Where do we go from here?

[bonzo]

Ok, first I’d like to thank the fellow forum members sfor their highly insightful input. My question is a simple one, perhaps. With my current setup, I will figure a way to acquire Ekos SE, and new Kandid as needed based on previous posts/pics. My question is, is there an upgrade/musical improvement that can be had in addition to Ekos SE? Prior to acquiring Sagutun Monos... I’m still quite intrigued by a 2 or 3 way speaker with higher sensitivity rating. I’ve yet to hear any feedback regarding Sonus Faber standmounts or even floor stander. After Ekos SE and sorting out Kandid... what is left to pursue. Part of me thinks Music! But more vinyl Jon!! As amazingly musical as the tundra mono2s are, I still enjoy high spl’s and just flat out rocking good time.

[Tendaberry]

What hifi-table/s are you using today? Do you have the latest version of the Klimax Kontrol with the power switch in front? This one is better than the older versions, even if Linn doesn't admit it openly.

[Tony Tune-age]

I'm in a similar position as well, but one item that really improved my system was getting the NOKTable. My original turntable stand was The Sound Organisation. And although it did perform well overall, it's not nearly as good as the NOKTable. Needless to say, it was a wise purchase and I'm very happy with how it performs.

As already mentioned by Tendaberry, audio racks can be another possible improvement. I've been looking into various audio racks, and auditioned a Mimer rack when ThomasOK replaced the tweeters in my Isobarik speakers. And since that time, Quadraspire has come out with their new X Reference audio rack. Although it has good reviews, I haven't been able to hear the X Reference, or compare it with a Mimer rack.

But getting another audio rack could be just as beneficial as getting the NOKTable, and perhaps the best approach for improving the sound of my audio components overall.

[Tendaberry]

I know these additonal boards improved my Quadraspire rack immensely. They are simply placed on top of the regular Quadraspire levels. I use Oehlbach mini-cones between them, be aware that it matters where you place the mini-cones. For best timing, place them in the corners.

[Tony Tune-age]

Very interesting Tendaberry, I did wonder if that type of product could improve my Quadraspire rack...and be a less expensive alternative. So far, I've been told that some of those boards can be an improvement, and other types don't sound good. I'll continue my search for the best approach. But your information really helps - thanks!

By the way, who makes your boards?

I know these additonal boards improved my Quadraspire rack immensely. They are simply placed on top of the regular Quadraspire levels. I use Oehlbach mini-cones between them, be aware that it matters where you place the mini-cones. For best timing, place them in the corners.

[bonzo]

Thank you both for the suggestions and info. Space limits me for another table such as Noktable (hence wall shelf). I’ve seen from Quadraspire a shelf, with feet and all, sold for the purpose of going directly on top of an existing quad shel/rack. I think it’s the quadraspire soundstage.
Currently my rack started out as a Q4 with basic shelving, I then added 3 acrylic reference shelves along with the recommended risers, and finally, 1 shelf (top one where K Radikal is placed) is a Q4 Evo. This is the one with cutouts on the underside of the shelf. I’m using skeets at the bottom of my rack.. very curious how the “shelf on a shelf” sounds and if upgraded feet/points improve things or not

[David Neel]

I understand the soundstage never made it to production, not good enough apparently. I have done some comparisons between different Quadraspire models and can report that bamboo shelves are better than the veneered wood, and that SVT (slightly larger) is better than Q4 evo. So SVT bamboo is the one to go for, significantly better than wooden Q4 evo. And the bronze upgrade is expensive but worth it under an LP12. I think the acrylic shelves were produced by one of the dealers rather than quadraspire, they don't seem to part of the range these days. And X-ref is great but unaffordable.
Yes, I'd like to compare with Harmonihyllan, but not possible in the UK....

