Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

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DeQMaster
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Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DeQMaster »

Hi everyone, hope someone can point me in the right direction (its getting me grey hair simply by thinking on it)

I was enjoying some music when the bass vanished from my right speaker!

Tried all the combinations and im completely sure one of my early klimax crossovers developed a fault. When i start it from cold it runs ok for a pair of minutes or three, then the bass simply disappears in less than a second.

From eye inspection i cant see any leaky or domed capacitor.... I also think PSU is still ok as treble and mids are working ok.

Gentlemen, any input on the trouble?

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DeQMaster
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DeQMaster »

Answering myself. Maybe others can find this info useful.

Faulty CD12 power supply. Seems klimax crossovers use the same power supply as Linn CD12.

Nothing very tragic, only a fresh set of caps (i got some fabulous Elna Sicmil 2, the evolution of the ones that klimax tuneboxes came with from Linn´s factory, and i put them for both the PSU and the Crossover PCB). Once done, i was ready for rock again, no single capactior leaked so everything is still in pristine condition. Did the same procedure on my two klimax boxes and now im set to go for the years to come.

Not surprisingly at all, now i find the system more tuneful than before the surgery.

I think this is applicable to many of our hifi gear (PSUs, amplifiers...), so if you cant do it by yourself, maybe a friend or your hifi dealer can do the work for you. Remember, even if your music system is working perfectly, if it has some years now, refresh your caps before the leakage starts.

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DeQMaster
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DeQMaster »

Well, i has been a few days since the recapping of the Klimax KXOs.

The change isnt subtle, in fact i have had to reposition the speakers. The sound is much more vivid now, maybe something similar to what happend when i changed the Kairn for a modern Linn pre.

Outstanding.
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ThomasOK
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by ThomasOK »

It's good to hear that you got that sorted out. There is a lot of vintage gear that can benefit from a re-capping. The big problem can sometimes be getting ones as good as the originals. But with that sorted a musical benefit is often apparent.
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DavidDavies
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DavidDavies »

Hello, I have Ketlik Klimax crossovers which are now 20yrs old and although working sound very one dimensional.
I would imagine that re-capping might solve this problem . Do you know the part No. of the Elna Simlec II capacitors that you replaced the originals with? The values of my capacitors are 35v 100uf - 10 per unit
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lejonklou
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by lejonklou »

I've tried Silmic II caps, both in power supplies and in the signal path (filters etc). Not impressed at all.
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DavidDavies »

thanks for the response- any recommendations ?
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by lejonklou »

It depends on the circuit, so I'd try a lot of models in each and every position until I find the best one.

And as a general rule, I would avoid all models that are labeled "Audio".
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DavidDavies »

Thanks , I will try
Have also read your article on soldering, you have obviously spend a lot of time and effort researching this subject.
The Keltiks have linn soldered plugs at the speaker end - linn K400 cable- with unsoldered neutrik type connection into the Klimax amps , do you think it worthwhile soldering the cable ends prior plug fitting ? regards
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lejonklou
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by lejonklou »

DavidDavies wrote: 2020-12-21 17:50 Thanks , I will try
Have also read your article on soldering, you have obviously spend a lot of time and effort researching this subject.
The Keltiks have linn soldered plugs at the speaker end - linn K400 cable- with unsoldered neutrik type connection into the Klimax amps , do you think it worthwhile soldering the cable ends prior plug fitting ? regards
I'm unsure what you mean by soldering the cable ends prior plug fitting. When soldering either Knekt or Speakon connectors, there is no need to pre-tin the copper strands, if that's what you mean.
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DavidDavies »

Thanks for taking the time out to reply, I know that you must be extremely busy- that is exactly what I mean ie tinning the conductors prior to inserting and screwing into the socket of the speaktron plug-currently the wire ends are unsoldered- soldered Linn banana plugs at speaker end
I am new to your site and still finding my feet but today have found the discussions on optimum speaker wire length
K20/K400/K600 @2.85m- another variable parameter I had not considered -mine are as short as possible for cosmetic
reasons only @ 1.5 m regards
DeQMaster
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DeQMaster »

lejonklou wrote: 2020-12-19 19:59 I've tried Silmic II caps, both in power supplies and in the signal path (filters etc). Not impressed at all.
In my case it was a mean difference. Maybe, well surely, my old caps were already on its way out, already dried up or something and any other brand would have made the same revival effect on the sound. I have no idea. Anyway the reason why i have chosen those because the factory ones on the klimax boxes were the original Elna Silmik model, which is no longer available.
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Re: Keltik Klimax crossovers fault

Post by DavidDavies »

Hi Thanks to every one for their input, I have finally made a decision and replaced capacitors in both the power supply and the audio board these being as follows
Power supply - 6 x Panasonic EEUFR1V101- low ESR 0.056ohm @ 100Khz
audio circuit - 4 X Elna Silmic11-RFS-35v1015#5 ESR ?
To my great relief both units powered up and worked without issue and sound much better
The Silmic11 capacitors are larger than the originals ones ie 10mm Dia and 20mm high but although tight will fit in the audio board, no way will they fit in the power supply.
The circuits seem to be running cool as after 12hrs switched on the aluminium case still is cold to the touch above the capacitor positions - Low ESR ?
I did measure all capacitor prior to installation , on my meter the panasonic measuring 107Uf and Elna 113 Uf the range being approx 1/2 % on each make
I am a mechanical engineer not electronic but worked in the printed circuit board manufacturing industry for over 30yrs so have an understanding how the bare boards are manufactured - looking at the manufacturers logo on the boards I could well had some indirect input !
My Keltik speakers are non standard at the moment- this was part of my Journey to try and improve the sound.
Scan speak discovery Mids and Hiquphon ow1 tweeters - chosen as they are more or less straight replacements
for the linn units. The scan speak mounting hole PCD had to be modified slightly to fit - easily done with a round file and countersink bit . I do think at the moment these improved the performance and have no immediate plans to revert back
- but you never know !
After reading various articles I decided not to tin the speaker leads at the amplifier plug end.
Regards
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