JBL 308P and 708P

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tokenbrit
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tokenbrit »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 15:52 Well, can't help looking forward to the 212s no matter what the JBLs are doing.

.. I don't have an issue using a cheap interconnect between pre and power amp. I have some here that don't sound as good as Linn ones but not the end of the world and music is still engaging.

I think the JBLs sound very good now but you're right, they're not compelling. I wonder if I'm trying to walk with a foot on two paths and the result is not pleasing to anyone. There are some people that don't like JBLs in any clips cos it's just not their thing, and many folks will not like my early 90s pre-Cirkus LP12 compared to a modern deck.
I meant looking forward to the 212s as in giving up on the 308s - glad you're pursuing both :)

Cheap interconnects aren't 3m long, and those Amazon jobbies may not make it up to the level of "some" ;)

Yes, the JBLs are sounding better, but they're still in the way of the music - my experience is with the 3677s, but they are compelling in the sense that they just let the music through especially when everything upstream is improved, whether digital in my case, or analogue in yours. My point is, it's not in the manner of JBLs* themselves to get in the way, so something else must be holding them back** - the 104s & Tukans are doing (a bit) more with what they're getting, so it's not your source & amp(s). That just leaves dialing in the setup & feeding them right - with forum ears on standby to help with your next round of clips :D


* those recommended on this forum
** unless you got a 'bad' pair :/

PS I've been curious about getting LSR 308s myself, so I'm grateful to you for sharing your experience, and interested to hear what you can get out of them...
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

I guess you're assuming K104/Tukans should be more than just a 'bit' better. I do not share that assumption although you could be right. I will pursue positioning but if that doesn't make them become compelling then I think this will remain unclear unless I get a cable. If I love the 212s then I doubt I'll invest in a Linn cable. If I don't then I probably will.

They came with different mains cables so I assumed the previous owner had changed one or both of them. Therefore, I used 1990s Linn cables. I've switched to 2000+ Linn cables which seem a bit better.
tokenbrit wrote: 2023-03-03 16:51 PS I've been curious about getting LSR 308s myself, so I'm grateful to you for sharing your experience, and interested to hear what you can get out of them...
You're always welcome!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tokenbrit »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 18:31 I guess you're assuming K104/Tukans should be more than just a 'bit' better. I do not share that assumption...
tokenbrit wrote: 2023-03-03 16:51 PS I've been curious about getting LSR 308s myself, so I'm grateful to you for sharing your experience, and interested to hear what you can get out of them...
You're always welcome!
If anything, it was the opposite assumption: that the 308s should be significantly better than the K104/Tukans. The bit better was to indicate there's music in there trying to get out... I'd expect the 308s to do a better job of showing that, & showing a clean pair of terminals to either of the Linns.

Glad you're making headway.

Cheers!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

tokenbrit wrote: 2023-03-03 19:33 If anything, it was the opposite assumption: that the 308s should be significantly better than the K104/Tukans.
That's what I meant, but said the opposite :D

Better? I think it is.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9grlco8eud8v ... 3.mp4?dl=0

Something else:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/18krwhp2u72uz ... 1.mp4?dl=0
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 10:38 I moved them further apart so they're about 130cm apart now and I think that's an improvement. I tried further out but they sounded worse to me.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hy2p3j1kc47x8 ... 0.mp4?dl=0

The recording is also a bit louder this time so a better volume match to the k104s.

I take your point about the cabling.
That's definitely an improvement! This clip sounds better than the one with the speakers at 25cm. Can you get them any closer to the wall? There might be another sweet spot 1 or 2 cm closer. IME moving them ~2-2.5cm closer was a massive improvement.

Are the cables you're currently using terminated with XLR or TRS at the speaker end? Someone who tried both (Jajo, IIRC) found XLR musically superior.

Does the Majik-i have a pre out/main in loop? If so it should be possible to use just the preamp section with the JBLs and level the playing field a bit with the Tukans (or 212s in the near future).
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tpetsch »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 19:45
tokenbrit wrote: 2023-03-03 19:33 If anything, it was the opposite assumption: that the 308s should be significantly better than the K104/Tukans.
That's what I meant, but said the opposite :D

Better? I think it is.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9grlco8eud8v ... 3.mp4?dl=0
"Sounds" better yes but the musical disconnection between singer and guitar is hard for me to ignore.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tokenbrit »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 19:45
Better? I think it is.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9grlco8eud8v ... 3.mp4?dl=0
Getting closer to Tupelo; finding some soul :)
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-03 19:45
tokenbrit wrote: 2023-03-03 19:33 If anything, it was the opposite assumption: that the 308s should be significantly better than the K104/Tukans.
That's what I meant, but said the opposite :D

Better? I think it is.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9grlco8eud8v ... 3.mp4?dl=0
Progress!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

markiteight wrote: 2023-03-03 19:56 That's definitely an improvement! This clip sounds better than the one with the speakers at 25cm. Can you get them any closer to the wall? There might be another sweet spot 1 or 2 cm closer. IME moving them ~2-2.5cm closer was a massive improvement.

Are the cables you're currently using terminated with XLR or TRS at the speaker end? Someone who tried both (Jajo, IIRC) found XLR musically superior.

Does the Majik-i have a pre out/main in loop? If so it should be possible to use just the preamp section with the JBLs and level the playing field a bit with the Tukans (or 212s in the near future).
Thanks for listening.

The latest list was 24cm from the rear wall. I also tried 23 and earlier tried further out.

The cable is RCA-to-XLR.