[ThomasOK]

If the Quadraspire Soundstage never made it into production then I suppose the one we have on demo under a Rega Planar 6 must be a mirage! ;-) In actuality it does appear to exist although it did take a long time to get one here. It seemed to improve the Rega Planar 6 on a heavy Hi-Fi shelving unit but I don't know if it would be worthwhile on top of an already decent rack or wall shelf.

As to the Ekos SE upgrade, several have found that the SE/1 is musically better than the original SE, including Fredrik. I think there is a clip on here somewhere that shows this.

On Sonus faber speakers, there are some I have heard that I really liked quite a bit, but they are the older versions of their Homage series. These are the Guarneri, Amati and Stradivari. They work quite well with Linn Klimax electronics so they certainly should work well with the Lejonklou gear. Some feel the Guarneris are the jewel in the crown but the Amatis we had in the store were quite good and one of the few speakers I might have considered as an alternative to the ATCs I used to have, although it was quite a bit more expensive. I never took a pair home so I can't really give them any kind of solid quality rating, I just noticed that they were more musical, especially once I torqued the drivers properly, than other more expensive speakers I have heard since. (I did take a pair of Cremonas home but they were handily outplayed by the Isobariks.) The problem with Sonus faber speakers is that it is a whole different company now and I don't feel the current or even recent models from them are up with what they did in the past. Some of this is due to their founder and designer of the original Homages leaving and then passing away several years ago, and some because they are now owned by a big Italian venture capital company that also owns Audio Research and McIntosh, etc. So I don't find that they still have the same design ethic - lots more bling, less good products. (Ask beck about that - Franco has left the building.)

So if you can locate some original Guarneri Homages or Amati Homages they would be worth listening to in my opinion. But they don't come up used all that often and they may or may not be your cup of tea. Interestingly, a quick look at Audiogon shows no original Guarneris but three sets of newer post Franco versions for sale and a whopping bunch of the Venere models. You might think people were trying to tell you something.

[Spannko]

Interesting info about the early SF’s. I remember that in the early days SF made a point of mentioning that their speakers were designed using an LP12. The owner/designer was quite a fan apparently.

[beck]

.........As amazingly musical as the tundra mono2s are, I still enjoy high spl’s and just flat out rocking good time.

If I understand you correctly you have just pointed Lejonklou towards his next project: the making of a muscle amp near mono2 musical level! :-)

[bonzo]

Beck,
I certainly would have No problem with a “muscle” amp as you call it.. BUT knowing Frederik and the standards he has for himself and his brand I couldn’t see him making something less musical for the sake of more power.

[beck]

Beck,
I certainly would have No problem with a “muscle” amp as you call it.. BUT knowing Frederik and the standards he has for himself and his brand I couldn’t see him making something less musical for the sake of more power.

Aha! But near could also mean above (instead of below)! :-)

[Ozzzy189]

Totem acoustic tribe towers... Just incredible. I highly recommend giving Chris at HiddenSystems a call. These skinny floorstanding speakers are a revelation.
And yes, I'm eagerly awaiting a Lejonklou 'muscle' amp!

[bonzo]

An observation in regard to “muscle” amp. When listening to music I almost always listen in the room where the gear is. I’ve noticed something familiar when I am outside the listening room. So very similar to my experience with Aktiv 212s with 4200s, the music seemed/ felt “louder” outside of the room. I believe these wonderful amps provide the same experience. Outside of my listening room I’m constantly surprised at how “loud” the music is throughout the house. Like Aktiv, because these amps are so musical, and distortion (not sure if correct term) barely exists, it doesn’t feel loud until outside the room. I hope I’ve been able to make my point and haven’t confused the group

[bonzo]

Ozzy,
I’m quite intrigued by your post about Totem speakers. I’d love to hear your thoughts/experience comparing these speakers to 242s, for example, or any other Linn speakers. No crossover for the bass is interesting and a bit unclear to me. If not active, how can there Not be a passive crossover. I anxiously await your response. Ty, Jon

[Ozzzy189]

Ozzy,
I’m quite intrigued by your post about Totem speakers. I’d love to hear your thoughts/experience comparing these speakers to 242s, for example, or any other Linn speakers. No crossover for the bass is interesting and a bit unclear to me. If not active, how can there Not be a passive crossover. I anxiously await your response. Ty, Jon

Hi there.
The best person to ask this is Chris Fuller as he's got 242's and has got more experience of both than I.
In respect of the totem tribes, they're just so fluid, weighty and balanced perfectly.
They go down to 30hz and have that lovely solidness to basslines without masking the tune. Better than 242's? Probably but they're very different and far newer and just because I love them doesn't mean that others will too.
I am eagerly waiting for a big beastly Lejonklou power amp to feed them though, totems do tend to sound that bit better with a little bit more grunt.

[lejonklou]

I am eagerly waiting for a big beastly Lejonklou power amp to feed them though, totems do tend to sound that bit better with a little bit more grunt.

Sorry to chime in with an off topic comment, but I need to shed light on a very common misconception:

The output power of a power amp is completely unrelated to how "grunty" or powerful it sounds. The output power is only related to how loud you can play.

The misconception likely stems from motorised vehicles - everyone knows that a stronger motor will give you a higher acceleration (a grunty feeling). But an amplifier driving a speaker is completely different. When you push the pedal to the bottom, the motor will use its maximum power to accelerate the vehicle. An amplifier, on the other hand, only uses a fraction of its maximum power while you play music at moderate levels. When you crank it all the way up until it clips, that's when the amplifier hits maximum power. Adding more power to the amplifier will only move that clipping limit to a louder level.

[Ozzzy189]

I understand all that Fredrik but does that mean it'll never happen?

[lejonklou]

I understand all that Fredrik but does that mean it'll never happen?

That what will never happen? A more powerful amp or one that sounds more grunty? :)

[Ozzzy189]

I understand all that Fredrik but does that mean it'll never happen?

That what will never happen? A more powerful amp or one that sounds more grunty? :)

A 'mega-tundra'?

[David Neel]

Ozzzy,

I've got Tundra Monos driving speakers that are demonstrably less efficient than Akubariks - Graham LS5/9s.

I can't use volumes beyond green.....

Can't see the point of a gruntier amplifer. :)

[lejonklou]

Well, if I make a more powerful amplifier than Tundra Mono, it will also need to sound better. I understand that some like to play really loud, but louder and less grunty (or musical) won't do.

More powerful and better is a challenge. It would be expensive, mainly due to the power supplies. A quadruple in power is necessary to make a real difference and I always use two separate ones in a push-pull configuration because it sounds so much better. One day maybe, but don't hold your breath.

[Ozzzy189]

Ozzy,
I’m quite intrigued by your post about Totem speakers. I’d love to hear your thoughts/experience comparing these speakers to 242s, for example, or any other Linn speakers. No crossover for the bass is interesting and a bit unclear to me. If not active, how can there Not be a passive crossover. I anxiously await your response. Ty, Jon

http://novo.press/adventures-in-sound-w ... -speakers/
A good read.

[beck]

Totem Tribe Tower playing:

https://youtu.be/0U6QrnCvLPU

[Music Lover]

Well, if I make a more powerful amplifier than Tundra Mono, it will also need to sound better. I understand that some like to play really loud, but louder and less grunty (or musical) won't do.

More powerful and better is a challenge. It would be expensive, mainly due to the power supplies. A quadruple in power is necessary to make a real difference and I always use two separate ones in a push-pull configuration because it sounds so much better. One day maybe, but don't hold your breath.

Yes please, only focus on performance - not power AND performance

First, most people going to find the Tundra powerful enough, even with Klångedang or Linn speakers.
For the very few, that still have more demands on loudness... I suggest JBL 3677 or other high efficient speakers.

Seems unnecessary to spend:
- precious development time
- as a customer, pay more

For an amplifier with high power, that is not needed with efficient speakers.