lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-15 12:51 By the way, does anyone feel that this topic should become a ‘sticky’, so that it’s always on top?

Yes, absolutely! I thought about suggesting it, but you’ve beaten me to it.

Sorry, one question remains, the distance apart the speakers, how do you measure it? From tweeter to tweeter OR from the inside edge from the speaker to the other ??
Thank you
@lejonklou

Measure what is most practical. If the loudspeaker cabinets are rectangular boxes, you can measure the distance apart between the upper inside edges. If they have rounded shapes, you might have to find some other point that is easier to measure.

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-16 12:42 Measure what is most practical. If the loudspeaker cabinets are rectangular boxes, you can measure the distance apart between the upper inside edges. If they have rounded shapes, you might have to find some other point that is easier to measure.

thank you sir

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-15 12:51 By the way, does anyone feel that this topic should become a ‘sticky’, so that it’s always on top?

Yes!

I get too much bass when I pull my speakers nearer against the wall, I find 60cm is the minimum or perhaps I am hearing wrong and do not understand Tune method.

Reading advices on the internet they tell you to place the speakers about 60 cm off the wall behind. I placed the rounded backsides of my speakers ca. 30 cm from the wall and to me that’s quite an optimum for the bass. The Tune Method: “Try (read: Tune) Again. Fail Again. Fail Better.” As Beckett once said (read: Tuning Better all the Times till you find your own customized optimum).

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-30 16:23 I get too much bass when I pull my speakers nearer against the wall, I find 60cm is the minimum or perhaps I am hearing wrong and do not understand Tune method.

What speakers are that, erho? And what does the room look like? How wide is the wall behind the speakers and how close is the nearest corner/side wall?

Arjen wrote: ↑2024-01-30 22:31 Reading advices on the internet they tell you to place the speakers about 60 cm off the wall behind. I placed the rounded backsides of my speakers ca. 30 cm from the wall and to me that’s quite an optimum for the bass. The Tune Method: “Try (read: Tune) Again. Fail Again. Fail Better.” As Beckett once said.

As you’ve discovered Argen, the 60cm recommendation is complete nonsense, as are any other dimensional or geometric recommendations. Every loudspeaker and every room have their own unique positional requirements and finding the optimal combination can only be determined by trial and error whilst focusing on the combinations tune playing ability.

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-30 23:14

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-30 16:23 I get too much bass when I pull my speakers nearer against the wall, I find 60cm is the minimum or perhaps I am hearing wrong and do not understand Tune method.

What speakers are that, erho? And what does the room look like? How wide is the wall behind the speakers and how close is the nearest corner/side wall?

Hi, the room is rectangular. 523cm x 407cm. The wall behind the speakers is the long wall with 523 cm. At the right corner, at the end of this wall, is a 95cm wide glass balcony door located. I have measured and each speaker is
160cm measured from the outside edge away from side wall.
Speakers are Russell K 50 with Solidsteel SS-6 stands with spikes and Linn Skeet. Best regards.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OlrYUR ... sp=sharing

Thank you!

That looks like far less than 60 cm from the rear wall?

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:36 Thank you!

That looks like far less than 60 cm from the rear wall?

Yes thats 30 cm, can you recommend me some tuning? Is the Ikea Kallax device between the speakers too high or too large?

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:53 Yes thats 30 cm

With your existing configuration of the Solidsteel tripods it doesn't seem possible to place the speakers closer to the wall.
You have to turn the stands by 180 degrees to achieve that.
OTOH, the speakers have a port on the back which might not be perfect for a set-up in close proximity to the wall.

matthias wrote: ↑2024-01-31 15:08

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:53 Yes thats 30 cm

With your existing configuration of the Solidsteel tripods it doesn't seem possible to place the speakers closer to the wall.
You have to turn the stands by 180 degrees to achieve that.
OTOH, the speakers have a port on the back which might not be perfect for a set-up in close proximity to the wall.

