Playground for practical listening exercises

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

Moderator: Staff

u252agz
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 786
Joined: 2013-10-03 12:44
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by u252agz »

ThomasOK wrote: 2018-12-13 00:30 A tale of two clips! Part 3. The REVEAL!





So that’s the story. SINGularity looks like nothing else and sounds like nothing else I have heard. It is really just quite sublime. It gives me a heightened sense of the beauty of every piece of music I have played on it, not by using euphonic colorations that make all music sound smooth or warm, or forward mids to make things more artificially detailed, but by letting you to hear what is really on the record and allowing more of the true musicianship to come through. A stunning new piece by Fredrik, and the finished version will even have a couple small improvements over the pair I just enjoyed. I can’t wait!

I missed this with the different clips and explanations of audio/video etc - but Wow!

This is an incredible achievement and sounds like Fredrik really was in the zone when developing the Singularity.

At this price it will compete with a few other 'High End ' phonostages, but I have a feeling that for those who want the best - there will be a new kid on the block.

I am hoping that in the near future, some of the development from Singularity ( great name by the way) will trickle down to a less expensive MC phonostage that will still outperform Urika and be a viable alternative for those with Kandid/Krystal.

At the moment I am happy with Adikt/Slipsik 6.1 and can't see how it could get any better - but clearly it can.
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7

Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e

Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Merry Christmas everybody.

My question to you is as follows:

Does this sound like playing vinyl? :-)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yr2nxmimyfn3z ... 6.mov?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/gzcv6xu2zllh6 ... 7.mov?dl=0

And a happy new year!
Playing cd’s…………
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

The first clip sounds particularly analogue and vinyl like to me.

You've done an amazing setup job with a £300 CD player but I would still much rather hear your turntable.

PS Happy Christmas everyone too.
Paaf
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 254
Joined: 2012-02-22 18:21
Location: Stockholm

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Paaf »

It sounds bouncy and nice. :) What CD player is that? Can you explain the board and feet you have under it?
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Paaf wrote: 2018-12-28 20:04 It sounds bouncy and nice. :) What CD player is that? Can you explain the board and feet you have under it?
Hi Paaf

You can consider me a kind of black sheep in here doing all the wrong things but getting useful results.
As my Klyde wore out I moved my focus. I took my old NAD C542 cd player out for a spin and as ever with me I use what I have and try to make it work.
It is a big step for me to be able to listen and enjoy my cd player. It has taken me a couple of months speculating and trying different things.
In essens my stand is not fit for hifi but I take that as a challenge. That on the other hand makes it hard for others to use any of my findings in a meaningful way.

Shelf direct under the NAD is an old Audiotech lightweight shelf with rubber pieces, plastic feet and a rubber mat underneath as legs and the heavy metal shelf at the bottom.
Charlie1 wrote: 2018-12-28 17:04 The first clip sounds particularly analogue and vinyl like to me.

You've done an amazing setup job with a £300 CD player but I would still much rather hear your turntable.

PS Happy Christmas everyone too.
I agree. At some point I have to get back into vinyl but for the moment this is fun and I am not completely satisfied with my cd setup yet......
Playing cd’s…………
Paaf
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 254
Joined: 2012-02-22 18:21
Location: Stockholm

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Paaf »

That's pretty cool. I suspect we are using a similar process. Recent months I have played around with home made wood boards and silicone rubber feet for the network equipment. For instance, for the PSU of my NAS. :)

Probably your findings are different from mine, especially since it's a CD player with its specific internal vibrations - but it would still interest me to see a closeup photo of your board/feet/legs if you don't mind?
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Talking about vibrations. Why not go extreme! :-). :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu74933j97uam ... 8.mov?dl=0

I will pm you with a photo Paaf.
Playing cd’s…………
Paaf
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 254
Joined: 2012-02-22 18:21
Location: Stockholm

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Paaf »

I never thought I'd say this, but I prefer the clip with the turntable as damping weight... lol
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Paaf wrote: 2018-12-29 17:32 I never thought I'd say this, but I prefer the clip with the turntable as damping weight... lol
Me too! :-)
Playing cd’s…………
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Borrowed a £240 ProJect turntable that a friend is interested in buying. Can't quite beleive how good these budget decks sound. Amazing really. Here's a £600 system, incl Creek 4140 and Keilidhs:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h28j18gmnivjj ... 3.MOV?dl=0
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

