Random thoughts on hifi

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beck
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by beck »

Spannko wrote: 2021-03-07 14:49 For want of a better description “musical understanding” is the highest level of musical consciousness, where we become one with the music, and is our ultimate goal. To achieve this, we have to learn to “let go”, clear our mind, and listen like a child. Only then will we “understand”.
I kind of like where this discussion is going......... :-)
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by David Neel »

beck wrote: 2021-03-07 17:01
Spannko wrote: 2021-03-07 14:49 For want of a better description “musical understanding” is the highest level of musical consciousness, where we become one with the music, and is our ultimate goal. To achieve this, we have to learn to “let go”, clear our mind, and listen like a child. Only then will we “understand”.
I kind of like where this discussion is going......... :-)
Music at its best can put us into a meditative state where the mind is clear of distractions and we are fully present. I've experienced this more often in the concert hall than in the home. It certainly never happens when trying to evaluate...
The search for knowledge is not nourished by certainty, but by a radical distrust in certainty
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by David Neel »

The search for knowledge is not nourished by certainty, but by a radical distrust in certainty
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Charlie1 »

Spannko wrote: 2021-03-07 14:49 I’m being serious though. I’m beginning to think that evaluation models can only take us so far (which also means that they shouldn’t be abandoned). For want of a better description “musical understanding” is the highest level of musical consciousness, where we become one with the music, and is our ultimate goal. To achieve this, we have to learn to “let go”, clear our mind, and listen like a child. Only then will we “understand”.
I think I know what you mean. It's a rare thing for me though, for one reason or another.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Spannko »

David Neel wrote: 2021-03-07 18:09
beck wrote: 2021-03-07 17:01
Spannko wrote: 2021-03-07 14:49 For want of a better description “musical understanding” is the highest level of musical consciousness, where we become one with the music, and is our ultimate goal. To achieve this, we have to learn to “let go”, clear our mind, and listen like a child. Only then will we “understand”.
I kind of like where this discussion is going......... :-)
Music at its best can put us into a meditative state where the mind is clear of distractions and we are fully present. I've experienced this more often in the concert hall than in the home. It certainly never happens when trying to evaluate...
What a beautiful place to be in, and surely it’s the reason why humans are so drawn to music. It’s as if we then experience a different type of existence which is the polar opposite of the hustle and bustle of everyday life.
Last edited by Spannko on 2021-03-08 23:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Spannko »

Very interesting, thanks for posting David. It’s proof that Charlie1 really is a Ninja!
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Charlie1 »

LOL :)
I can't think of anyone less Ninja like but thank you anyway.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Charlie1 wrote: 2021-03-08 12:26 LOL :)
I can't think of anyone less Ninja like but thank you anyway.
No 'mind monkeys' jumping on the thread? 🤣
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Charlie1 »

tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-08 18:11 No 'mind monkeys' jumping on the thread? 🤣
Sorry, you'll have to explain that one...
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by tokenbrit »

From the pdf, linked above: "the noises of the world and of your inner monkey mind are diffuse, distracting and therefore irrelevant..." with an adoption & adaptation from the popular children's rhyme 'Five Little Monkeys'.
Nevermind 🙈🙉🙊
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Charlie1 »

Thank you tokenbrit!

I would never have got there otherwise.

I will try to read the aikido pdf sometime though.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Charlie1 wrote: 2021-03-08 20:48 I will try to read the aikido pdf sometime though.
Definitely worth a read, especially since such a surprising source as a martial art could link back so elegantly to engagement and where a lot of us might have started with 'just listen'
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Spannko »

tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-08 18:49 From the pdf, linked above: "the noises of the world and of your inner monkey mind are diffuse, distracting and therefore irrelevant..."
I really liked the idea that anything which distracts from the job in hand is unwanted and should be eliminated. It reminded me of the need for a HiFi system, to be not necessarily “perfect” (which is impossible), but to be sufficiently good enough in terms of pitch, timing and timbre so as to not distract the listener and release their inner monkey, chattering away about “bum notes” and “inky blackness”.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Spannko wrote: 2021-03-08 23:39
tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-08 18:49 From the pdf, linked above: "the noises of the world and of your inner monkey mind are diffuse, distracting and therefore irrelevant..."
I really liked the idea that anything which distracts from the job in hand is unwanted and should be eliminated. It reminded me of the need for a HiFi system, to be not necessarily “perfect” (which is impossible), but to be sufficiently good enough in terms of pitch, timing and timbre so as to not distract the listener and release their inner monkey, chattering away about “bum notes” and “inky blackness”.
Exactly! And nothing more shall be spoken on the subject of monkeys, especially if your username is Spannko... nuff said ;)
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-09 01:18
Spannko wrote: 2021-03-08 23:39
tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-08 18:49 From the pdf, linked above: "the noises of the world and of your inner monkey mind are diffuse, distracting and therefore irrelevant..."
I really liked the idea that anything which distracts from the job in hand is unwanted and should be eliminated. It reminded me of the need for a HiFi system, to be not necessarily “perfect” (which is impossible), but to be sufficiently good enough in terms of pitch, timing and timbre so as to not distract the listener and release their inner monkey, chattering away about “bum notes” and “inky blackness”.
Exactly! And nothing more shall be spoken on the subject of monkeys, especially if your username is Spannko... nuff said ;)
Now you've done it!

There is a story in some of the writings I've read of a student who went to a swami master and asked to be given the way to cosmic consciousness. He gave him a meditation technique that seemed simple and told him to practice it for 24 hours. Thinking this seemed pretty straightforward he started to head home to practice meditation. But before he got more than a few paces away he was called back to the master who said he had forgotten one important point: the student must not think of a monkey while he was meditating! Thinking that was simple he sat to meditate and immediately found himself thinking of monkeys. Over the next several hours he thought of every kind of monkey he knew, what they looked like, where they lived, how they lived, etc! Furious he want back to the master complaining that all he had gotten was monkey consciousness. The master then explained it was a demonstration how little control the student had over his mind, and accepted him as a student.

Yes, tokenbrit, i did get the spank the monkey hint above, and I was shocked!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnVf1ZoCJSo
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Now that I've gotten that out of the way, I have enjoyed this latest thread. I don't try to get the live feel of music at home as I feel it is a lost cause. Although there were some pretty fun times with the JBLs cranked up, there is no way to get the power of even a three person rock band in my living room - nor would I want to. So for me the ideal is maximum musical and emotional engagement. This does mean getting rid of distractions so one can focus on the music. Since my phone is generally on buzz when I am home and there is nobody else watching TV this isn't too hard. Lejonklou electronics help in multiple ways, they visually fade into the background (especially with the lights are low), they just plain work well all the time, and they give that musical engagement like nothing else I have heard. So it is, at times, possible to relax fully into the music and it can be almost meditative. (Although meditation at the deepest level is about ridding oneself of all desires except the desire for union with the Creator, that includes desire for music which interferes with stillness. ;-)

But it does require getting rid of the mental monkeys: oh yeah, there's that Boazu in back I have to upgrade, oh yeah, I've had that new Ekos SE/1 for 2 weeks and haven't installed it yet, oh yeah, the buzzer just went off on the washer and it's time to move the clothes into the dryer, oh yeah, I still haven't installed that new WiFi router I've had for a month, oh yeah, shouldn't I be working on my taxes, oh yeah, Bella needs to go outside. Hmmm. Now where was I? Oh yeah, I'm tired, I think I'll go to bed!
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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ThomasOK wrote: 2021-03-10 00:57 But it does require getting rid of the mental monkeys: oh yeah, there's that Boazu in back I have to upgrade, oh yeah, I've had that new Ekos SE/1 for 2 weeks and haven't installed it yet, oh yeah, the buzzer just went off on the washer and it's time to move the clothes into the dryer, oh yeah, I still haven't installed that new WiFi router I've had for a month, oh yeah, shouldn't I be working on my taxes, oh yeah, Bella needs to go outside. Hmmm. Now where was I? Oh yeah, I'm tired, I think I'll go to bed!
That's where digital comes in for me: the LP12 requires a clear mind, whereas the Hakai can keep playing no matter how many monkeys are jumping on the bed... or in my head.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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tokenbrit wrote: 2021-03-10 02:42
ThomasOK wrote: 2021-03-10 00:57 But it does require getting rid of the mental monkeys: oh yeah, there's that Boazu in back I have to upgrade, oh yeah, I've had that new Ekos SE/1 for 2 weeks and haven't installed it yet, oh yeah, the buzzer just went off on the washer and it's time to move the clothes into the dryer, oh yeah, I still haven't installed that new WiFi router I've had for a month, oh yeah, shouldn't I be working on my taxes, oh yeah, Bella needs to go outside. Hmmm. Now where was I? Oh yeah, I'm tired, I think I'll go to bed!
That's where digital comes in for me: the LP12 requires a clear mind, whereas the Hakai can keep playing no matter how many monkeys are jumping on the bed... or in my head.
In my case it would be the Kremlin for the last few months.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by beck »

