Linn versus Naim amps

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

Moderator: Staff

Arjen
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 431
Joined: 2021-06-10 13:23
Location: NL and Friesland

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Arjen »

Thank you Thomas,
My set is Naim gear stands upon each other, under SN2, NatTuner and on top Naim CD player. No sophisticated audiorack.
Slipsik apart on own shelf.
Individually I suppose Naim have good feet like Linn and Lejenklou devices. But placed on each other I was thinking of damping the vibration by the feet I named above.
As I’ m rather new here and a tuning junior I have a lot to experience and to learn. So any experience, comment is very welcome. And I will try for the best, with a more than little help from this forum.
I willmleave it now for the weekend, just enjoying music, now playing The Delines, The Imperial) and working repreduction performance out by more tuning after the weekend. Have a good weekend Thomas!
Lenco 76/S TJN, Dr. Fuss, Supernait2, CD5X, Slipsik7.1, Millon Phantom, Soundeck, AudioSensibility
Eli7
Active member
Active member
Posts: 145
Joined: 2020-05-24 18:22

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Eli7 »

donuk wrote: 2010-03-18 14:41
I note on other forums that it can be fashionable to insult Linn amplifiers. I think generally they are very good. They do not make music sound like hifi. If you are expecting a traditional hifi sound you may be disappointed.
What do you mean, Donuk?
Does that mean that the Linn devices are not able to play instruments with high fidelity?

What I notice - not only with Linn - is that the hi-fi systems don't seem to be able to reproduce instruments with correct sound colour. It took me a long time to realise that this is probably what is bothering me.

For me, it's not just about getting the melody right, the timing and the rhythm. Don't get me wrong, I think these things are very important. Linn and Lejonklou's Boazu and Slipsik, for example, do this very well. But what about the natural sound of the instruments? If it were only about melody, rhythm and timing, we would not need the many different instruments with their characteristic sound (colours).
Just recently, a young lady played me a few songs on her guitar in her flat. Wonderful music and what an unbelievable sound-colour richness of this instrument. When I hear a guitar through my Linn system, it's just a bad joke. I also recently had the pleasure of hearing a wide variety of piano pieces by great composers played beautifully by my ex-girlfriend on her very good electric piano. Yes, I could hear that there was no real piano being played and yet it was close. Unlike what my Linns and many other systems I often hear try to fool me into thinking is a piano.
My Olive Naims, which I once owned, could reproduce the typical timbres of instruments quite accurately. They weren't starkly coloured, screamingly gaudy or pale like all the stuff I've been hearing lately. They sounded real.
I remember going to a lot of classical concerts when I owned the Naims. What I kept thinking when I heard my Naims again was "great, they sound bloody real, they're so close"
I know this forum is about musicianship and you'll forgive me for going outside the rules of this forum with what I've said, but it had to come out. So, what I personally want is hi-fi in the form of natural sound reproduction of the instruments AND musicality. One without the other doesn't make it for me.
MDSM3 / Netgear GS 108T-200 / BJC Cat 6a / K200 (Lejonklou Cut K400) /
M140
FairPlayMotty
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 769
Joined: 2018-08-28 11:10
Location: Scotland

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by FairPlayMotty »

Eli7 wrote: 2021-08-22 18:44
donuk wrote: 2010-03-18 14:41
I note on other forums that it can be fashionable to insult Linn amplifiers. I think generally they are very good. They do not make music sound like hifi. If you are expecting a traditional hifi sound you may be disappointed.
What do you mean, Donuk?
Does that mean that the Linn devices are not able to play instruments with high fidelity?

What I notice - not only with Linn - is that the hi-fi systems don't seem to be able to reproduce instruments with correct sound colour. It took me a long time to realise that this is probably what is bothering me.

