Power cords

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

Moderator: Staff

User avatar
rowlandhills
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 582
Joined: 2008-01-27 19:25
Location: York, UK

Post by rowlandhills »

Ah, okay. I was confused by the last two labelled "Made in England" as I was wondering who would make a US power cable in England!
KRDSM, Tundra to 242s
Silvers, K400, Hutter rack
MidLinnCrisis
New member
New member
Posts: 3
Joined: 2014-02-19 20:23

Post by MidLinnCrisis »

Well, I do think your question is still a good one; I am in Canada, so why do I have North American power cords that say Made in England?

I have two more cords I will get the info for tonight. I believe they are both 14AWG.

I'm not sure the BAOHING does say VOLEX on the plug but I'll check that, too. Need to get out a magnifier for that - getting old, I guess!
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Post by ThomasOK »

MidLinnCrisis wrote:Hi All
I was asking about Linn stock cables and was directed here. All my Linn components have been purchased used so I am never sure if I am getting a stock Linn power cable, not to mention I wasn't sure what one would look like anyway!
After reading through this thread I went to my box 'o power cords and took down all the markings on the cable ( I did not think to mark down what was on the plugs). I have rearranged some of the markings to make them easier to compare:
YEH YANG E92770 SVT 75º AWG18X3C VW-1 CSA TYPE SVT LL58352 FT2 60º 0 444016 [72”]
BAOHING (UL) E159216 SVT 3X18AWG VW-1 CSA TYPE SVT LL112007-1 LF [77”]
CHUNG KWANG E94024 SVT 75º AWG18X3C VW-1 CSA TYPE SVT LL65965 60º FT2 0 544001 [72”]
LONGWELL-P (UL) E55333 SVT 105ºC 3C/18AWG 300V VW-1 CSA TYPE SVT 105º FT2 (N.M.) [72”]
APOLLO (UL) E55351-4 SVT 75º 18AWGX3C VW-1 CSA TYPE SVT LL34977 FT2 60º [72”]
I-SHENG (UL) E88265-K SVT 18AWGX3C VW-1 CSA TYPE LL81924 SVT 60ºC FT2 [72”]
I-SHENG (UL) E88265 SJT 75º 18AWGX3C VW-1 CSA TYPE LL81924 SJT 60º FT2 O 444027 [81”]
I-SHENG (UL) E88265 SVT 75º 18AWGX3C VW-1 CSA TYPE LL81924 SVT 60º FT2 O 444027 [96”]
I also had two other cords with no lettering on the cable itself but this on the plugs:
PENCOM USS 15A MADE IN ENGLAND [77"]
PENCOM USS 15A MADE IN ENGLAND VOLEX [77”]
I included the length in case this helps wit identification. So, from what I have read so far it would appear that the BAOHING and LONGWELL might be Linn stock cables. Anything else ring a bell with anyone?

Thanks, Brian
Welcome to the forum, Brian. I think I can help you sort this out.

There are a a few characteristics common to all US Linn cables I have seen: 1) they are all 18AWG, 2) they are all SVT (if they are marked) and 3) they are all about 72" to 76" long not including the ends. So this will eliminate 14AWG and 96" cables, etc.

In terms of modern Linn AC cables (I would say going back at least about 15 years) there have been three suppliers: Volex, Longwell and currently I-Sheng. I will deal with these first. Linn Volex cables will have the Volex name on the plugs and will be specific plugs. Molded into the IEC end of the plug will be the model number V1625 (on the bottom of the plug) and molded into the end of the AC connector (between the flat pins) will be the model number PS204. Volex made a number of other plugs but any besides these two means it is not a Linn AC cable. The Volex cables were supplied from about 15 years ago until 2 or three years ago and had wire from different companies. These were Tongyuan, Baohing and Ta Hsing which did have somewhat different performances as you can read earlier in the thread. The Baohing you have appears to be one of these.

Then about two years back Linn switched over to Longwell who makes both the plugs and wire - these are still my favorite AC cable. I don't have one here to check the markings but I believe the Longwell you have, especially if it looks fairly new, is one of those. The latest cable is an I-Sheng E88265-C. I don't believe it is the same as any of the I-Sheng cables you have as it is 105°C and about 75" without the connectors. This is the only cable I can currently supply as I ran out of the Longwell some time back.

