The sound of LP12 plinths?

[ThomasOK]

Yes, but only thoughts, no hard and fast results from listening tests. I wasn't that impressed with the tap tone from the oak one I was able to test that way. I would guess that the most musical of current Linn plinths are likely the walnut and rosenut, which is stained walnut, but that is mostly a guess based on tap tones on a few plinths.

How they would compare to afromosia is a much larger question. In general afromosia plinths have not been the most musical in my experience, BUT. Seeing as I opened this can of worms I should clarify something here. While I did my testing by actual A/B comparisons with two otherwise virtually identical turntables the results can really only be considered rough guidelines. Wood is not a uniform or consistent material. Not only physical but also musical quality varies from piece to piece, as I'm sure any maker of acoustic musical instruments using wood is quite aware.

So a little story to illustrate this. One of my customers had two LP12s and paid me to drive out to Virginia for a week to set them up. He told me ahead of time that he had three plinths he had been playing around with, an afromosia, a movingui (my favorite plinth and what is on my main LP12) and a catalox. I had never heard of catalox before and thought it might be some composite but found out it is a wood and it had come from Chris Harban along with the movingui. He said he liked the afromosia best and didn't like the catalox at all as it had a very hard sound. I asked him if he had done a tap tone test on it. He said "Yes, and it sounds like a steel bar!" That certainly didn't sound hopeful. He wanted me to evaluate all three while I was there setting up both LP12s. When I did so I found that his particular movingui was OK but not great. It did not have the really good tap tone that I have found on most movingui. It was still good but more in the B or B+ class rather than an A. The catalox was indeed dreadful. But the afromosia had the best tap tone I have ever heard from an afromosio, which I generally find to be a bit dead sounding, and was clearly the most musical tap tone of his three plinths. So we used it on his primary LP12 and the movingui on his secondary one. The catalox he sold somewhere.

There is, however, an extenuating circumstance here. This customer was big into fine woodwork and his beautiful house had lots of it. He had gone to a fine woodworker he new and gave him the afromosia plinth. The instructions were to srtrip the finish and true all the surfaces, including the wood strips and blocks the top plate sits on, to very tight tolerances similar to what Chris used to do, then to refinish the plinth. I'm not sure how the refinishing was done but my guess was that it was not a spray lacquer like on factory plinths. So there are possible reasons, other than the specific pieces of wood, why this afromosia plinth was so good. Still it had to start with a good tap tone to have much hope.

Another note is that I have found the most musical plinths from Linn to have been the actual rosewood ones that were late enough to have the larger cross braces. These were only made for a few years. I got one from a customer that looked very faded and had some scratches so he replaced it. It was still straight and level and had a good tap tone so I sanded it down to find that the dull, faded quality was because of the aging of the lacquer and the scratches were all light, surface ones. So once I'd sanded it properly and had nice, smooth wood all around I used the same wiping varnish Chris Harban uses and applied 7 coats. The plinth ended up quite beautiful and with an even better tap tone - one I would place only slightly behind my movingui (which is the single best plinth I have heard) as an A- to A. Again, instrument makers are quite aware of this but the finish used also changes the sound and musicality. I believe the finish is one of the reasons for the sound quality of the Harban plinths, along with the wood used and the quality of construction. It is a real shame he doesn't make them any more.

I know, not a simple answer. But, really, when are they?

[Hermann]

I might be able to contribute something from memory. I quickly exchanged the Afromosia frame for one made of rosewood, initially not for reasons of sound. Interestingly, it turned out a little later that this one outperformed all the others. We compared the frames that were available at that time and tried to match the setup of different LP12s as closely as possible. Again and again the Rosewood turned out to be the better one. Tonarms were Ittok, later Ekos 2 and Aro, first Ortophon MC 20/30 pickups into Dayton Wright SPA preamp, then Troika, Karma and later Arkiv. Linn systems were connected to prefix powered from Naim 52 and later powered by Hicap and Supercap clone. I'm still convinced that the Rosewood is the best-sounding by the standards. However, that was a long time ago and I don't know to what extent today's frames sound with other woods. Almost 2 years ago, the (old) frame of my LP12 was exchanged, because after the conversion to Lingo 4 and Kandid, the dealer suddenly had quirks on the frame that were not there before. So the current rosewood frame is quite new.

The black frame was close to rosewood, but did not reach its musical quality. In order to better understand the difference, I built both arms on the black frame and I had the same result with both. Musically, Rosewood was better. Incidentally, the cherry wood frame performed worst in this test.

Unfortunately, I don't know the oak base. For me, the rosewood frame would be the safe side.

[Charlie1]

Thanks both. Interesting as always.

[Tendaberry]

@ThomasOK: Do you know if the current Linn walnut plinths are lacquered or just varnished? Mine doesn't look lacquered, but you never know...

[John]

Some things get better with age.

