Power cords

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

petertwj wrote:Does the operating temperature and the type of IEC connector (C13 10A, C13 15A or C15) would possibly affect SQ?
I may be wrong, but I think the answer is No. Every connector sounds a bit different, but usually there is no correlation to ratings or models or types.

Ozzzy's advice is right: Trial and error is the way to go.
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Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

Hi all

Do anyone believe or tried sending your receptacles or cables for cryogenic to see if there is any SQ improvement? Or is it just a marketing gimmick?

Peter
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Re: Power cords

Post by jiddu_k »

Hi all,

I´m looking for some non-fancy euro power cords as I´ve run out of my stack of Lejonklou power one. When I purchased these (long and short ones) in 2009 (some of the last ones Fredrik had in stock) I preferred them to the Linn cords that came with my Klimax gear (I-Sheng, Longwell, Ta Hsing, Baohing, Tongyuan the last two being the best of them).
Has someone compared the latest Linn euro power cords to older ones?
Is it possible to specify the cable supplier, when ordering cords from Linn?
How about the power cords provided with Lejonklou gear?
Has someone compared his cables to Linn?
Is it possible to purchase them separately?

Best regards - Manfred
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

This is a tricky one, Manfred!

I find that my old Shuko (Euro style) Power One is the best sounding power cord for two products only: Lingo and Artikulat A350. On both of those, I have tested many cords and found Power One to be the best. I'm not sure why, as when I've designed power supplies, I've tried to intentionally make them suit a particular power cord. But I've not been able to succeed with this.

For all other units than Lingo and Artikulat A350, I've found several other cords to better Power One. I find the best ones are Volex Tongyuan, Volex Ta Hsing and Volex Baohing, Longwell (several models and years) and ASAP. Roughly in that order, but only if the direction of the cable is correct.

Actually the cable direction is a more crucial parameter than I thought a few years ago. If the cable direction is wrong (and it often is in 50% of the cables you buy), there is something not quite right with the music. And when comparing, the model with the wrong direction falls 3-4 steps in the ranking list. So I'd rather have a Baohing with the right direction than a Tongyuan with the wrong direction, for instance.

Just my 2 cents. Currently I supply the latest Longwell cord for the European market. It's good, about as good as Volex Baohing. But I still think that the right model of Volex Tongyuan - with optimal direction - is the musically most informative Shuko power cord so far.
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Re: Power cords

Post by jiddu_k »

Hi Fredrik,

thanks for your quick answer. Do you really recommend to buy current Linn stock cords? Or to buy them til one ends up with enough Tongyuan in the right direction??? Seriously, I just want to get rid of the bad ones. So if your cords will at least have the right direction I´d like to give them a try if there for sale separately.

Best regards - Manfred
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

I don't know what cord Linn supplies in Europe, so no, I don't recommend buying theirs. Did I say that?

The best thing to do is probably that I ship you a couple of the cords I currently supply, and then you can tell me what you think. Let's take it on pm!
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Re: Power cords

Post by jiddu_k »

Hi Fredrik,

that´s a great offer, thanks - will pm. Yes, I did get the impression that you recommended buying Linn cords - or that you didn´t want to sell your new power cords separately. Apparently I misread your statement in which wanted to state your current cord ranking including the best known (but hard to find) Linn cords.
In the meantime I realised that I´ve not just run out of power one but that my best Linn cords are already in use as well. So I´m definitely in need of some new power cords.

Thanks again - Manfred
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

There's something that needs to be clarified:

There are no "Linn cords". They've never made a cord of their own, but just supplied standard power cords. The brand and models change regularly. You seem to think that "Linn cords" are Volex power cords? I believe it's been a number of years since they used Volex.

With the exception of Power One, which was made to my specification, I do the same as Linn: Pick standard cords and supply them. I currently use Volex for my UK and European phono stages, but Longwell for the European removable cordsets.
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Re: Power cords

Post by The FlatEarther »

It's been a long while she nice this thread was updated.

I note Linn are now supplying power cords made by ASAP, has anyone tested them?
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

I've supplied ASAP cords with my products for the European and UK markets. Then I changed to a Longwell cord for the European market. But I still use the UK ASAP's.

They're pretty good. Unfortunately not the best, but the best have become painstakingly difficult to source.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Paaf »

I started looking for a good EU power cord... then many hours had passed.

a)
Longwell seems verrry elusive.

b)
Volex has a few options on Mouser.se:
2111H 10 C3
17850 10 C3
2125H 10 C3
17850 326 C3
VL-1024-23-200
and probably others that I didn't find. What model numbers should I look for?
(Farnell website is down. Elfa doesn't have Volex.)

c)
I also found Microconnect LSZH power cables somewhere, did someone already test and disregard these? (At least their data cables are pretty awesome!)
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

not sure what those numbers mean but I checked my Volex Tongyuan for you and it has S/370 SABS 1574 on it its „with text“ but was not suplied by Linn

its interesting as through this tread I got answers to questions which came up some years ago and have never been answered till now

I thought I should try to build my own power cable with the following assumptions:
low impedance
as least as possible material changes

so I ended up making a cord from a Kimber 8VC and Furutech CU plugs (not recommended as it violates EU rules) ... the stranded structure of the Kimber for low impedance and the Furutech for keeping it all copper

outcome? compared it to a Electrocompaniet power cord which I got for my amp and a HIRAKAWA-C (company from Japan) which seems to be standard supplier for TEAC Esoteric
the HIRAKAWA was better than the self made one and the Electrocompaniet.