Linn supplied other cables before the ones I mentioned above and this is kind of interesting. They had an unmarked wire with the Pencom connectors you mentioned and the 15A Made in England markings on it so I believe the ones you mentioned are also Linn cables. This series was not as musical as the newer Volex cables. What makes them interesting is that some cables were marked Pencom on both ends, some cables were marked Pencom on one end and Volex on the other (like one you list) and yet others said Volex on both ends. But the ends otherwise look the same as does the cable. My best guess is that Volex bought Pencom and used the same connectors at first switching later on to the connectors mentioned above. I believe Linn also had some early cables made by I-Sheng but I don't have any samples around so I don't know the markings. The first one you list might be one of these, the other two are unlikely to be from Linn due to length of construction.

None of the other cables, the Yeh Yang, Chung Kwang or Apollo are anything I have ever seen with a new or traded-in Linn product.

I hope this helps.
MidLinnCrisis
New member
New member
Posts: 3
Joined: 2014-02-19 20:23

Post by MidLinnCrisis »

Thanks to all for the great information. These cords have come from a variety of possible sources and have all been just lumped together the "stock cord" category.
As I mentioned, all my Linn products have been purchased as used and certainly none are 'new' as in the last two or three years sense. What cords I have that maybe stock Linn would have come from a Mimik, AV5103 or Wakonda, or LK85 or Lk100.
Looking more closely at the BAOHING cords (I have two), indeed they both show VOLEX V1625 10A 125V~ at the IEC end and VOLEX PS204 at the plug.
The LONGWELL has "LONGWELL" printed on the IEC as well as LS-13, and LP-30B at the plug.
Upon closer inspection the word is PENCON with USS 15A Made in England on the plug and 10/250~ HS10S IEC320 BS4491 N/10495 as well as many quality symbols printed on the IEC end (also looking into the receptacle it is white inside).The conductors appear as if they are twisted under the sheathing.
So, so far it appears that the two BAOHING cables and the LONGWELL might be good to try on my system in place of the aftermarket cords I am currently using. Am I to assume that if Linn supplied these cables as stock on their components it was across the board and a different type/size/spec of cable is not required depending upon whether you are powering a power amp (such as an LK85) or a preamp, CD player, etc?
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

Hi all

I have a couple of Longwell 2008 Cable with LS-60 and LS-60R End Termination. Mixture of Schuko, India and UK Plug.

As I am living in Singapore, which uses 220V. Would I get better sound quality by getting the 250V variant of HBL5965VBLK? or it doesn't make a difference? I am currently using Forvar FW-500F Condtioner.

I compared two Longwell 2008 cables with the same LS-60R End Termination, however the main plug is different, one uses Longwell LP-34A 16A 250V Longwell Schuko Plug, the other uses LP-65 6A 250V Longwell India Plug. Schuko Plug sounds so much musical than the India Plug. However, Schuko plug earthing is not compatible with my power conditioner due to it's universal plug.

Even my Longwell UK Plug with AMR Fuse does not sound as good as Schuko. Would Hubbell 15A / 20A US plug sounds better than the Longwell Schuko plug?

So does the Ampere and / or Voltage on the main plug affects the sound / picture quality?

My apologies, I am new to this hobby and willing to learn.

Please advise
Thank You
Peter
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

Hi Peter and welcome to the forum!
petertwj wrote:So does the Ampere and / or Voltage on the main plug affects the sound / picture quality?
No, they don't. For safety reasons, make sure that both are adequate for the intended use!

Quality of sound is obtained only by trial and error, taking notes and sharing your findings here. There are very few rules but lots of collective experience.

Does that power conditioner do any good? I tried many in the past, but gave up when they all sucked the life out of my system.
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by ThomasOK »

I can tell you that the US Hubbell plugs do not sound as musical as the molded-on plugs on the US version of the Longwells but I have no experience of the Schukos.
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

lejonklou wrote:Hi Peter and welcome to the forum!
petertwj wrote:So does the Ampere and / or Voltage on the main plug affects the sound / picture quality?
No, they don't. For safety reasons, make sure that both are adequate for the intended use!

Quality of sound is obtained only by trial and error, taking notes and sharing your findings here. There are very few rules but lots of collective experience.

Does that power conditioner do any good? I tried many in the past, but gave up when they all sucked the life out of my system.
Thank You for your warm welcome, lejonklou. :)

Is it safe to use a 125V Plug in an environment using 220V? My conditioner is reporting 237-242V with Longwell 2004 UK Power Cable.

Is it safe if it is more than adequate?
For my Klipsch Promedia 2.1 - It uses a I-Sheng Power Cable, 3A UK Plug for stock. I replaced it with Longwell 2008, 10A UK Plug with AMR Gold Fuse, with Cloverleaf to IEC Adapter. It sounded smoother and the bass is more nuance.