I can only applaud “cheap” joyful equipment. :-)
Playing cd’s…………
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK »

It never ceases to amaze me how old turntables that I turned up my nose at back in the 70s and 80s can, with a little care, make quite enjoyable music. Any number of cheap, plastic Japanese tables when treated to a Rega felt mat, a reasonable basic cartridge and some care in setting up the cartridge (proper alignment, proper torqueing of the cartridge in the headshell, tracking and anti-skating set by ear) prove to be more musical than you would expect. A lot of it comes down to the constant demoing in the store using streaming and CDs so that a nice hit of analog, even pretty cheap analog, comes as a breath of fresh air.

By the way, we sell a lot of Rega Planar 1s and they offer quite good perfromance for the money.
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

ThomasOK wrote: 2019-01-09 00:38By the way, we sell a lot of Rega Planar 1s and they offer quite good perfromance for the money.
Gonna hear RP1 vs RP2 in a couple of weeks. Which step up would you say is bigger - RP1 to RP2, or RP2 to RP3?
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK »

Charlie1 wrote: 2019-01-09 01:18
ThomasOK wrote: 2019-01-09 00:38By the way, we sell a lot of Rega Planar 1s and they offer quite good perfromance for the money.
Gonna hear RP1 vs RP2 in a couple of weeks. Which step up would you say is bigger - RP1 to RP2, or RP2 to RP3?
Just to avoid any confusion (which was all generated by Rega themselves) the current models are called the Planar 1, Planar 2 and Planar 3 (although they also say P1, P2, and P3 on the plinths). The preceding versions were the RP1 and RP3.

To answer the actual question, the Planar 2 is a worthwhile upgrade over the Planar 1. For not a lot more money ($200 in the US) you get a better platter and a better arm with the one piece cast armtube/headshell. The Planar 3 is a bigger upcharge of $470 with the $295 Elys 2 cartridge ($1145US, available without cartridge for $945 so you are saving $95 buying it with the Elys2). But it is a much bigger upgrade, mechanically and musically. You get an upgraded bearing housing, a better plinth with the brace system, a better arm, a better felt mat and better motor control electronics with the option to add a Lingo-like motor controller for $395. Thats a lot of improvement for the extra $475, not to mention that the cartridge is a quite decent $295 unit hand made at Rega vs. the Rega Carbon which is a $65 bonded conical tipped Audio Technica. I have long felt that the Rega 3 is one of the biggest bargains in the Hi-Fi market, along with the Majik LP12 and the Rega Brio.

To confuse things a bit more I feel the Planar 6 has moved into this category as well and I was impressed how much more musical it was than its immediate predecessor. The Planar 6 is $1995 with the $595 Exakt 2 included (a $195 savings). For that price you have the latest Rega Neo TT-PSU included, an improved and extremely light plinth, an improved platter with more flywheel effect, a machined aluminum inner platter replacing the plastic one of the models below it, a reference white belt, and the Exakt 2 cartridge. (Also available for $2195 with the $795 LOMC Ania, which seems to be a pretty musical MC, if you have a proper phono stage - you know, like a SINGularity!) :-) Anyway, take the $1145 Planar 3, add $395 for the Neo TT-PSU, $59 for the reference white belt and the $300 difference of the Exakt 2 over the Elys 2 and you end up totaling $1899. So the other $96 gets you a better inner platter, better outer platter and better plinth. Seems like a deal to me. Indeed I sold our demo Planar 6 last week to a customer who agreed with me and didn't want to wait for a new one. But I also sold two Planar 3s to others who weren't in that price range.

Obviously, the Planar 6 puts you in the $2000 price range rather than the $1100 ish price range so it will be a jump too high for many people. Also, if you don't need to go new a good used LP12, like a Valhalla/Ittok table, would be a more musical way to spend $2000. But then you need to make sure it is all it should be, including a properly rebuilt Valhalla a good setup and possibly a new cartridge.

So there's a fair bit to think about. But I have to say, with the Planar 1, 2, 3 and 6 and the Majik LP12 and various upgrades leading to the Klimax LP12, we have almost an embarrassment of riches to offer analog lovers - from newbie to seasoned veteran.
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Many thanks for the detailed info Tom, including the naming clarification. I'd not realised that but had a feeling there might be more to it.