I’d say the bass port at the back might need more distant. You can try to put the tripod in line with your HIFi-gear board, makes it about 40/45 cm distance. Listen again to the tune, not only the bass as separate, but integral. Listen to the tune, a favourite one, and shuffle a bit forwards, backwards and sidewards until you can follow the tunes and it moves you (as Fredrik Lejonklou educates).

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:53

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:36 Thank you!

That looks like far less than 60 cm from the rear wall?

Yes thats 30 cm, can you recommend me some tuning? Is the Ikea Kallax device between the speakers too high or too large?

The only way is to methodically move the speakers around and listen.

Change track if you don't get a sense of better/worse. Some tracks sound great or at least impressive no matter what you do - don't use them. Some tracks you can't connect to - don't use them.

Often I unexpectedly find a track that 1) Starts at once, 2) moves me emotionally and 3) is a bit challenging to follow musically (trying to figure out what the musicians are doing). Those tracks can be great for tuning. Finding them is so easy nowadays: I pick an old favourite and let the streaming service recommend something similar. Then I choose a track and an artist that I have never heard of before.

Ignore the amount of bass - that will sort itself out in the end. But pay attention to whether the player of the bass makes any sense.

If you want help, you can post short clips in the Playground thread. Preferably two clips with a single parameter changed in between them (like distance to rear wall).

Arjen wrote: ↑2024-01-31 21:00

matthias wrote: ↑2024-01-31 15:08

erho wrote: ↑2024-01-31 14:53 Yes thats 30 cm

With your existing configuration of the Solidsteel tripods it doesn't seem possible to place the speakers closer to the wall.
You have to turn the stands by 180 degrees to achieve that.
OTOH, the speakers have a port on the back which might not be perfect for a set-up in close proximity to the wall.

I’d say the bass port at the back might need more distant. You can try to put the tripod in line with your HIFi-gear board, makes it about 40/45 cm distance. Listen again to the tune, not only the bass as separate, but integral.

The location of the port shouldn't influence your choice of position in your room. The JBL 308P is rear ported and in my room they're most musical at 7.5cm from the wall. At 8cm they get boomy. That 0.5cm makes all the difference. Ignore all the "rules of thumb" and just play with different positions until you find one that works best for your speakers in your room. There's a lot of great information in this thread about how to best go about that.

And as Fredrik suggested, if you get stuck make some short clips and post them in the playground thread. The collective wisdom of this form was invaluable in helping me find the optimum solution for many variables, and in the process helped me refine and improve my own tuning abilities.

Thank you all for you statements and advices, will try my best, think we will meet us in the playground thread

Looking forward to it, erho!

When listening to clips, all of the nice, detailed sound in the room is destroyed. This can turn some people off, because the clips don’t sound that good. But it’s also actually helpful, because you get to hear a raw version of how the speakers and the room are interacting, and that cuts straight to the core of what is most musical. The thing to remember for the listener of the clips is that we judge only the difference between two (or more) clips. It doesn’t matter if both clips sound bad, the question is which one is more enjoyable (or less painful) to listen to?

I often step outside of the room when doing comparisons. That has a similar, but often even more reliable, effect than listening to clips. You can tell from the next room whether it feels like the musicians are performing better or worse, without being distracted by all the detail you get in the room. Those details can make you fall in a trap, because sometimes an incorrect position of the speakers can feel very detailed and absorbing - because if it’s a confused mess, we sometimes interpret it as more details.

is it also possible to put the speakers to the short wall?
have already tried all against the long wall and i always get a bass boom about 43hz I think. can not find a position by placing them to the long wall without the bass boom.

Absolutely!

Just try it!

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-02-22 15:39 Absolutely!

Just try it!

okay, with the same steps as you described I guess

Yes. You can expect the short wall to be more bass heavy, but perhaps not the same boom as before. Stay away from the corners if possible.

lejonklou wrote: ↑2024-02-22 17:41 Yes. You can expect the short wall to be more bass heavy, but perhaps not the same boom as before. Stay away from the corners if possible.

thank you