Wanted to try it with 15A Hubbell US Plug as US Plug is compatible with my Forvar Power Conditioner.

Forvar Power Conditioner makes the sound cleaner and I could feel stronger bass instantly from my Klipsch Promedia Subwoofer compared to when I plugged it into my Belkin Power Strip. Forvar Power Conditioner sounds even better when it is hooked with Longwell Power Cable.

There are some other China-branded made with high quality German Components Power Conditioners such as Bada, Weiduka, etc. High Quality at a great price.

Warmest Regards
Peter
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

ThomasOK wrote:I can tell you that the US Hubbell plugs do not sound as musical as the molded-on plugs on the US version of the Longwells but I have no experience of the Schukos.
I have not tried the US Hubbell plugs before. However, in my experience with UK and Schuko Hubbell plugs, UK Hubbell Plug sounds a bit weaker in vocal and clarity. Schuko Hubbell plugs brings out the vocal and clarity with very well-controlled nuance bass.

But it's a pity that Forvar power conditioner does not support Schuko even though it work without earth. It feel a bit of tingling and spike sensation on the surface of the product. (less safety) Therefore, I switch back to UK Longwell Plugs after testing out India Longwell Plugs does sound a little harsh.

I would try to compare US Hubbell Plugs with Schuko Longwell Plugs, if Schuko still sounds nicer, I would probably replaced to a power conditioner that supports Schuko plugs.

Warmest Regards
Peter
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

Hi Peter!

Please note that on this forum, we use the Tune Method to evaluate performance. The result of such a comparison is musically Better or Worse.

I am mentioning this because your descriptions of performance (smoother, harsher, stronger, etc) don't tell me anything about the musical qualities.

I would be truly surprised if I found a power conditioner that could improve the musicality of my system. Or any system. To me they represent the dirty backyard of the HiFi market, where useless and unnecessary products are sold to ridiculous prices. 99% of all cable and accessory companies are on that same back yard. I have yet to hear a fuse labelled HiFi or plated with gold that didn't decrease the musicality of the system.

When I come across systems with an exotic blend of power conditioners, expensive interconnects, special fuses, different power cords for different products, isolation feet, damping bags, cable elevators and/or crystals, I politely ask for permission to rip everything out. If I get approval, I replace it all with my recommended dirt cheap distribution blocks, my standard (also cheap) power cords connected in the best order, Linn blacks everywhere (unless some good silvers are available) and single wire K400-split-in-half as short as possible but no shorter than 2.48 m. Then I ask the owner to leave it like that for a week. I can only recall one person who went back to fiddling with his esoteric stuff. Most have been amazed at how much more fun music has become.
petertwj wrote:Is it safe to use a 125V Plug in an environment using 220V?
No!
petertwj wrote:Is it safe if it is more than adequate?
Yes!

P.S. I hope this didn't come out as rude, because that was not my intention. I am just very passionate about all of this.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

Fredrik, have you any experience of using a balanced mains for your music system?
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

Ozzzy189 wrote:Fredrik, have you any experience of using a balanced mains for your music system?
With balanced mains, do mean when on a 230V mains there are two 115V lines out of phase, instead of 230V and neutral (0V)?

If so, my suspicion is that the so-called balanced design is a little worse. I have never been able to directly compare the two using the same system, however, so I'm not certain.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

Yes, 115 on live and 115 on neutral. It's supposed to be a huge improvement. There was a fella on the linn forum who'd bought a balanced mains transformer, £500 I think it was, and he was waxing lyrical. Then there's the claims from russ Andrews, but there's also his prices..... Christ on a bike!
Anyway, it's something I've thought about before, just wondered what you thought.
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
donuk
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 406
Joined: 2010-02-21 13:25

Re: Power cords

Post by donuk »

Consider your domestic insurance before doing anything like this. If it ends in tears you do not want to homeless.
Donuk. Sunny downtown York.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

Hi don. You just buy a special transformer and plug it in the hifi socket then plug your bits into the transformer. Something like that anyway!
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

A so-called balanced supply is standard in some houses. That means you have it in your wall.

