Playground for practical listening exercises

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

Moderator: Staff

Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Sounding very good. I find CD more nimble on that track but LP still slightly easier to comprehend - same ball park though.
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Thank you for listening. I do not fool myself into believing that my cd player can catch up with my Sondek but as a guiding tool the Sondek is very handy..
Playing cd’s…………
u252agz
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 786
Joined: 2013-10-03 12:44
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by u252agz »

Beck

Your CD sounds really good - obviously not up to your Sondek level of musicality and engagement but pretty amazing nevertheless.

Its a shame you don't have a streaming device to compare to this - I suspect you would need a pretty well optimised network and good streamer to get significantly better.
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7

Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e

Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko »

I’m loving your old lp12 beck! Has it a cirkus or pre-cirkus bearing?
Whatsmynaim
Active member
Active member
Posts: 198
Joined: 2019-10-29 23:55

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Whatsmynaim »

A month ago I thought this is cute but there's no way it can improve more ..and here we are. When the song gets going the NAD really is no slouch.
I take this is without falling back on old tweaks like using a CD washer or a degausser?
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Thank you for all the kind remarks guys! :-)

As I posted elsewhere this has been some journey.

Spannko wrote: 2020-08-11 13:48 I’m loving your old lp12 beck! Has it a cirkus or pre-cirkus bearing?
It is cirkus and a 1990 Sondek with Ekos1/Klyde. I have the old bearing stored away only used for one year before I got the cirkus.
u252agz wrote: 2020-08-11 13:30 Beck

Your CD sounds really good - obviously not up to your Sondek level of musicality and engagement but pretty amazing nevertheless.

Its a shame you don't have a streaming device to compare to this - I suspect you would need a pretty well optimised network and good streamer to get significantly better.
I think you are right but cannot prove it. :-)
Whatsmynaim wrote: 2020-08-11 16:42 A month ago I thought this is cute but there's no way it can improve more ..and here we are. When the song gets going the NAD really is no slouch.
I take this is without falling back on old tweaks like using a CD washer or a degausser?
No use of the mentioned tweaks but a continued improvement of the setup including some rather amazing tweaks using felt to support cables.

Did you know that felt used as cable support is directional?!! :-)
Playing cd’s…………
User avatar
V.A.MKD
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 862
Joined: 2019-10-09 15:33
Location: Skopje / Europe
Contact:

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by V.A.MKD »

beck wrote: 2020-08-11 17:46 Did you know that felt used as cable support is directional?!! :-)
:-)))
OK felt for support (I can understand, resonance) ... but direction of felt ... :-)
Tune until perfection ... great Beck ...
Just as idea ... to try your CD with Linn Silver IC in direction to be even better ... I read that you have Perfect Black, but never know ... as with Felt ...
Music First ...
Vlado
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

An important lesson I have learned throught the years is to revisit old “tricks” from time to time. Things that did not work before can due to changed circumstances suddenly become relevant.

So you are right Vlado. I will revisit the silvers. :-)
Playing cd’s…………
Whatsmynaim
Active member
Active member
Posts: 198
Joined: 2019-10-29 23:55

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Whatsmynaim »

People are flipping the LP12 felt mat with good results so I'm ready to believe in the direction of felt as well ..maybe it's all connected!
It's funny how just about everything matters when it comes to a good music system and it either gets better or worse.
Every step of the way we're tuning this complex musical instrument.
---
And If you're stuck with the generation 2 of the Linn Silver I can recommend the new ones which are more natural sounding and tuneful. I can't speak for the original silvers though since I never owned them.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Karin/LK280 vs 42.5/160

Post by Charlie1 »

Borrowed the Linn amps from a kind forum friend.

Can only use my Technics midi system CD as source cos the Kairn Pro doesn't have phono. I've remembered to reverse phase on the Kairn :)

Track 1
Kairn/280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/brbqvbl4827uc ... 9.MOV?dl=0
42.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/b7jd1p8w0z656 ... 1.MOV?dl=0

Track 2
Kairn/280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/kildla3ti02fx ... 0.MOV?dl=0
42.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wg7ma48jojpvx ... 9.MOV?dl=0

Only the 160 has been serviced.
Lego
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1147
Joined: 2007-04-18 11:42
Location: glasgow

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Lego »

KK all the way :o)
I know that tune
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

It's not a Klout but I get the message ;)
Lego
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1147
Joined: 2007-04-18 11:42
Location: glasgow

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Lego »

Charlie1 wrote: 2020-08-13 16:11 It's not a Klout but I get the message ;)
The most tuneful sound I ever had was with LK1 and 280 .I got a bit nervous when Ivor said a few caught fire ..so I'd unplug them at night :0)
I know that tune
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

Kairn/lk280 is a bit more forgiving towards your cd player than the 42.5/160. The Linn combo is easy to listen to though I find the Naim more “precise”.

With a Sondek as source I would not be surpriced if I ended up preferring the Naim combo but that would have to be shown.
Playing cd’s…………
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Yeah, the Linn amps make a more nicely balanced sound with Briks. Actually, this 42.5 is a bit leaner/harder than my 32.5 which is fuller and warmer, but the Linn amps are warmer still.

I find the first track suits the Linn amps well. They strike me as more tuneful.