Looking forward to comparing them. Sounds like I may be wanting to hear the P3 too.
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

Thanks Thomas

Very interested in Planar 3 vs. Planar 6 contest for a second system.

Planar 6 / Ania / Aria for 3,000 € seems quite tempting.

M.
User avatar
Tendaberry
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 982
Joined: 2010-08-30 16:08
Location: Hamburg

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Tendaberry »

[quote=Matteo post_id=39431 time=1547115982 user_id=1621

Very interested in Planar 3 vs. Planar 6 contest for a second system.

Planar 6 / Ania / Aria for 3,000 € seems quite tempting.

M.
[/quote]
For that kind of money I'd rather look at one of the ex-dem Majik LP12's appearing now
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

Tendaberry wrote: 2019-01-10 15:43 For that kind of money I'd rather look at one of the ex-dem Majik LP12's appearing now
I'm quite bored to do (125+125)*2 km to the dealer every time my LP12 needs something ...

M.
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

Thomas

Have you ever tried Elys 2 or Exact with the Gaio / Gaio 2 / Slipsik 6?

M.
User avatar
Tendaberry
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 982
Joined: 2010-08-30 16:08
Location: Hamburg

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Tendaberry »

Sorry for being off-topic! Both dealers in Milano are no good? Sorry to hear that. I guess I've gotten used to travelling to my dealer.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Matteo wrote: 2019-01-10 16:00 I'm quite bored to do (125+125)*2 km to the dealer every time my LP12 needs something ...
Just pretend it's a Rega and there are no upgrades you can do :D

And you can replace the Adikt stylus yourself so all sorted.

OK, so you still need a service, but once every 5-6 years should be OK shouldn't it?...

Personally, I prefer the idea of a budget second system, so no further than Planar 3 for me. That keeps it away from entry level LP12 pricing too. Otherwise, it's not so much fun to my mind and getting more 'serious'.
Last edited by Charlie1 on 2019-01-10 17:06, edited 3 times in total.
tokenbrit
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2039
Joined: 2012-03-22 19:47
Location: New England

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by tokenbrit »

Matteo wrote: 2019-01-10 16:00 I'm quite bored to do (125+125)*2 km to the dealer every time my LP12 needs something ...

M.
Milan to Cremona, or Genoa? LP12s don't need much once they're set up, do they? And won't a Rega Planar 6 benefit from a good dealer too? If the dealers in Milan aren't so good then the RP6 won't be set up so well either...
Tendaberry wrote: 2019-01-10 16:27 .. I guess I've gotten used to travelling to my dealer.
Ha! I hear you ;) I wish Thomas was only 125km away :)
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

Tendaberry wrote: 2019-01-10 16:27 Sorry for being off-topic! Both dealers in Milano are no good? Sorry to hear that. I guess I've gotten used to travelling to my dealer.
No, they don't.

Nearest are Cremona (100 km) and Genoa (125 km), then Pisa (280 km) and Rome (575 km).

Milan to Genoa is 95% via highway; there isn't an highway from Milan to Cremona.

M.
Last edited by Matteo on 2019-01-10 17:15, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

Charlie1 wrote: 2019-01-10 17:00
OK, so you still need a service, but once every 5-6 years should be OK shouldn't it?...
3-4 years (I use to listen to the LP12 averagely for 400/500 hours per year, so in 3/4 years the stylus is dead).

With 2 LP12's, 1.5-2 years.

More frequently if you upgrade the turntable.

M.
Last edited by Matteo on 2019-01-10 17:13, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Matteo
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 913
Joined: 2018-01-25 14:12
Location: Milano, Italia

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Matteo »

tokenbrit wrote: 2019-01-10 17:01 And won't a Rega Planar 6 benefit from a good dealer too? If the dealers in Milan aren't so good then the RP6 won't be set up so well either...
Rega's are plug 'n play

BTW, the official Italian Rega (and Naim) importer (Home Vision) and repairer (Lasa) are both in Piacenza, only 70 km (with highway) from Milan.

M.
Last edited by Matteo on 2019-01-10 17:16, edited 2 times in total.
Post Reply