Adding a transformer in between your mains and your HiFi has an effect similar to the utterly unnecessary mains filters; it softens the sound, decreases dynamics and makes the system less musical. That is so far my experience and I doubt there is any special transformer out there that overcome the inherent limitations - which is that they add impedance between your mains supply and HiFi.
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

Thanks for the clarification Fredrik, I thought that would be the case!
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

That said (and after those words I am allowed to contradict myself, am I not?), I can imagine that at some odd places, in some countries, the mains quality is so terrible that a mains filter or transformer might actually do more good than bad.

I just haven't experienced it myself. Nor, I believe, have any of the enthusiasts whose advice I trust.
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

lejonklou wrote:Hi Peter!

Please note that on this forum, we use the Tune Method to evaluate performance. The result of such a comparison is musically Better or Worse.

I am mentioning this because your descriptions of performance (smoother, harsher, stronger, etc) don't tell me anything about the musical qualities.

I would be truly surprised if I found a power conditioner that could improve the musicality of my system. Or any system. To me they represent the dirty backyard of the HiFi market, where useless and unnecessary products are sold to ridiculous prices. 99% of all cable and accessory companies are on that same back yard. I have yet to hear a fuse labelled HiFi or plated with gold that didn't decrease the musicality of the system.

When I come across systems with an exotic blend of power conditioners, expensive interconnects, special fuses, different power cords for different products, isolation feet, damping bags, cable elevators and/or crystals, I politely ask for permission to rip everything out. If I get approval, I replace it all with my recommended dirt cheap distribution blocks, my standard (also cheap) power cords connected in the best order, Linn blacks everywhere (unless some good silvers are available) and single wire K400-split-in-half as short as possible but no shorter than 2.48 m. Then I ask the owner to leave it like that for a week. I can only recall one person who went back to fiddling with his esoteric stuff. Most have been amazed at how much more fun music has become.
petertwj wrote:Is it safe to use a 125V Plug in an environment using 220V?
No!
petertwj wrote:Is it safe if it is more than adequate?
Yes!

P.S. I hope this didn't come out as rude, because that was not my intention. I am just very passionate about all of this.
Noted, thanks for pointing me out on my errors. Would there be any sonic difference if I change it with a more expensive Hubbell Plug such as Hospital Grade? Or I should just settle with the affordable plugs?

For 250V 15A Nema6-15P Model in Singapore
HBL5666C - S$14.70
HBL5666CA - S$17.80
HBL5666VY - S$10

Please advise
Thank You
Peter
User avatar
lejonklou
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 6524
Joined: 2007-01-30 10:38
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by lejonklou »

I have never tried the Hubbell plugs, but I know that Thomas OK has. Hopefully he has some answers.

I have so far not found any screw on plugs that have been better than the moulded on plug of a good sounding power cord. I have tried screwing, crimping, soldering and combinations of them (but not welding, perhaps that can be good if done optimally). I am not sure exactly why the molded on plugs are as good as they are, but it's evident that the mechanical properties of the plug matters. Why? Because if you move a pair of pins from a plug (the best pins I have found happen to be made of solid brass without plating) between different housings, the sound varies quite a bit.
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

Hi all

Does anyone have Longwell US Plug (NEMA 6-15P), 15A IEC, 14 AWG / 3C SJT Cable to sell? As I am getting Hubbell IG5461 or IG5661 Receptables as an SQ upgrade over stock MK UK Receptables.

I am not able to find Longwell US cable in SG. I have tried to contact Longwell SG through phone or e-mail, but they are not contactable, I went to the office, but they could have moved or already non-existence. Longwell website has only been up again recently a day or 2 ago, but the page has not been update since 2009. I was wondering does Longwell still exist internationally?

Peter
petertwj
New member
New member
Posts: 7
Joined: 2015-10-07 12:32

Re: Power cords

Post by petertwj »

Hi all

I am still doing some research on power cords before purchase. Does the operating temperature and the type of IEC connector (C13 10A, C13 15A or C15) would possibly affect SQ? Some snake uses C13 (Naim) and some uses C15 (Furutech, Shunyata)

If yes, I may consider Tripp Lite Power Cord, US$10 per cord, the one with C15 connector is almost double the price.

If no, I would just order several Longwell 14AWG Longwell US cable with Right-angled C13 connector at taobao, cost about US$3+ each, probably cheap due to cable being manufactured there or Volex (Belden) 17504

Please advise
Thank You
Peter
Ozzzy189
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 702
Joined: 2011-08-30 18:49
Location: North Lincolnshire -UK.
Contact:

Re: Power cords

Post by Ozzzy189 »

You will probably have to bite the bullet and buy a few, listening to each one, then place a full order once you have selected the best. Just an idea.
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
Post Reply