Akurate DS

[audiokaas]

I went to a demo of the akurate DS which was very impressive.
Klimax DS was beyond reproach
Akurate cd, beautiful, sound, excellent on tune dem.
Akurate DS same beautiful sound on a par with the A-CD, defintely better than the CD on tune dem. much better seperation and easier to follow.

However (why is there always a catch) I found the A-DS suffered from sibilance. The A-CD & K-DS did not. It is the same sibilance that put me of the Majik-CD.
Can anybody confirm this or is it just a matter of warming up/running in. Slight variation in models?


BTW: I heard the "new" 242's for the first time. They now are defintely worth their money.

[Patrik]

I found the A-DS suffered from sibilance. The A-CD & K-DS did not. It is the same sibilance that put me of the Majik-CD.
Can anybody confirm this or is it just a matter of warming up/running in. Slight variation in models?

It's definitely variations between models. I've heard two akCD's one suffered from sibilance and one did not. Both models were several months old and internal cabling/directions were the same.

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD? Even Linn helpline answered me that akCD has an alluring warmth and can feel more rythmic because of a frequency bump at 3kHz. However the akDS is flat and more correct and tuneful. :shock:

[Patrik]

BTW my akDS do not suffer from sibilance.

[audiokaas]

It's definitely variations between models. I've heard two akCD's one suffered from sibilance and one did not. Both models were several months old and internal cabling/directions were the same.

That is not good news when the sibilance thing is essentially hit or miss at these prices or does it have something to do with it being on limited release?

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD? Even Linn helpline answered me that akCD has an alluring warmth and can feel more rythmic because of a frequency bump at 3kHz. However the akDS is flat and more correct and tuneful. :shock:

I'm not sure what you are saying here. I liked de A-CD a bit better as I felt it to be more "warm" sounding than the A-DS, however it was my impression that this was a tune-dem only forum

[ledcam]

Interesting comments on the 242's Audiokaas - can you tell us a bit more?

[audiokaas]

Interesting comments on the 242's Audiokaas - can you tell us a bit more?

Hmm, I'll try, it was reported, here too I think, that there were new bass drivers, network & active cards since december 2007, non retrofitable.

I liked the 242 but found them too clinical, excellent in tune-dem terms but just not involving which is what got me hooked on Linn. I blamed it on me being too used to the "old school"with kairn & ikemi.
This time around though I had none of these reservations and found them very involving. While maintaining their excellence in tune-dem terms, actually even more so come to think of it.

I hope this answers your question?

[Charlie1]

Out of curiosity, does anyone understand why the A-DS Tune Dem's better than the A-CD when playing the same source material (i.e. 16-bit/44.1kHz)? After all, they are similarly priced, but one is connected to a built-in CD transport and the other to an external PC. Is it related to jitter?

[audiokaas]

If I understood correctly :)
On the A-DS there is no need for real time error correction on the part of the mech. So no best guesses by the software as what the data is en hence no "fuzzyness" of the sound resulting in better tune-dem....

Now please include the 3k hump...

[Music Lover]

Now please include the 3k hump...

Agree!
I also prefer the "good old Linn" sound :mrgreen:

Midbass gives a great illusion of power, speed, dynamics and rhythm.
PRaT anyone?

[ledcam]

Many thanks for your reply audiokaas. Out of curiosity how were the 242's amped - aktiv or passive?

[Charlie1]

On the A-DS there is no need for real time error correction on the part of the mech.

Thanks audiokaas. Interesting stuff, although I must confess to not understanding much of what is said about these products on previous threads. All this talk about Twinky's and god knows what else :)

Are the DS products effected by the connection quality between the DS itself and the PC? I'm thinking about RJ-45 cable type and number/type of intermittent devices (i.e. switches and routers).

I presume customers can centrally locate a DS device in their main home and then feed remote locations, such as another residence. Although I think the dealers will find themselves in a 'world of pain' if they start getting involved in that area.

[Patrik]

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD? Even Linn helpline answered me that akCD has an alluring warmth and can feel more rythmic because of a frequency bump at 3kHz. However the akDS is flat and more correct and tuneful. :shock:

I'm not sure what you are saying here. I liked de A-CD a bit better as I felt it to be more "warm" sounding than the A-DS, however it was my impression that this was a tune-dem only forum

Sound instead of tune-dem - I think you started it

Seriously, I think it is disturbing when two akCD clearly sounds different. I didn't compare them side by side but Im pretty sure there was a difference in tune also.

[audiokaas]

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD? Even Linn helpline answered me that akCD has an alluring warmth and can feel more rythmic because of a frequency bump at 3kHz. However the akDS is flat and more correct and tuneful. :shock:

I'm not sure what you are saying here. I liked de A-CD a bit better as I felt it to be more "warm" sounding than the A-DS, however it was my impression that this was a tune-dem only forum

Sound instead of tune-dem - I think you started it

Seriously, I think it is disturbing when two akCD clearly sounds different. I didn't compare them side by side but Im pretty sure there was a difference in tune also.

just kidding, but you start of with:

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD

Actually no; I thought the A-CD was more tilted towards bass.
I think it was a typo as you go on saying that Linn helpline confirmed the A-CD to de humped at 3kHz.
So I'm just assuming we experienced the same.

And yes the variation in builds has me very worried. I can see me going back to the dealer "Euh, I don't want this one it has sibilance like the one in the demo" That way I'll make friends with him real fast.
Bill Livingstone was at the demo and I commented several times on the sibilance but he did not seem overly concerned. He said it just didn't resolve as well as the klimax-DS. but no indication that he thought this unit was excessively sibilant.