For me, it's not just about getting the melody right, the timing and the rhythm. Don't get me wrong, I think these things are very important. Linn and Lejonklou's Boazu and Slipsik, for example, do this very well. But what about the natural sound of the instruments? If it were only about melody, rhythm and timing, we would not need the many different instruments with their characteristic sound (colours).
Just recently, a young lady played me a few songs on her guitar in her flat. Wonderful music and what an unbelievable sound-colour richness of this instrument. When I hear a guitar through my Linn system, it's just a bad joke. I also recently had the pleasure of hearing a wide variety of piano pieces by great composers played beautifully by my ex-girlfriend on her very good electric piano. Yes, I could hear that there was no real piano being played and yet it was close. Unlike what my Linns and many other systems I often hear try to fool me into thinking is a piano.
My Olive Naims, which I once owned, could reproduce the typical timbres of instruments quite accurately. They weren't starkly coloured, screamingly gaudy or pale like all the stuff I've been hearing lately. They sounded real.
I remember going to a lot of classical concerts when I owned the Naims. What I kept thinking when I heard my Naims again was "great, they sound bloody real, they're so close"
I know this forum is about musicianship and you'll forgive me for going outside the rules of this forum with what I've said, but it had to come out. So, what I personally want is hi-fi in the form of natural sound reproduction of the instruments AND musicality. One without the other doesn't make it for me.
IMHO you can have old fashioned high fidelity and musicality. It took me a little while to realise HiFi is almost a term of abuse on here - I feel there must be a better form of words to describe what people dislike about the products of certain electronics manufacturers.
Everything is a remix: Copy, Transform, Combine.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Charlie1 »

Eli7 wrote: 2021-08-22 18:44 But what about the natural sound of the instruments? If it were only about melody, rhythm and timing, we would not need the many different instruments with their characteristic sound (colours).
Must admit Eli7 that I'm not really bothered about this element of replay, but I don't listen to much classical / acoustic music as my diet is mainly rock/pop/folk. It's a good point though. I've known a couple of Linn owners that need to strike a balance between the two. One was a classical guy.

And then there seem to be people that are solely driven by a need for the music to sound as lifelike as possible in terms of clarity, transparency, timbre, etc. Many seem to enjoy music too but don't really really know any well enough to be sure. I think it's important not to look down on them as audiophiles, although (like anyone) they can be very annoying when arrogantly expressing their views. Some really don't seem to hear musicality in any equipment and cling to science to justify pretty much anything. Maybe they can understand music so easily that most systems are musically good enough and all their focus shifts onto the audiophile side.

One common factor is that we all seem to be driven to improve whatever we are sensitive to - or is that stating the obvious!?
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Spannko »

FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-08-22 23:10. It took me a little while to realise HiFi is almost a term of abuse on here
Quite right Motley. I think it’s time we made a stand. So …..

“Hello. My names spannko. I’m an audiophile”

There, I’ve said it and ….. Wow! It feels so good to come out! I should have done it a long time ago! To be honest, despite my regular denials, my friends said they always knew. They say I’ve always talked like an audiophile, acted like an audiophile, even walked like an audiophile! And, best of all, they still love me, audiophile warts and all!
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Charlie1 »

I KNEW IT !!!

It was the thick light beige carpet that gave you away - all audiophiles have that carpet :D
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Spannko »

Charlie1 wrote: 2021-08-23 00:02
Eli7 wrote: 2021-08-22 18:44 But what about the natural sound of the instruments? If it were only about melody, rhythm and timing, we would not need the many different instruments with their characteristic sound (colours).
Must admit Eli7 that I'm not really bothered about this element of replay, but I don't listen to much classical / acoustic music as my diet is mainly rock/pop/folk. It's a good point though. I've known a couple of Linn owners that need to strike a balance between the two. One was a classical guy.

And then there seem to be people that are solely driven by a need for the music to sound as lifelike as possible in terms of clarity, transparency, timbre, etc. Many seem to enjoy music too but don't really really know any well enough to be sure. I think it's important not to look down on them as audiophiles, although (like anyone) they can be very annoying when arrogantly expressing their views. Some really don't seem to hear musicality in any equipment and cling to science to justify pretty much anything. Maybe they can understand music so easily that most systems are musically good enough and all their focus shifts onto the audiophile side.

One common factor is that we all seem to be driven to improve whatever we are sensitive to - or is that stating the obvious!?
To be honest, I’m quite partial to a bit of audiophilia. I’d much rather an instrument sound more like the real thing than not, but given the choice, musicality always comes first.

I once met a concert cellist who chose a pair of Quad 63’s over Isobariks to go with his LP12 + Naim 250 rig. He said that the 63’s were the only speaker which could reproduce the “sound” of a cello, even though he really appreciated the musical qualities of his turntable and amps.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Charlie1 »

Yep. I like clear well recorded music too. I just wouldn't recognise if the cello sounded right or not.
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Spannko »

Charlie1 wrote: 2021-08-23 14:25 I KNEW IT !!!

