matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 12:03

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 11:54 For those of us at Akurate spending levels, this statement on the Linn website may be of concern:

"Next-generation Klimax DSM completes the Linn DSM family line-up of Klimax DSM, Selekt DSM and Majik DSM"

Yes, I am sure they will ditch the Akurate line.

Matt

With Selekt offering a Katalyst option, it fits well into the range. I suspect Selekt format modular Exaktboxes and power amps along with the demise of Akurate.

I have just seen that Klimax and Selekt have the same width and depth and nearly the same height.
Bravo, from a marketing POV.

Matt

A Selekt Radikal?

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 13:35 I have just seen that Klimax and Selekt have the same width and depth and nearly the same height.
Bravo, from a marketing POV.

Matt

thats why I called the new line Klimax Selekt DS ;)
and I dont think its bravo for marketing because there is not enough differentiation visible for the price difference.

Defender wrote: ↑2021-03-27 13:53

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 13:35 I have just seen that Klimax and Selekt have the same width and depth and nearly the same height.
Bravo, from a marketing POV.

Matt

thats why I called the new line Klimax Selekt DS ;)
and I dont think its bravo for marketing because there is not enough differentiation visible for the price difference.

The Bravo is ironic :-)

Matt

Am I right that it is the first Klimax with USB (audio) input?
Thanks

Matt

The Bravo is ironic :-)

Matt

I thought so but was not sure. ;)

Same area is likely to enable to combine (acc to wallet size) both with Selekt or Klimax exakt boxes and quite possibly coming dito amps. Without making it look terrible in the rack.

cortina wrote: ↑2021-03-27 14:52 Same area is likely to enable to combine (acc to wallet size) both with Selekt or Klimax exakt boxes and quite possibly coming dito amps. Without making it look terrible in the rack.

And when the next DAC architecture is launched the Organik boards can find their resting place in the Selekt...

Matt

I hope the new Klimax DSM sounds fantastic and that it is great success for Linn.

I do however hope that Linn continue to provide a high quality streamer between Selekt (£6000) and the new Klimax DSM (£30000) a role currently filled with KDS3 and the old KDSM at around £17000.

Otherwise they risk losing customers to the likes of Vitus and dCS whose high end streamers start at these levels; and once you lose the customer, in my opinion they are unlikely to come back .

The Vitus RD101 and dCS Bartok at around £11,000?look like very good value compared to the the new Linn Flagship.

ThomasOK wrote: ↑2021-03-26 22:54

springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-26 22:26

macrotech2 wrote: ↑2021-03-26 19:00 Who are they targeting to buy this?

Maybe they will sell more upgrades than new Klimax DSM.

What upgrades? it appears there will be no upgrades to current Klimax DSM, instead a trade in program for your old one. There are upgrades for the K350a and the Klimax Exaktbox crossover, but not the KDS or KDSM.

I need to correct myself on this. I received a phone call while Linn were doing a pre-recorded Q&A session with a few dealers and missed a couple of parts. Gilad stated that the KDS/M would still be in the line and would continue to be supported by Linn. They are still on the price list. That included Organik upgrades for them which they hope will be ready in 12 to 18 months but said the timing wasn't guaranteed as you never know what difficulties could come up. But that is the goal. Organik upgrades for the Selekt were hoped for in 24 months.

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 13:05

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 12:03

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 11:54 For those of us at Akurate spending levels, this statement on the Linn website may be of concern:

"Next-generation Klimax DSM completes the Linn DSM family line-up of Klimax DSM, Selekt DSM and Majik DSM"

Yes, I am sure they will ditch the Akurate line.

Matt

With Selekt offering a Katalyst option, it fits well into the range. I suspect Selekt format modular Exaktboxes and power amps along with the demise of Akurate.

Selekt will be upgraded to Organik as well with perfromance better than Akurate. So I would say Akurate is probably on life support. But I do wonder whether they will restyle the Akurate ExaktBoxes or just rename them? After all the Akurate ExaktBox-I was the Majik ExaktBox-I, initially with no changes, so why not change the front to say Selekt ExaktBox-I. It would fit in with Gilad saying they will keep the Klimax Radikal, ExaktBox, Solos, etc. in the original boxes as the source is meant for display so it can look different.

ThomasOK wrote: ↑2021-03-27 22:57

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 13:05

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 12:03

Yes, I am sure they will ditch the Akurate line.

Matt

With Selekt offering a Katalyst option, it fits well into the range. I suspect Selekt format modular Exaktboxes and power amps along with the demise of Akurate.

Selekt will be upgraded to Organik as well with perfromance better than Akurate. So I would say Akurate is probably on life support. But I do wonder whether they will restyle the Akurate ExaktBoxes or just rename them? After all the Akurate ExaktBox-I was the Majik ExaktBox-I, initially with no changes, so why not change the front to say Selekt ExaktBox-I. It would fit in with Gilad saying they will keep the Klimax Radikal, ExaktBox, Solos, etc. in the original boxes as the source is meant for display so it can look different.

Possibly, but I would expect the name "Selekt" would only be appropriate on a modular solution, that seems to be its USP.
Is the news on Organik for Selekt speculation Thomas, of confirmed please?

The podcast was more informative than the webinar (thanks Sunbeam). They made it obvious they think digital is more accurate than analogue. And digital is clearly their intended future. But the Organik has huge competition as a DAC and lots of that competition is cheaper.

The button on the new box is rather oddly situated - the LK boxes could be stacked. Paying 30K takes that option away.

They're going to need more than hype longer term.

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-27 22:28 I hope the new Klimax DSM sounds fantastic and that it is great success for Linn.

I do however hope that Linn continue to provide a high quality streamer between Selekt (£6000) and the new Klimax DSM (£30000) a role currently filled with KDS3 and the old KDSM at around £17000.

Otherwise they risk losing customers to the likes of Vitus and dCS whose high end streamers start at these levels; and once you lose the customer, in my opinion they are unlikely to come back .

The Vitus RD101 and dCS Bartok at around £11,000?look like very good value compared to the the new Linn Flagship.

They’ve already lost me to Vitus. The RD101 crucified the KDS3 and that’s the Vitus entry-level. I’d be very interested to hear the new Klimax to compare but at 30k?

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-27 22:28 I hope the new Klimax DSM sounds fantastic and that it is great success for Linn.

I do however hope that Linn continue to provide a high quality streamer between Selekt (£6000) and the new Klimax DSM (£30000) a role currently filled with KDS3 and the old KDSM at around £17000.

Otherwise they risk losing customers to the likes of Vitus and dCS whose high end streamers start at these levels; and once you lose the customer, in my opinion they are unlikely to come back .

The Vitus RD101 and dCS Bartok at around £11,000?look like very good value compared to the the new Linn Flagship.

The original kdsm will continue at its RRP of £15800, When it receives the organik upgrade I expect it will increase to above £20000.
I heard a top DCS against the latest KDSM, it was a bit more natural sounding but not as musical.

FairPlayMotty wrote: ↑2021-03-27 23:19 The podcast was more informative than the webinar (thanks Sunbeam). They made it obvious they think digital is more accurate than analogue. And digital is clearly their intended future. But the Organik has huge competition as a DAC and lots of that competition is cheaper.

The button on the new box is rather oddly situated - the LK boxes could be stacked. Paying 30K takes that option away.

They're going to need more than hype longer term.

Linn is in a difficult situation - they have top sources in both domains (digital/analogue) so whatever they say will hurt the other line. I think digital is more popular for the comfort and convenience and the music industry can resell the same material in different formats over and over with not much additional cost. So the music industry will drive digital with marketing power.
Linn said many things in the last 10-15 years some of it was just marketing BS or inability to make the analoge pre better. So I take those statements with a grain of salt.
I have yet to hear a digital system or an digital volume control which convinces me.

anthony wrote: ↑2021-03-28 01:38

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-27 22:28 I hope the new Klimax DSM sounds fantastic and that it is great success for Linn.

I do however hope that Linn continue to provide a high quality streamer between Selekt (£6000) and the new Klimax DSM (£30000) a role currently filled with KDS3 and the old KDSM at around £17000.

Otherwise they risk losing customers to the likes of Vitus and dCS whose high end streamers start at these levels; and once you lose the customer, in my opinion they are unlikely to come back .

The Vitus RD101 and dCS Bartok at around £11,000?look like very good value compared to the the new Linn Flagship.

The original kdsm will continue at its RRP of £15800, When it receives the organik upgrade I expect it will increase to above £20000.
I heard a top DCS against the latest KDSM, it was a bit more natural sounding but not as musical.

Thanks - good to know that the original KDSM stays although ‘above £20,000 ‘ sounds quite steep and still leaves a chasm between it and Selekt.

If Linn do not offer it’s organic board for the KDS for not much more than the current upgrade cost from KDS/2 to Katalyst ( around £3800) I feel it will be time for me to look at Vitus/DCS alternatives.

That would be a shame as I would really like to support Linn which has always provided top class products and excellent support over the years and allowed me to discover and listen to really good music.

Let’s see where we are with the Original KDS/KDSM upgrades if and when they are released.

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-28 12:07

anthony wrote: ↑2021-03-28 01:38

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-27 22:28 I hope the new Klimax DSM sounds fantastic and that it is great success for Linn.

I do however hope that Linn continue to provide a high quality streamer between Selekt (£6000) and the new Klimax DSM (£30000) a role currently filled with KDS3 and the old KDSM at around £17000.

Otherwise they risk losing customers to the likes of Vitus and dCS whose high end streamers start at these levels; and once you lose the customer, in my opinion they are unlikely to come back .