[audiokaas]

Many thanks for your reply audiokaas. Out of curiosity how were the 242's amped - aktiv or passive?

kisto -> chakra 2200 passive into 242

[audiokaas]

Are the DS products effected by the connection quality between the DS itself and the PC? I'm thinking about RJ-45 cable type and number/type of intermittent devices (i.e. switches and routers).

Nope, at least not more so than your software. If the connection is slow the DS might stutter. There are of course limitations, it's a big data stream especially in studio master quality. so wired 100Mb should be fine. I know the readynas recommends certain routers so you could check that (www.infrant.com)

[Moomintroll]

Are the DS products effected by the connection quality between the DS itself and the PC? I'm thinking about RJ-45 cable type and number/type of intermittent devices (i.e. switches and routers).

Only in that the connection works or it doesn't. It's "only" data being passed, not an analogue signal, and the connection protocols ensure nothing's lost in the journey.

CAT 5 Ethernet cables can be up to 100m in length, I believe, so, yes, you could feed a DS in another building as long as the network extended that far.

'Troll

[Charlie1]

it's a big data stream especially in studio master quality. so wired 100Mb should be fine.

Probably cost prohibitive to link sites in that case, at least for the next few years, unless a customer already has a big fat Ethenet extension service (i.e. BT WEES) between their home and office perhaps.

[Patrik]

just kidding, but you start of with:

Didn't you find the akDS more tilted towards bass than the akCD

Actually no; I thought the A-CD was more tilted towards bass.
I think it was a typo as you go on saying that Linn helpline confirmed the A-CD to de humped at 3kHz.
So I'm just assuming we experienced the same.

Tunewise we both seem to agree. But no, we are not experiencing the same soundwise. I feel that akDS is more bass tilted or pehaps is more flat than akCD. Thats why I asked Linn helpline who commented my experiences by mentioning the 3 kHz bump in akCD. It was not a typo just unclear language. :)

[Charlie1]

It's "only" data being passed, not an analogue signal

Of course - doh! :oops: Back to school for me!

[audiokaas]

Tunewise we both seem to agree. But no, we are not experiencing the same soundwise. I feel that akDS is more bass tilted or pehaps is more flat than akCD. Thats why I asked Linn helpline who commented my experiences by mentioning the 3 kHz bump in akCD. It was not a typo just unclear language. :)

Ok so tilted is the operative word.
I use in the sense of elevated increased. The A-CD is Bass heavy/increased/elevated and A-DS is IMHO not. I like the bass hump of the A-CD and would instantly buy the A-DS if it did not have the sibilance and did have the hump. :D

[Patrik]

Tunewise we both seem to agree. But no, we are not experiencing the same soundwise. I feel that akDS is more bass tilted or pehaps is more flat than akCD. Thats why I asked Linn helpline who commented my experiences by mentioning the 3 kHz bump in akCD. It was not a typo just unclear language. :)

Ok so tilted is the operative word.
I use in the sense of elevated increased. The A-CD is Bass heavy/increased/elevated and A-DS is IMHO not. I like the bass hump of the A-CD and would instantly buy the A-DS if it did not have the sibilance and did have the hump. :D

:) :? Im sorry it seems that I'm confusing you. Linn replied that akCD has a hump at 3000 Hz a pretty high frequency, not bass freq. at all. In effect akCD should sound thinner - bass decrease.

The interesting points are, I think

1. I've heard 2 akCD sound different.
2. You and I have heard different sound presentations of akDS.

Conclusion: Different units of the same sort (akCD, akDS etc.) don't sound the same. Hopefully this applies to a higher degree for sound and not for tune. But I strongely suspect that even tune quality is varying between units.

Perhaps this is not so strange. I've heard of people buying many cables and sorting out the good ones and selling off the bad ones. (Buy ten Klimax DS, choose the best and sell the rest :D

[Charlie1]

Hi Moomintroll, Just going back to your point about it being a digital stream between DS and PC, not an analogue signal, and so the cable doesn't matter. I just recalled that when I used to own a twin-box CD player, there was a sound difference between an optical and coaxial link between DAC and transport. Does that not suggest that it can make a difference?

[paolo]

Are the DS products effected by the connection quality between the DS itself and the PC? I'm thinking about RJ-45 cable type and number/type of intermittent devices (i.e. switches and routers).

Charlie1,
being a network engineer I've been overly surprised to experience with the DS several "effects" I used to consider theoretically impossible to happen. Nothing in the ip packets path (NAS, switch, network cables, etc) should make any difference to the sound if network errors remain an event *extremely* rare - as always is in any well implemented and not faulty Local Area Network. The fact is that, in my experience, all of the above DO make a difference to the sound of the DS!

Paolo

[Charlie1]

Hi paolo, Do you think a crossover cable is the best method of connectivity then?

[audiokaas]

:) :? Im sorry it seems that I'm confusing you. Linn replied that akCD has a hump at 3000 Hz a pretty high frequency, not bass freq. at all. In effect akCD should sound thinner - bass decrease.

Ok,

We're on the same page again, semantics drive me crazy :D
I see what you mean
The hump though at 3kHz is just below the range of the human voice and usually represented by the bass units, hence the confusion on my part. I feel in musical terms it ads magic maybe even the key to PRAT.

Hmm still not sure which to buy though A-DS is the future no doubt anf buying the A-CD seems not like agood long term investment, just imagine listening to those studio-masters, shall I buy both.... :mrgreen: