake - Anthony was right after all...

You've got him cramped inside that little case? Oh no... :D

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-04 11:56

SaltyDog wrote:Just to clarify. The KDS has always had a dynamik and has always been on 230V. The removal of the ferrite was similar to changing the KK/1 from 115V to 230V.

The dynamik upgrade to the KK/1 was not as big as either of the two changes above. Neither was the removal of the ferrite from the KK/1/D.

The best changes I made are KK to 230V and KDS to no ferrite. Both are clearly better.

KK/1 adding dynamik and removing ferrite would both benefit from a proper Tune Dem. I was not as sure about these changes as I was about the changes in the paragraph above.

I don't know how I can perform a proper Tune Dem of these changes. I am satisfied with keeping things as they are. If someone performs some actual Tune Dem testing of the KK, I will consider revisiting this issue, if the results differ from my setup. The KDS will remain as is in my system. The 230V is here to stay as well.

Thanks Salty. I understand what you mean about making a change and it being obvious and seeing no point in checking with multiple Tune Dem's. Provided my system has remained static for a reasonable period, then if making just one change I can usually tell if it's more musical or not without needing to constantly go back and forth A-B dem'ing the two options.

Music Lover · Post by **Music Lover** » 2011-02-04 13:53

Salty and Charlie - what do you mean with "proper Tune Dem" and "multiple Tune Dem's"?
And why can't you do this when you remove the ferrite core?
What's the difference with comparing two preamps, speakers or DS firmwares?

I somehow have difficulties understanding the issue you obviously seems to have.

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2011-02-04 18:39

It's the minimum of thirty minutes it takes to do the change.

Are you thinking you can make evaluations with that much time lapse?

The easy ones are .......well, easy. The others not so much.

The tougher calls are more of a preference than an objective comparison.

I prefer my system in the first hour after dusk to the last hour before dusk. That does not mean there is a difference in Tune. It is a clear preference. The power cords running bunched with the interconnects being separated is a difference in Tune and Sound and Noise. The speakers moved is a difference in Tune. The hour after dusk is more enjoyable, but is not a difference in Tune, Sound or Noise.

It is not black and white when trying to sort grays. Some grays need to be placed side to side to be sure. But I can guess fairly well if the difference is big enough. I have limits and recognize them. Humans can differentiate between 128 shades of gray. I work with software that deals with 4055 shades of gray. How many shades of gray exist? I don't know. That's one of my limits.

I don't want to speak for Charlie, but I want people to know what my choices are based on. Close differences need to be evaluated with less time between auditions for me. Long time and close differences combined do not lend themselves to a clear cut objective comparison. How many degrees of Tunefulness? That's why I personally need back to back comparisons that are repeatable in order to make a statement. When I have an interesting observation I like share my opinion. I try to keep statements and opinions clear to those reading.

rowlandhills · Post by **rowlandhills** » 2011-02-04 19:10

Well stated SaltyDog. I know what you mean.

Tony Tune-age · Post by **Tony Tune-age** » 2011-02-04 19:56

rowlandhills wrote:Well stated SaltyDog. I know what you mean.

The same goes for me... 8) Perhaps each person has their own way of conducting an evaluation and "Tune-Dem" of audio components

SaltyDog · Post by **SaltyDog** » 2011-02-04 20:04

Rowland, Thank you. Coming from one that consistently offers great advise, especially in the bang for the buck categories, your opinion carries weight. I imagine you've helped many people getting a good step forward in this world of music reproduction. I have limited experience with the many different Linn components. Each of us contributing is what makes this so beneficial to so many.

I respect the policy and philosophy of this forum. Statements should be based on the Tune Method. Opinions are the spice. Knowing the difference is key. I think most of the regulars enjoy the sharing and the music.

Edit... Sorry Tony, you posted while I was posting. Did not want to leave you out of my thanks.

Charlie1 · Post by **Charlie1** » 2011-02-04 20:36

Music Lover wrote:Salty and Charlie - what do you mean with "proper Tune Dem" and "multiple Tune Dem's"?
And why can't you do this when you remove the ferrite core?
What's the difference with comparing two preamps, speakers or DS firmwares?

By 'multiple', I mean't A-B-A-B-A-B-A-B, and not just a single A-B and finished.

Like Salty, I would ordinarily struggle with a 30 minutes delay. Sometimes I struggle with a 30 seconds delay! As mentioned before, the only exception is if I've lived with the same setup a while. If that is the case then I think I can reliably tell if a single change is more or less musical no matter how long it takes to implement.

Tony Tune-age · Post by **Tony Tune-age** » 2011-02-04 21:01

SaltyDog wrote:Sorry Tony, you posted while I was posting. Did not want to leave you out of my thanks.

That's cool... 8) This is certainly one of the better audio forums, and in my opinion...it has great contributing members :!:

Post by **lejonklou** » 2011-02-04 23:42

I agree that 30 minutes can be a problem unless the differences are big. When tuning electronics (I spent 5 hours on a power amp today), I try to rig differences that are easily accessible by flipping a bunch of switches: Listen to A, switch off, flip switches, switch on and listen to B. The comparison is quick, but it often takes 30 minutes to properly rig A and B...

I made the ferrite comparisons with two separate power inlets. One with ferrite and the other without. And I checked that the inlets themselves didn't differ in sound quality (they did slightly, but the ferrite made a much bigger difference).

Post by **lejonklou** » 2011-02-04 23:45

SaltyDog wrote:Each of us contributing is what makes this so beneficial to so many.

Well said, Salty!

Ferrites

ferrite

Re: ferrite