We all know this to be a fact with instruments. I’m sure this applies to solid hardwoods LP12 plinths as well. My Afromosia plinth is going on 36 years old. Will have to pull out my 1959 Gibson LG-1 and give it a strum.

https://theacousticguitarist.com/why-ac ... -with-age/

“All wood tends to lose a degree of moisture with age, resulting in a loss of mass, however wood also tends to increase its tensile strength relatively, despite the loss of moisture content.

Sap contained within also hardens over time contributing to the ‘stiffness’ of the timber further. This allows the guitar’s soundboard to be more resonant due to the loss of weight, while maintaining, or increasing its original strength.

Wood that has undergone structural changes over time is also less impacted by changes in humidity, resulting in a more consistent sounding guitar regardless of seasonal changes or in the case of the traveling guitarist, changes of environment.”

[ThomasOK]

@ThomasOK: Do you know if the current Linn walnut plinths are lacquered or just varnished? Mine doesn't look lacquered, but you never know...

I think it is lacquered although I'm not really sure of the finish used. But you are probably thinking of high-gloss when you mention the look of lacquer. While that is common, as on piano black finishes, lacquer can have a satin finish or even duller depending on the desired look. Lacquer is very commonly used in the finish of speaker cabinets, Hi-Fi furniture, etc. so my hunch was that the plinths were lacquered. Whatever finish they are using it is definitely a sprayed on one, not a hand rubbed finish like Chris did or I did on the rosewood plinth.

[ThomasOK]

Some things get better with age.

We all know this to be a fact with instruments. I’m sure this applies to solid hardwoods LP12 plinths as well. My Afromosia plinth is going on 36 years old. Will have to pull out my 1959 Gibson LG-1 and give it a strum.

https://theacousticguitarist.com/why-ac ... -with-age/

“All wood tends to lose a degree of moisture with age, resulting in a loss of mass, however wood also tends to increase its tensile strength relatively, despite the loss of moisture content.

Sap contained within also hardens over time contributing to the ‘stiffness’ of the timber further. This allows the guitar’s soundboard to be more resonant due to the loss of weight, while maintaining, or increasing its original strength.

Wood that has undergone structural changes over time is also less impacted by changes in humidity, resulting in a more consistent sounding guitar regardless of seasonal changes or in the case of the traveling guitarist, changes of environment.”

I have heard it said that wooden musical instruments also get better sounding the more they are played, as if the notes and harmonics cause a slight restructuring of the wood. Seems like a possibility to me. Imagine what 250+ years of burn-in does for a violin?

[Tendaberry]

But you are probably thinking of high-gloss when you mention the look of lacquer.

Actually I wasn't, but if my walnut plinth is actually coated with some kind of lacquer, it's very matte and very thin.

[Tony Tune-age]

Bedrok plinth vs. Booplinth

In addition to the Sondek LP12 Bedrok plinth, there is another one piece compressed laminated and machined wood plinth available on the market. It's called the Booplinth, and its been around for several years now. In fact, there might be a thread on this forum with additional information, but I haven't been able to locate it yet. However, its not nearly as costly as the Bedrok, and might be a possible alternative if somebody wanted a one piece machined LP12 plinth. Their website is posted below.



https://www.booplinth.com/

[Hermann]

Thanks Tony, I didn't know that until now.

But this statement makes me sit up and take notice, I don't hear any signal pollution with my Linn Plinth and am therefore wondering what pollution is supposed to be eliminated.

Booplinth is a “quieter” plinth with none of the signal pollution produced by traditional LP12 plinths.

https://www.booplinth.com/about/

[matthias]

There is a post from Thomas about the Booplinth:

https://www.lejonklou.com/forum/viewtop ... 318#p38318

"I have had a Booplinth here and did not find it to be a musical improvement. It wasn't bad but was less tuneful than a stock Linn plinth."

[Tony Tune-age]

There is a post from Thomas about the Booplinth:

https://www.lejonklou.com/forum/viewtop ... 318#p38318

"I have had a Booplinth here and did not find it to be a musical improvement. It wasn't bad but was less tuneful than a stock Linn plinth."

Thanks for posting matthias! I do remember there were different assessments regarding the Booplinth sound, and Thomas thought the Chris Harban plinths sounded better. However, it seems as if Chris doesn't make his LP12 plinths anymore and I'm not sure why that is...

Cheers

[Tony Tune-age]

Thanks Tony, I didn't know that until now.

But this statement makes me sit up and take notice, I don't hear any signal pollution with my Linn Plinth and am therefore wondering what pollution is supposed to be eliminated.

Booplinth is a “quieter” plinth with none of the signal pollution produced by traditional LP12 plinths.

https://www.booplinth.com/about/

Sometimes the differences between plinths may not be noticeable until they are directly compared. I certainly didn't notice any issues with my Linn Afrormosia wood plinth until Thomas made the comparison with a Movingui plinth. And that was an eye opener for me regarding wood plinths and their impact on playing recorded music. And of course each person can have their own perspective as well...

Cheers

[Hermann]

Thanks Matthias, I remember Tom's postimg.

I find it a bit strange to highlight your own product by devaluing another. There is no "evidence" for such a specific statement, I would say.