I did look the other week and I can't use the Majik-i as a pre-amp only, or at least that's how I read it.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

markiteight wrote: 2023-03-03 19:56 That's definitely an improvement! This clip sounds better than the one with the speakers at 25cm. Can you get them any closer to the wall? There might be another sweet spot 1 or 2 cm closer. IME moving them ~2-2.5cm closer was a massive improvement.

Are the cables you're currently using terminated with XLR or TRS at the speaker end? Someone who tried both (Jajo, IIRC) found XLR musically superior.

Does the Majik-i have a pre out/main in loop? If so it should be possible to use just the preamp section with the JBLs and level the playing field a bit with the Tukans (or 212s in the near future).
Thanks for listening.

The latest list was 24cm from the rear wall. I also tried 23 and earlier tried further out.

The cable is RCA-to-XLR.

I did look the other week and I can't use the Majik-i as a pre-amp only, or at least that's how I read it.
tpetsch wrote: 2023-03-03 20:12 "Sounds" better yes but the musical disconnection between singer and guitar is hard for me to ignore.
I know what you mean.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 00:42 Thanks for listening.
You're welcome!
Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 00:42 The latest list was 24cm from the rear wall. I also tried 23 and earlier tried further out.
I meant closer to the wall than what's shown in your JBL vs. K104/Tukan clips. I'm just curious if getting them right close to the wall helps, as it did in my situation.
Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 00:42 I did look the other week and I can't use the Majik-i as a pre-amp only, or at least that's how I read it.
This piqued my curiosity so I looked up the manual on LinnDocs and it appears you should be able to grab the pre-out before the amplifier. Have a look at item #3:

Image

"ANALOGUE OUTPUTS (RCA, variable level) - To connect to a power amplifier with unbalanced (RCA) inputs." Does yours have that?
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Defender »

its interesting that with this loudspeaker some things are slightly different than usual with respect to positioning. To my knowledge most of other speakers tend to have a limited variety with respect to where they sound best with respect to distance from the wall.

Markiteight has them around 7-8 cm away from the wall
I have mine around 10cm from the wall
Fredrik at around 17cm from the wall
Charlie1 is now at 23cm from the wall

are there some sweet spot which are not the sweetest spot? or does the speaker react to many things (too) sensible that it overshadows other things.

It might be that moving the speaker does not only change one variable as the connection of the spikes to the ground might be also different … as floors are seldom 100 plano.

So working with care is necessary.

In that respect I find it helpfull to have at least some information how they are positioned from others but please correct me if I am wrong.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

I'm sorry gents, especially after all your comments and advise, but the JBLs are just not for me.

Underdriven by an LK140, still very cold from transport, plonked on stands without any positioning, and the 212s are so much more to my liking. I instantly relax as they bring the instruments together. And they also play a wide range of era LPs better than my other speakers (except JBLs)I know the JBLs were not setup as well as they could and not using a Linn interconnect but I have no further interest in them. I know that's a bit blunt but I know what I'm like with these things.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by matthias »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 12:47 212s are so much more to my liking
Enjoy them, curious about the first clips :-)
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

matthias wrote: 2023-03-04 12:53
Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 12:47 212s are so much more to my liking
Enjoy them, curious about the first clips :-)
You must be sick of this song by now - stands still in last JBL positions...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6ucek09zp8zg4 ... 0.mp4?dl=0

Thanks Mi8 and Defender for your last comments and sorry they were to no avail.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Defender »

I wish you all the best with your new loudspeakers - in the end what counts is what makes you happy. I think your journey at least pushed me to try other positions in the room to even further improve performance. I understand your move as I was also about to throw the towel…but I am happy that I didnt.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

Thanks Defender! Glad it was useful.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by beck »

To me hifi is like tuning a piano. You can do it in many different ways ending up with many different results. None of them are perfect. That is why in the end we have to make a very personal decision.

I hope your choice charlie1 will make you happy. If not, we will still be here ready for new clips with different speakers. It is a plessure to listen to your clips whatever you come up with. :-)
Playing cd’s…………
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 12:47 I'm sorry gents, especially after all your comments and advise, but the JBLs are just not for me.
No worries, Charlie1! I wish you best of luck on your search and I hope you continue to bring us along for the ride!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 13:23 You must be sick of this song by now - stands still in last JBL positions...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6ucek09zp8zg4 ... 0.mp4?dl=0
I prefer your last clip of the 308s*, but like you said they aren't set up yet.
Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-04 13:23 Thanks Mi8 and Defender for your last comments and sorry they were to no avail.
No apologies necessary! A failure is only a failure if we don't learn something from it, and I found your exploration of the 308s, and the discussion it fueled, quite educational. Besides, for all their musical prowess the 308s are quite polarizing (though not as much as the 708s).


* There might be a bit of bias there. I'm curious what others think.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Charlie1 »

Thanks beck and Mi8

The patience and understanding of this forum really makes it unique and a pleasure to be part of.

212s are not perfect of course but they are my kind of imperfection 😀
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by El Mero Mero »

Charlie1 wrote: 2023-03-05 01:16 212s are not perfect of course but they are my kind of imperfection 😀
Sounds good. Enjoy!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by bonzo »

Well, patience has paid off and I’ve finally located and purchased a pair of 708p in great shape at a decent price. I think (am also hopin) this will be the last speaker I ever want. Just soo many greats things have been said about these with absolutely minimal negative remarks. Eta 3-4 days!!
lp12, Keel, K Radikal, Urika, EkosSe/1 Kandid KK1/D, JBL 708p
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Defender »

I for sure look forward to your report - did you got a new pair or a used one?
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by bonzo »

They are not new.
lp12, Keel, K Radikal, Urika, EkosSe/1 Kandid KK1/D, JBL 708p
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