Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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tokenbrit
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by tokenbrit »

Since the recommended length of 2.5m, for the BJCs, is between 8' & 8.5' with the caveat that too short sounds worse than too long for these LAN cables, is it OK to order 8' since BJC tend to run a little over, or are others here ordering 8.5' just to be on the 'safe' side? (I don't see a way to order in meters, only feet)
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by lejonklou »

You can email them and specify the length in metres, but you won't get the exact length you asked for with CAT6a.

8.5 feet is what I'd choose. The length is not a night and day difference, 3 m sounds great too.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

How do you manage long stiff data cables without them touching anything that would affect the music negatively?

It would be easy to solve with short cables, say 0.5-1m but...
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by lejonklou »

Paaf wrote:How do you manage long stiff data cables without them touching anything that would affect the music negatively?

It would be easy to solve with short cables, say 0.5-1m but...
What must they not touch? I haven't noticed any problems with that.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

In my experience eg. power cables and speakers.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

Here a photo of my switch and data cables; the cables touch the edge of the desk.

The cables pull with some force on the switch causing it to lift up in the other end (left in the photo). Attempting to reduce this force, I put a silicone pad between the cables and the desk (where they touch). It turned out that the pad also made the system more musical.

It was after discovering this that I tied the cables up to not touch the floor either - unfortunately increasing the force with which they pull the switch.

Of course, I could well be "hearing" things.. I have a lively imagination and my test protocol is subjective! :)
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Lego »

Paaf wrote:In my experience eg. power cables and speakers.
The way the netgear and switches in general are designed the default is that there is little chance of them touching power cables and even more so speaker cables
I know that tune
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by lejonklou »

I don't arrange cables in groups or not to touch behind a system. It does make some difference to the sound, but:

1) I don't find it to be important.

2) It's too impractical as I replace and move units way to often.

3) I find that a mess of cables behind the system usually sounds better than when they're very neatly arranged. The optimal appears to be a semi-mess.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

-pls remove-
Last edited by Paaf on 2018-10-30 14:16, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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lejonklou wrote:I don't arrange cables in groups or not to touch behind a system. It does make some difference to the sound, but:
1) I don't find it to be important.
My experience is that data cables touching power cables affects both the sound and the tunefulness - but my tests were not performed blindly (and I am not by any means an expert in separating the two). Do you agree.. but the difference is too small to be bothered with? Or did you mean "sound" as opposed to "tunefulness"?
2) It's too impractical as I replace and move units way to often.
3) I find that a mess of cables behind the system usually sounds better than when they're very neatly arranged. The optimal appears to be a semi-mess.
I have tried this now. My data cables were bundled a bit, it helped to avoid touching, but it made them heavy, pulling down more on the switch ports. I "freed" them and released them onto the floor, where they are free to roam and touch other cables etc. :)

I didn't ABA test that, but my impression, obviously affected by what I had just done, was a more "free" sound.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

I today replaced microconnect with blue jeans cables. I had ordered 2.5m on their UK site and they had translated that to 8'.

First I replaced the cable from switch to DS. Any direction was definitely better than the microconnect, and the direction definitely matters. "With text" was the best.

Then I replaced the cable from NAS to switch. I only tried the "with text" direction. Not as definite improvement as the other cable. Weird.

Anyway. Thank you so much for the recommendation!

EDIT: "Addendum" - I now compared the two cable directions from NAS to switch. Also this cable was better "with text".
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Defender »

Micro Connect Cables have changed again. I just ordered a pair of 3m MicroConnects but printing is different to the ones ThomasOK described. I cant tell you how they perform in comparison as I have no older Micro Connect version to compare with and also my ADS/1 is away for transformation to an ADS/3
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Defender »

the new ones are ordered as SSTP 603W S/FTP CAT6 3M WHITE LSZH and the marking on the cable is:

S/FTP CAT6 PATCH CABLE ISO/IEC 11801 27AWG TIA/EIA 568 LSZH
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Defender »

I would like to make you aware that Micro Connect seems to got lower with build quality.
Both ones I have dont have precisely made plugs. They have a rasor edge (not sure if thats the right english word) which stands over the top and made me rip off one of the metal latches (to provide contact with the shield of cable) on the ethernet port of my NAS drive when I tried to take the cable/plug out.

However since most of us are now going with Blue Jeans this might not be important anymore.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

I think it's important - I was thinking to buy a 5m Microconnect cable to use between the router and the switch, replacing the unmarked one I use today.

In general, should I expect a boost in tunefulness doing so?

I suppose I'd have to hunt for "old style good quality microconnect SSTP" rather than the "new poor quality microconnect SFTP"...
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by markiteight »

Paaf wrote: 2019-01-03 20:15 I suppose I'd have to hunt for "old style good quality microconnect SSTP" rather than the "new poor quality microconnect SFTP"...
Just curious...why do you resist getting the Blue Jeans cable that is readily available and found to be superior to the Microconnect?
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

They are only available from the US.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by markiteight »

Paaf wrote: 2019-01-03 21:55 They are only available from the US.
Yes, but they ship internationally.
https://www.bluejeanscable.com/shipinfo.htm
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

Read my post just a few posts above.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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Paaf wrote: 2019-01-03 20:15 I think it's important - I was thinking to buy a 5m Microconnect cable to use between the router and the switch, replacing the unmarked one I use today.

In general, should I expect a boost in tunefulness doing so?
Yes - see here: "Even from switch to router..."
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by markiteight »

Ah...I missed that. Apologies. That's a problem with threads where posts are months apart...must remember to read back to fully understand context!

I'm still a bit confused, though. It sounds like they shipped you cables that are a bit short of ideal, which according to Fredrik is much worse than erring on the long side. Have you spoken to BJC about possibly correcting this error? It also sounds like, despite the BJC's less-than-ideal length you still noticed a small improvement over the Microconnects. Is that indeed the case or did I misinterpret that too? ;-)
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

Post by Paaf »

Excellent find, tokenbrit, that's quite remarkable! Thank you!

markiteight, no problem. I'll explain better now.

The BJC cables were better than my older Microconnect. This made me forget to ask BJC about the slight error in length.

I prefer to buy from a local shop when possible to reduce shipping fees, custom fees, extra taxes, weird delivery services and so on.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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Paaf wrote: 2019-01-03 22:55 I prefer to buy from a local shop when possible to reduce shipping fees, custom fees, extra taxes, weird delivery services and so on.
That's quite understandable. Many of the HAKAI components I've had to source from overseas and the shipping alone has become a major factor in the total cost of the project. With bits coming from Finland, Germany, Spain, England, Scotland, and Puerto Rico, at least I can take solace in the fact that BJC's facility is mere blocks away!

I've been emailing back-and-forth with BJC about ordering a custom length, and they informed me that the process they use to terminate their network cable consumes "up to an inch per side or more." That means if you order 2.5 meters (8' 2 1/2") you'll end up with something close to 8'. But if you order 256cm (8' 4 3/4") you should receive a cable that's very close to 250cm long. We'll see if that's something they can do.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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Paaf wrote: 2019-01-03 20:15 I think it's important - I was thinking to buy a 5m Microconnect cable to use between the router and the switch, replacing the unmarked one I use today.

In general, should I expect a boost in tunefulness doing so?

I suppose I'd have to hunt for "old style good quality microconnect SSTP" rather than the "new poor quality microconnect SFTP"...
Although there might be influences in tune the cable from the router to the switch seems to be the one with the least influence. The issue I had can be solved in using a file or sand paper to get the edge away (even though I dont like to do such work on ethernet plugs).

With respect to tune: mine have been not totally run in - they might had about 72 hours. Yesterday I had a session and decided to go back to the Wireworld Chroma it should have replaced.

BTW I see you still use a GS105 - you can improve your tune with a GS108T (maybe more compared to changing the cable to the router)

With respect to the Blue Jeans we might start to think about group buys for Europe.
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Re: Best sounding LAN cable for DS

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markiteight wrote: 2019-01-04 02:14 I've been emailing back-and-forth with BJC about ordering a custom length, and they informed me that the process they use to terminate their network cable consumes "up to an inch per side or more." That means if you order 2.5 meters (8' 2 1/2") you'll end up with something close to 8'. But if you order 256cm (8' 4 3/4") you should receive a cable that's very close to 250cm long. We'll see if that's something they can do.
A small update:
BJC advised me that they can make a cable to a desired overall length for an additional charge (appx. $8USD), but "a hyper specific length request puts this into the "custom work" category, and is not eligible for refund under our return policy" (but will still be fully warranted against defects). As the ends on network cables don't add any appreciable length to a cable like speaker and interconnect terminations do, I specified 250cm overall. Today I received two Cat 6a cables that are exactly 250cm long.

Now I'm curious to see if all this nit-picking was worth the effort (and extra cost) versus just ordering 8.5 feet and hoping for the best.
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