Playground for practical listening exercices

General HiFi discussion, using the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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Spannko
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Quadraspire X-Reference Rack

Post by Spannko » 2019-01-28 11:27

Here’s a comparison between a glass Quadraspire rack and the X-Reference

https://youtu.be/pecdSBc1luQ

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-01-29 19:46

beck wrote:
2019-01-28 08:13
It is always interesting to hear how the sound from a system evolves for the better (hopefully). What kind of changes can be heard? I think you will find them interesting. Here are the latest from my cd player:

2 days ago:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wqbqmmqfctojy ... 8.mov?dl=0

Yesterday:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yg2k2vj08xh8y ... 0.mov?dl=0

Latest:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/enxt95jclswo4 ... 2.mov?dl=0
I don't know what you have changed but I actually find Yesterday more enjoyable than Latest or 2 days ago. I didn't directly compare the other two to determine second best.
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Re: Quadraspire X-Reference Rack

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-01-29 19:54

Spannko wrote:
2019-01-28 11:27
Here’s a comparison between a glass Quadraspire rack and the X-Reference

https://youtu.be/pecdSBc1luQ
The glass standard Q4 was never that good a choice musically.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-01-29 20:35

Thank you for your input Thomas. It is always appreciated.

The interesting part of my investigation is that the only thing I change is the placement of the cd players powercable and how it is supported (or not). :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-01-30 09:48

Lovely music from danish Randi Laubeck. Which clip makes her sound most endearing?

Links removed.
Last edited by beck on 2019-02-02 15:26, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by tokenbrit » 2019-01-31 16:17

Middle one. Everyone knows 42 is the answer ;)
The first felt a little 'gentle'; the third felt a little insistent, esp the guitar; the second just felt better balanced between her (endearing) voice & (other) instruments.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-01-31 20:30

tokenbrit wrote: The first felt a little 'gentle'; the third felt a little insistent, esp the guitar; the second just felt better balanced between her (endearing) voice & (other) instruments.
I feel like I am very near optimal setup of the cd player (in my stand and system) but not completely satisfied with any of the clips. I feel the first and last clip has something in common and the second is a little different.
At the moment I use the last clip as a kind of reference against any newer attempts.

The hunt goes on.....

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-02-01 09:21

A follow up:

As tokenbrit pointet out there is something really lovely about the voice in the second clip. I really like listening to it. I hope I can get some of it back in my final setup.

After some minor setup adjustments I can now go to my closing statements: Without the proces of making the clips and posting them on the forum I would NEVER have gained the knowledge I have now about my system.

My cd player now plays everything from opera to metal music and I feel like buying new cd’s. It took me three months getting it right (because of my weird stand) but it was fun.

Happy hunting to all.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-02 21:48

Spannko wrote:
2019-01-27 20:18
Lego wrote:
2019-01-27 18:59
Charlie1 wrote:
2019-01-27 00:21
I've also found the best distance to the rear wall is a couple more cm out than I had them previously. I'd always been told to get Kans as close to the rear wall as possible, but the speakers are now 7.5cm away.
Kans on their stands usually always sound good hard against a solid Glasgow tenement wall preferably adjoining to flat next door and ~3' feet thick :0)
Totally agree. It’s the best I’ve ever heard Kans. I think some of the upgrades were checked for sound quality in such an environment, prior to release.
Got them at 5.5cm now and not tipping back. This is as close as they will go with Skeets fitted, which is fine cos the cables touch the wall otherwise. Think I prefer the stands as well now:

Keilidh stands: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wp1xp4rd8w6u2 ... D.MOV?dl=0
Kan II stands: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hgcqyq6cck8jg ... D.MOV?dl=0

Couple of new tracks - not very cool but I like them :)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pbxuqvmxnrv0j ... D.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/88x2xof0wfzfr ... D.MOV?dl=0

Been trying various tweaks but nothing worth posting. They do still sound 'shouty' in the Astral Weeks clip but I'm happy with the balance in the room itself, so I think I'll leave it there.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-02-02 22:00

Good work with the Kan II stands. I like them better now as well. Lovely present voices to be heard.

:-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by tokenbrit » 2019-02-03 00:55

Charlie1 wrote:
2019-02-02 21:48
Been trying various tweaks but nothing worth posting...
Does that include the 'room treatment' in front of the LPs? :)

The Keilidhs added an odd sound to my ears, before; seem to slow the music in these latest clips, and remove some of the energy from the performance. More life in the Kan II stands.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2019-02-03 01:48

The Kan stands sound better now and no negatives either. Good work Charlie1!

I saw the Rod album in one of your earlier clips and was hoping you’d play it at some time. The last time I heard that it was being played on a “music centre” with all the lights off while me and my mate entertained a couple of young ladies after school. Ahh, those were the days!

But, Elkie though? What were you thinking? lol! Don’t worry, your secrets safe with us - providing you play a Carpenters track next :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by donuk » 2019-02-03 11:30

I use the same Kan stands with my Totem model one signatures.
Interesting that the design seems to let the speakers breathe - that is you can feel the vibrations running through the steel struts. Certainly not a solid base for the speakers.

I have positioned the stands at 90 degrees to the normal way to enable my speakers to sit comfortably on the top plate without overhang. Seems fine.

Do you use the spikes on the top or bluetack between the speakers and the top plate? I have to use the latter because we have a lively cat!

Donuk beautiful downtown York.
Last edited by donuk on 2019-02-03 16:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-03 12:18

tokenbrit wrote:
2019-02-03 00:55
Does that include the 'room treatment' in front of the LPs? :)
Yep, and carefully tuned into position ;)
Spannko wrote:
2019-02-03 01:48
The last time I heard that it was being played on a “music centre” with all the lights off while me and my mate entertained a couple of young ladies after school. Ahh, those were the days!
Great the way music ties in with our memories.
donuk wrote:
2019-02-03 11:30
I use the same Kan stands with my Totem model one signatures.
Interesting that the design seems to let the speakers breathe - that is you can feel the vibrations running through the steel struts. Certainly not a solid base for the speakers.

I have positioned the stands at 90 degrees to the normal way to enable my speakers to sit comfortably on the top plate without overhand. Seems fine.

Do you use the spikes on the top or bluetack between the speakers and the top plate? I have to use the latter because we have a lively cat!
Nice to hear from you Don.

Yet to hear Totem speakers but would still like to.

Just spikes here and a dog who upsets the LP12 when he jumps on the bed. These Kans had never been spiked before. I've not pressed the Kans down too hard but I seem to recall Uxbridge Audio really pressing my Kan IIs down hard into the spikes and making obvious spike holes.

I was gonna try big chunky feet that raise the speaker above the spikes but never got around to it. Not confident it will be an improvement though.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-05 17:51

Kans vs Shahinian Larcs for anyone interested. Sorry, not quite the right volume match.

Kans: https://www.dropbox.com/s/qdwxhpek4pba1 ... D.MOV?dl=0
Larcs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/09fkprq3bdthg ... D.MOV?dl=0

I'm gonna buy the Arcs but not to replace the Kans which still seem to be my favourite speaker.

The Arcs are still good fun though and second hand I shouldn't lose out. They are very versatile and will replace the M140s in my office where they better suit the room.

I do need to get rid of these Kan II stands though. Just not enjoying music as much as before.

EDIT:
Kans on some chinese lamp stands is much more enjoyable with musicians seeming to play along more with one another and more harmonious. Happy now - the advantages of the Keilidh stands without them messing up the bass:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/t69k6i97iev2m ... D.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nh9nxwee218zf ... D.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xe19qu77akdrz ... D.MOV?dl=0

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2019-02-05 21:51

That’s a pretty hardcore flat earth system you’ve got there Charlie1! Very nice though, and I can hear why you’re enjoying the Kans so much. I like Shahinian’s and I’ve been reading good things about the Larcs so I thought that they might give the Kans a bit of a run for the money. They seem quite good, particularly their high frequency articulation, but the Kans are still more musical overall.

I must admit, even though the Kan stands create an unpleasant tonality, I find them a bit more musical than the tables (rhythm and tune wise), but if it’s sounding inharmonious in the room, I can understand why it detracts from your enjoyment.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-02-05 22:19

Not wild about the Kans on the Chinese stands. But then not wild about the Kans earlier nor the Larcs. However, Kans are not something I would recommend using on Skeets on carpet. I think they need to be better grounded to the floor to do what they were made to do.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-06 00:16

Thanks both for sharing your impressions.

It's wierd - I can relax again now which has put the focus back on the music. I couldn't relax with the Kan stands for whatever reason - it was just unsettling somehow.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-02-09 12:32


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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-09 13:19

DIfficult. I like both. I started off preferring the first one which seemed more fun and exhuberant. I then started drifting more to the second one which seemed a bit more harmonious. If pushed, I'd stick to my first impressions and clip 1. Could happily live with either though. Sounding great btw.

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by beck » 2019-02-09 16:14

I agree Charlie1. The first clip lets me forget the “hifi” more than the last.

If someone is thinking why I go on when I more than once have stated that I have finished my setup I can only say that each time I think I have reached the end new thoughts creap into my mind on how to improve it even further. :-)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Charlie1 » 2019-02-12 19:22

Been busy with various lamp stands and adding spikes and so on, only to retry the Kan II stands and think they are better after all, without Skeets. I assume I'd not done a very good setup job first time around as they sound more acceptable now.

Just connected up the Shahinians so that will be an interesting change - I like their added refinement compared to Kans.

Kan II stands first time: https://www.dropbox.com/s/gez77azkyyo2g ... 0.MOV?dl=0
Kan II stands now: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wh6xlaaq3qzmz ... D.MOV?dl=0
Shahinians now: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hfqy7f6g6fwvx ... D.MOV?dl=0

No idea why the last night is sideways :)

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by ThomasOK » 2019-02-12 19:45

Now we're getting somewhere. The first track isn't bad but the "Kan II stands now" is the first of this series of tracks that really pulls the music together. It was the only one that made me listen to the end and want it to go on longer. The LARCs don't really do anything for me. I'm not sure if that is because the Kans are in the room too, because of placement or just because they have a more top heavy balance. Anyway, not currently my cup of tea. But the Kans are now starting to cook.
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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by Spannko » 2019-02-12 23:42

Very nice Charlie1! It was a close call, but I think I might prefer the Larcs. I liked the way I could follow the tune of the rhythm guitar. I’d probably want to hear more before making a final decision, but anything that even comes close to matching the Kans for musicality is one hell of a speaker!

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Re: Playground for practical listening exercices

Post by tokenbrit » 2019-02-13 05:18

Seems like the Larcs are polarising: I don't like the sound of them - they sound unnatural to me, esp compared to the latest Kan clip. The Larcs sound small & farther away, but projected to try to make up for that; ending up a bit hollow & echoy. The shoutiness of the Kans has been tempered and they just come across with more natural presence. Of course they may sound different, relatively, on phones & laptops than they do in room, and I know we're supposed to be listening to the musical rather than the sonic differences, but the sound of Larcs is just putting me off.

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