The second track (once it gets going) suits the Naim amps better to my ears, with better timing (and rhythm).

They are bloody good amps. I could happily live with them instead of Naim. There is no sense of that analytical side I'd previously heard with the LK Majik and Kolektor. Shame that some Karin's are failing and I don't think Darran at Class A will service the Kairn, only the Klout.
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

It is often only the battery mounted solid inside that makes the Kairn fail. It can be fixed.
Playing cd’s…………
Spannko
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2292
Joined: 2008-01-24 21:46
Location: North East of The Black Country, UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko »

Gosh, this is one of the harder comparisons you’ve done I think, charlie1!

For two leading amps of their era to sound so different is crazy, and when I heard the Linn combo I thought the Naims would easily be the better of the two (from memory of your other comparisons). But the Naim just appeared to sound more forward, without adding any appreciable musicality. It was difficult to tell, but I was gradually drawn towards the Linns, feeling that they managed to squeeze an ounce more rhythm n toons out of your CD player. Plugging your DS into the amps might be interesting - it sounds great on your family system.

An LK280 + Spark would be great with your Isobariks!
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

I'm quite torn myself. If there's time tomorrow, then I'll compare against 32.5/160 using Sneaky.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Put the serviced 32.5 back into play since the 42.5 is a bit of an unknown quantity - I thought it did some things better, some things worse but not really compared properly.

Track 1
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6qjio028behe6 ... 3.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/4y5exxabylc70 ... 8.MOV?dl=0

Track 2
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uju25n4q6vyct ... 2.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pypbya0qyhev ... 9.MOV?dl=0

I'm really enjoying this midi CD player - is that wrong of me?! Maybe I should pickup a cheap one - was told the old Sony Playstation is quite good as a CD player or there's beck's NAD but that might lead me into tweaking!!
beck
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 2752
Joined: 2012-10-22 22:25

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck »

I enjoy your clips Charlie1 and think that the Naim combo is back in the lead but they are both enjoyable.

I think your carpet is worth all my tweaks together! :-)
Playing cd’s…………
anthony
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 786
Joined: 2007-02-04 22:39
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by anthony »

Charlie1 wrote: 2020-08-14 17:47 Put the serviced 32.5 back into play since the 42.5 is a bit of an unknown quantity - I thought it did some things better, some things worse but not really compared properly.

Track 1
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6qjio028behe6 ... 3.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/4y5exxabylc70 ... 8.MOV?dl=0

Track 2
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uju25n4q6vyct ... 2.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pypbya0qyhev ... 9.MOV?dl=0

I'm really enjoying this midi CD player - is that wrong of me?! Maybe I should pickup a cheap one - was told the old Sony Playstation is quite good as a CD player or there's beck's NAD but that might lead me into tweaking!!

Assume you phase invert when using kairn.
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Yep, good shout, but I did remember. I checked it the other way too just in case. Maybe they would be even better after a service.
Lego
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1147
Joined: 2007-04-18 11:42
Location: glasgow

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Lego »

Charlie1 wrote: 2020-08-14 17:47 Put the serviced 32.5 back into play since the 42.5 is a bit of an unknown quantity - I thought it did some things better, some things worse but not really compared properly.

Track 1
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6qjio028behe6 ... 3.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/4y5exxabylc70 ... 8.MOV?dl=0

Track 2
Kairn/LK280: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uju25n4q6vyct ... 2.MOV?dl=0
32.5/160: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pypbya0qyhev ... 9.MOV?dl=0

I'm really enjoying this midi CD player - is that wrong of me?! Maybe I should pickup a cheap one - was told the old Sony Playstation is quite good as a CD player or there's beck's NAD but that might lead me into tweaking!!
In the linn factory there used to be a ghetto blaster plugged into Linn Sara's , allegedly :0)

To me the Naim sound flat compared to the Linn
I know that tune
Charlie1
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4831
Joined: 2007-12-11 00:30
Location: UK

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 »

Lego wrote: 2020-08-14 22:41To me the Naim sound flat compared to the Linn
Yes, I hear the same. I do really like the Linn amps but the Naim pairing do something better for me as well. I would like the best of both really. I would probably have to live with the Linn amps to know if I really prefer them overall.

Owning Klout or 280 is no problem but I'd worry about the Kairn and they are still quite expensive. About double the 32.5 cost. Having said that Darran can replace the battery that often leaks onto the board and I would want pre-Brilliant toroidial PSU anyway.
Lego
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1147
Joined: 2007-04-18 11:42
Location: glasgow

Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Lego »

Charlie1 wrote: 2020-08-14 23:10
Lego wrote: 2020-08-14 22:41To me the Naim sound flat compared to the Linn
Yes, I hear the same. I do really like the Linn amps but the Naim pairing do something better for me as well. I would like the best of both really. I would probably have to live with the Linn amps to know if I really prefer them overall.

Owning Klout or 280 is no problem but I'd worry about the Kairn and they are still quite expensive. About double the 32.5 cost. Having said that Darran can replace the battery that often leaks onto the board and I would want pre-Brilliant toroidial PSU anyway.
When I went from Naim to Linn I did feel I was leaving something behind.
That edge of the seat excitement wasn't quite there. You just have to make your choice.
My Kairn has been having the error don't panic init for the last 15 years.
I know that tune
Post Reply