The Vitus RD101 and dCS Bartok at around £11,000?look like very good value compared to the the new Linn Flagship.

The original kdsm will continue at its RRP of £15800, When it receives the organik upgrade I expect it will increase to above £20000.
I heard a top DCS against the latest KDSM, it was a bit more natural sounding but not as musical.

Thanks - good to know that the original KDSM stays although ‘above £20,000 ‘ sounds quite steep and still leaves a chasm between it and Selekt.

If Linn do not offer it’s organic board for the KDS for not much more than the current upgrade cost from KDS/2 to Katalyst ( around £3800) I feel it will be time for me to look at Vitus/DCS alternatives.

That would be a shame as I would really like to support Linn which has always provided top class products and excellent support over the years and allowed me to discover and listen to really good music.

Let’s see where we are with the Original KDS/KDSM upgrades if and when they are released.

Well the upgrade won't be available for at least a year, if you don't intend to invest in it, perhaps you should consider the much improved katalyst, which I'm sure will be cheaper than an equivalent DCS, although I don't know vitus.

@ThomasOK

Hi Thomas,

you posted on another forum:

According to the diagram we were shown the Organik DAC takes a 24bit signal into the FPGA where it is oversampled 2048x and to 48 bits. This is modulated into a 5 Bit PWM digital signal that is fed to the AFIR DAC handled by discrete components on the PCB.

Being curious about the technical execution can you elaborate further or does exist something like a white paper about the Organik DAC?

Thanks

Matt

anthony wrote: ↑2021-03-28 13:08

u252agz wrote: ↑2021-03-28 12:07

anthony wrote: ↑2021-03-28 01:38

The original kdsm will continue at its RRP of £15800, When it receives the organik upgrade I expect it will increase to above £20000.
I heard a top DCS against the latest KDSM, it was a bit more natural sounding but not as musical.

Thanks - good to know that the original KDSM stays although ‘above £20,000 ‘ sounds quite steep and still leaves a chasm between it and Selekt.

If Linn do not offer it’s organic board for the KDS for not much more than the current upgrade cost from KDS/2 to Katalyst ( around £3800) I feel it will be time for me to look at Vitus/DCS alternatives.

That would be a shame as I would really like to support Linn which has always provided top class products and excellent support over the years and allowed me to discover and listen to really good music.

Let’s see where we are with the Original KDS/KDSM upgrades if and when they are released.

Well the upgrade won't be available for at least a year, if you don't intend to invest in it, perhaps you should consider the much improved katalyst, which I'm sure will be cheaper than an equivalent DCS, although I don't know vitus.

I’ve heard about this much improved KDS from several sources but have I missed Linn claiming an improvement? How do you rate this improvement compared to the original Katalyst upgrade? Since there’s no official Linn upgrade, this would involve buying a new KDS and trading in an older inferior one. Not very cost effective I feel.

Definitely give the Vitus a listen if you get a chance.

Just hope it sounds better than it looks.

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 12:03

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 11:54 For those of us at Akurate spending levels, this statement on the Linn website may be of concern:

"Next-generation Klimax DSM completes the Linn DSM family line-up of Klimax DSM, Selekt DSM and Majik DSM"

Yes, I am sure they will ditch the Akurate line.

Matt

This will make the transition to Lejonklou gear easier...

Tendaberry wrote: ↑2021-03-30 11:37

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-27 12:03

sunbeamgls wrote: ↑2021-03-27 11:54 For those of us at Akurate spending levels, this statement on the Linn website may be of concern:

"Next-generation Klimax DSM completes the Linn DSM family line-up of Klimax DSM, Selekt DSM and Majik DSM"

Yes, I am sure they will ditch the Akurate line.

Matt

This will make the transition to Lejonklou gear easier...

Not sure there's anything to stop anyone right now :)

matthias wrote: ↑2021-03-28 13:42 @ThomasOK

Hi Thomas,

you posted on another forum:

According to the diagram we were shown the Organik DAC takes a 24bit signal into the FPGA where it is oversampled 2048x and to 48 bits. This is modulated into a 5 Bit PWM digital signal that is fed to the AFIR DAC handled by discrete components on the PCB.

Being curious about the technical execution can you elaborate further or does exist something like a white paper about the Organik DAC?

Thanks

Matt

Hi Matt,
No, I haven't seen a white paper on this yet. This was just from a Linn diagram of the differences between how the Organik DAC system works and the Katalyst.

Linn has said that, despite the "family" photo, Akurate isn't going away any time soon. My rep said Linn doesn't discontinue things that are selling well. With the current Linn thinking that the source can look different than the rest (hence other Klimax gear remaining as is) maybe they eventually see a Selekt with Organik DAC, projected for sometime in the next two years, to replace ADSM while keeping other Akurate pieces in the line. They have talked about Organik for current KDS/M in 12 to 18 months and also for Akubarik and Akuridorik. So it will be flowing down the line. We'll just have to see.