I could not understand what I was hearing but wired my system with HIRAKAWA.
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Re: Power cords

Post by matthias »

Defender wrote: I could not understand what I was hearing but wired my system with HIRAKAWA.
Interesting,
where do you get these?
Thx

Matt
Last edited by matthias on 2018-10-28 15:37, edited 1 time in total.
Matt

MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
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Re: Power cords

Post by FairPlayMotty »

They're on eBay lots.
Everything is a remix: Copy, Transform, Combine.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

just to make sure you dont get me wrong - I am not saying the Hirakawa ones are better than Volex Tongyuan because I just have not tested it.

But I came to the same conclusions that there is a certain quality in standard power cords with molded plugs which I didnt expected (the self made cord and the Electrocompaniet had screwed on plugs) ... and the Kimber even higher quality copper.

Maybe the Hirakawa are worth a try as they come from from Japan and those guys take things serious.

I am currently trying to source enough Volex Tongyuan to swap out all Hirakawa and make my mind up.
But am am just a beginner with Tune dem and wouldnt call myself as someone who has golden ears.
I just have feelings in case some things sound weird.

What confuses me right now is whenever I think tune dem tells me something is better at the same time I have the feeling the better choice also means my system sounds „thinner“ with less bass.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Tendaberry »

I have 2 Electrocompaniet power cords lying around here. They are a lot worse than all the standard Linn cables I've tried (and also than the Lejonklou Power One). It can even be clearly heard on my Cisco switch.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

managed to find another Tongyuan power cord with text but the issue is it has no Volex plugs but different ones the - wall plug is straight and not 90degree

what is more important the wire or the Volex plugs?

I am asking because I also found some Longwells but they are all „against text“.

I feel the power cords need at least 48hours for run in before a good judgement can be made.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Paaf »

I have found one source of Longwell EU power cords. Weirdly, there is no writing on the cables, only "Longwell LP-33L" etc on the plugs. Unknown territory so avoid?
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

yes I would avoid it - there is so much variety
my search for some nice Tongyuan ended up in some :) ...but only one is really right means with text and the usual volex connectors

1 is with text but no volex connectors (that let me understand that the connectors make a big difference because it sounded not musical)
1 is against text has all the volex connectors and I dont know what tickeled me to measure it but it had the life wire where the neutral is on the IEC plug ... sure we are in Europe and we can just turn the other side
1 is against text but only has the straight AC plug but the rest is fine

so life is a compromise :)

here is what I did:
the Pre got the one which is alright and thats the one which is the first in the distribution block
the DS got the one which is almost right meaning just against text and is the second in the distribution block
the Amp got the one which is against text and has the straight plug

I happened to also found some Longwells from 2011 with text but only 0,75mm2 and only with straight AC plug
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Re: Power cords

Post by Paaf »

I won't buy them so I share the link here. Perhaps someone here feels like an adventure.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/TEN-LONGWELL-N ... 3322349844
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

matthias wrote:
Interesting,
where do you get these?
Thx

Matt
Hi Matthias,
I just realised that I didnt really answered your question as there was a message from someone else that you can find them through ebay.
Mine came with Teac Esoteric gear and I always kept them when I sold the equipment. I have heard they came as standard also with Sony equipment. Mine are from around 2004 and 2006 and I am not sure if they produce the same quality anymore.
They are certainly worth a try - maybe mine have the advantage that they are completely run in. Only the one Tongyuan which is with text and everything right can hold against them.
I thought even if the against text makes the Tongyuans drop 3-4 levels they end up beeing better than most of what you can source right now. But the Tongyuan AT can not hold against Hirakawa ... in my system ... to my ears.
I have a suspicion that new power cables need a lot of run in time for whatever reason (but maybe I am crazy).
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

For those of you who are trying to source Volex power cords there is the following website:
www.buerklin.com
they offer shipment to Europe

Volex Power cables are TA HSING or BAO HING according to specification documents

VOLEX Schuko M2511A, IEC V1625 3x0,75mm2 2 Meter
VOLEX Schuko M2511A, IEC V1625 3x1,00mm2 3 Meter

I have no information if they are with text or against text.
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

Defender wrote: 2018-11-13 14:56 For those of you who are trying to source Volex power cords there is the following website:
www.buerklin.com
they offer shipment to Europe

Volex Power cables are TA HSING or BAO HING according to specification documents

VOLEX Schuko M2511A, IEC V1625 3x0,75mm2 2 Meter
VOLEX Schuko M2511A, IEC V1625 3x1,00mm2 3 Meter

I have no information if they are with text or against text.
That plug and connector sounds good, but the best length for a 1.00 mm2 cable is 2.5 m.
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Re: Power cords

Post by Defender »

yes ;) but I thought its better to have a compromise than nothing

nowadays it seems there is either a compromise to take on:
cable length
mm2
Volex Schuko M2511A plug
or even a different cable manufacturer
cable direction

not sure if thats the right order of importance
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Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

Defender wrote: 2018-11-13 22:37 yes ;) but I thought its better to have a compromise than nothing

nowadays it seems there is either a compromise to take on:
cable length
mm2
Volex Schuko M2511A plug
or even a different cable manufacturer
cable direction

not sure if thats the right order of importance
I don't know the exact order of importance either, but mm2 and cable length are interdependent. So if you change one, the optimal value for the other one will change.

Connector seems more important than the plug.

Connector seems more important than the cable brand/model.

Cable brand/model performance is not static. For instance, Longwell cables have the year of manufacture marked on them and they appear to vary in performance over the years. The cables that Volex often use (Tongyuan, Ta Hsing and Baohing - often this is the order from best to worst) can sometimes change, for instance when changing to a different gauge (mm2).

Cable direction is for some reason really important. Sometimes the best sounding cable is not very good in the wrong direction.

It's complicated! :)
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