It was the thick light beige carpet that gave you away - all audiophiles have that carpet :D
Ha! Yes, beige is a bit of a give away!
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Spannko »

Charlie1 wrote: 2021-08-23 14:31 Yep. I like clear well recorded music too. I just wouldn't recognise if the cello sounded right or not.
Agreed. That’s a typical audiophile problem. Usually, we’ve no idea what something should sound like, so when it comes to the sound element I work on the principle that the sound only has to be good enough so that I’m not made aware of any deficiencies, whereas with musicality, it’s got to be right, no ifs or buts!
Arjen
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 431
Joined: 2021-06-10 13:23
Location: NL and Friesland

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Arjen »

Ah, the sound of the Cello. Playing the JSB’s Suite6 Sarabande by different Cellists (Queyras, Beschi on Naim CD5X, Viersen on vinyl Lenco 76/S Nagaoka MP300) result in 3 different sounding celli. As every cello have its own signature, every audio configuration has. Which configuration sound as the original is hard to say. But is that important? Is it sounds OK than it is OK.
But hearing the differences between instruments in let say a string quartet is obvious important as the chemistry between those intrument. If the interplay at the record at home gives the same thrill as at a live performance than it’s OK I think, no matter it sounds exactly the same or not, only probably when there is a significant bias between live and repro.
A couple of month ago I heard Maya Fridman playing live on a cello accompanied by her own cello via Goldmund Logos Satya speakers. I cant remember if the same cello sounded the same live and repro, but they performed fine together.
Lenco 76/S TJN, Dr. Fuss, Supernait2, CD5X, Slipsik7.1, Millon Phantom, Soundeck, AudioSensibility
Lego
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1147
Joined: 2007-04-18 11:42
Location: glasgow

Re: Linn versus Naim amps

Post by Lego »

FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-08-22 23:10
Eli7 wrote: 2021-08-22 18:44
donuk wrote: 2010-03-18 14:41
I note on other forums that it can be fashionable to insult Linn amplifiers. I think generally they are very good. They do not make music sound like hifi. If you are expecting a traditional hifi sound you may be disappointed.
What do you mean, Donuk?
Does that mean that the Linn devices are not able to play instruments with high fidelity?

What I notice - not only with Linn - is that the hi-fi systems don't seem to be able to reproduce instruments with correct sound colour. It took me a long time to realise that this is probably what is bothering me.

For me, it's not just about getting the melody right, the timing and the rhythm. Don't get me wrong, I think these things are very important. Linn and Lejonklou's Boazu and Slipsik, for example, do this very well. But what about the natural sound of the instruments? If it were only about melody, rhythm and timing, we would not need the many different instruments with their characteristic sound (colours).
Just recently, a young lady played me a few songs on her guitar in her flat. Wonderful music and what an unbelievable sound-colour richness of this instrument. When I hear a guitar through my Linn system, it's just a bad joke. I also recently had the pleasure of hearing a wide variety of piano pieces by great composers played beautifully by my ex-girlfriend on her very good electric piano. Yes, I could hear that there was no real piano being played and yet it was close. Unlike what my Linns and many other systems I often hear try to fool me into thinking is a piano.
My Olive Naims, which I once owned, could reproduce the typical timbres of instruments quite accurately. They weren't starkly coloured, screamingly gaudy or pale like all the stuff I've been hearing lately. They sounded real.
I remember going to a lot of classical concerts when I owned the Naims. What I kept thinking when I heard my Naims again was "great, they sound bloody real, they're so close"
I know this forum is about musicianship and you'll forgive me for going outside the rules of this forum with what I've said, but it had to come out. So, what I personally want is hi-fi in the form of natural sound reproduction of the instruments AND musicality. One without the other doesn't make it for me.
IMHO you can have old fashioned high fidelity and musicality. It took me a little while to realise HiFi is almost a term of abuse on here - I feel there must be a better form of words to describe what people dislike about the products of certain electronics manufacturers.
I think too hifi became a prominent description when Linn brought out their Lk1 Lk2 to describe the sound of Naim amplifiers, especially the Naim sound at the time .
I know that tune
Post Reply