With my own cd recordings in mind I must say that I hear a lot of the streaming recordings on this forum as affected by copy protection.....

Can it be so? Is that what we are up against and what makes streaming so difficult to master?
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Storing older CDs and streaming those should be fine though, shouldn't it? Can you describe what you're noticing?
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Charlie1 wrote: 2021-04-12 18:36 Storing older CDs and streaming those should be fine though, shouldn't it? Can you describe what you're noticing?
Yes, it should be fine but as ThomasOK noticed in a post some time back more things come to play when streaming.

It is quite extreme how much work that has gone into getting my cd player to play music well. Yes, it is not the best of players to begin with but so small are the setup changes that it seems impossible to predict what works.

Most of the hifi industry is working in the small space between natural live timing and a seperation of sounds that makes everything become almost like the solo performer in front of the band making everything draw your attention to it at the same time.
This gives room for many different performances from many different systems.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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Sitting here at home this morning listening to cd I realise that the music is hitting me “right”. I cannot wish for more.
Never did I think it was possible using cd’s.

What is it to be “hit” the “right” way?

To me it is totally forgetting sound and just getting into an emotionally state of appreciation of the music. Sound is completely transformed into emotion within me.

The good thing is that you do not need the latest and greatest to get there. You just need to be true to yourself (and the music) when building and “tuning” the setup.

Being here I do not expect the urge to change anything will hit me and I will only need to replace if anything breaks down.

Happy days. :-)
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Defender »

thats great to hear and it is a great feeling to „have arrived“ ... it is also a sign of your own character - being satisfied with what we have and appreciating it is a state of mind - which nowadays only a few are capable of ...
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

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beck wrote: 2021-04-27 08:16 Sitting here at home this morning listening to cd I realise that the music is hitting me “right”. I cannot wish for more.
Never did I think it was possible using cd’s.

What is it to be “hit” the “right” way?

To me it is totally forgetting sound and just getting into an emotionally state of appreciation of the music. Sound is completely transformed into emotion within me.

The good thing is that you do not need the latest and greatest to get there. You just need to be true to yourself (and the music) when building and “tuning” the setup.

Being here I do not expect the urge to change anything will hit me and I will only need to replace if anything breaks down.

Happy days. :-)
I am coming round to the same point of view.

My Linn Majik LP12 is really enjoyable with Boazu and Komponent 110s - when I Listen to a good album on this to this, I am very happy and never feel the need to change anything.

The main system is undoubtedly better, more musical with better sounds, dynamics etc etc - but I am not sure that I am any happier. Just simply more appreciative of the musicians and the people who design and build such amazing Hi Fi products that reproduce this in my living room.

My recent acquisition of a cheap and cheerful CD player ( partly inspired by Beck's experiences) also allows me to enjoy the music on my old CDs. Spotify and KKDS/2 is of course much better - but I am not sure it makes me any happier.
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Re: Random thoughts on hifi

Post by Chet »

I think that is great that Beck & U252 are in that happy place.

I find when I listen in the car or on a system I have put together from spare Hifi (ok its still decent hifi, 5125 amps type of thing, Kabers), I think mentally I switch off better because you are not thinking 'how can that be improved' and just enjoying it as it is. At that point I am not thinking of the imperfections, in fact just not thinking.

I think that is the really difficult thing to do, stop thinking 'how can it be improved' or I still need to do that with it. I find with my main HiFi system I do think that too much and its harder to lose myself. Something I need to let go of...
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