Personally I like to listen loud, I prefer passive high sensitivity speakers like the 3677s.

today I swapped stands and even though its only 2cm in height I feel its a clear change but maybe also because the stands now are better connected to the ground.

hight is now at 60,5cm (with a room hight of 2,50Meter)
distance to back wall is at 10,9cm
distance between loudspeakers is 1,45Meter but that is limited because of to short interconnects

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-13 20:17 Personally I like to listen loud, I prefer passive high sensitivity speakers like the 3677s.

Compared to what Matt

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-14 00:30

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-13 20:17 Personally I like to listen loud, I prefer passive high sensitivity speakers like the 3677s.

Compared to what Matt

.......active low sensitivity ones Lego.

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-14 06:59

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-14 00:30

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-13 20:17 Personally I like to listen loud, I prefer passive high sensitivity speakers like the 3677s.

Compared to what Matt

.......active low sensitivity ones Lego.

Which ones and what were the issues

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-14 10:38 Which ones and what were the issues

Look at this thread, hum issues with AC powered speakers, further being unable to use AC powered speakers in my environment, no desire to change anything regarding speakers.......:-)

thats a valid opinion - everyone draws a line somewhere.

The JBL 308s need care with the setup - as Jajo described. If you take the effort they reward you with something special. If thats within your lines is something only you can decide. I already hear their potential. But they have limits and thats in my opinion more on the HF side than on the LF side - the LF side is impressive.
The HF side gets stressed very fast if you crank up volume.
But I still have 2-3 options for optimisation. So lets see.

If they create a ground loop with the Akurate DS I have I am ready to even try a rough method which is breaking of the ground pin in the socket - I payed the equivalent of linn silvers for the 308 so I am ready to test it that way.

If interested in this type of speakers I would surely go for 708Ps. They simply do not have the limitations of 308Ps and use a fine compression driver.

u252agz wrote: ↑2022-01-13 19:14
Although the 110s are not at well endowed in the Bass department, or the dynamic range - they do have some bass and dynamics, easily enough for me to enjoy the music and 'hum along'. The Bass drum and Bass guitar are not absent, just reduced in quantity. The timing and rhythm of the track are still there, and to my ears, preferable to many larger speakers. My Ninkas being a case in point.

The same would apply to a great pair of musical headphones, with which a good source and amp can sound very musical.

It is of course preferable to keep the musicality and increase the quantity of bass, but only if the quality is there- the latter to my ears is far more important..

Indeed, Ninkas are not relatively tuneful speakers.
Whilst they may be larger than 110's they are hardly in the large department when it comes to woofer size: 2 x 160cm mid-woofers.

Speakers that I've found to be relatively tuneful include:
Quad Electrostatics
Medium efficiency (92 to 95 dbs/watt @ 1 metre) sealed box speakers with 12" or bigger woofers with good quality drivers.
High efficiency speakers with good quality drivers / horns and some attention to the bass not letting the speakers down too much..

There are other speakers that I've not auditioned that have the potential to be relatively tuneful, such as Apogee panel speakers, MBL speakers...

When I have done listening tests I've found large, easily detectable, fundamental and very significant differences in the tunefulness between speakers - especially when they have widely different design philosophies.

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-14 11:26 If interested in this type of speakers I would surely go for 708Ps. They simply do not have the limitations of 308Ps and use a fine compression driver.

sure - but the 308 is a nice demo kit to try out if the route to a 708 makes sense. If you cant make something out of the 308 than moving to the 708 makes no sense but if you realize the 308 is wonderful but is lacking if you need more force, dynamic and stress free loud listening than the 708 makes sense.

I would completely trust jajo's assessment regarding the qualities of 308Ps and 708Ps.
From his impressions the 708Ps appear to be other animals than the 308Ps.
I do not think that one has to own first 308Ps before upgrading to 708Ps.
OK, the 708Ps are much more expensive but even less than a pair of good mono amps. :-)

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-14 12:19 I would completely trust jajo's assessment regarding the qualities of 308Ps and 708Ps.
From his impressions the 708Ps appear to be other animals than the 308Ps.
I do not think that one has to own first 308Ps before upgrading to 708Ps.
OK, the 708Ps are much more expensive but even less than a pair of good mono amps. :-)

In all fairness they are surely the same species and they have many similarities. Musically, they are pretty close at "normal" volume levels. 708P is quite a lot better on low/high volume.

It is safe to use 308P as a test before going for the 708P. If you like the way they communicate the emotions in music and movies, but you find them to be a bit too weak when playing loud or a little dull on low volume, then 708P will solve those issues. They scale better. Also, I find the 708P to be less fatiguing in longer music sessions. They have the quality of sounding very soft but still dynamic and detailed at the same time.

Like I previously wrote - the 708P is not ten times better than 308P for most people but personally I would have bought them even if they were 10000 EUR a pair. That is how much I like them. But if the question would be to have 308P with a better source instead to fit a budget, that would be a very easy choice. You get almost everything that really matters with 308P. The major thing they lack is that feeling of limitless power and control.

I think you have to listen at pretty low volumes to compromise the musicality of 308s and have never got anywhere close to the upper limit for it be relevant.

Having once visited a forum member who played his 350s so loud that I could feel the bass in my chest - I realise that I never play ‘loud’ and would likely not benefit from 708s.

for me one difference with the 308 compared to floorstanders is that I dont hear the musicality when I am in another room or upstairs. Whereas with the floorstanders I sometimes have the feeling when I am upstairs that downstairs is a private gig of the band in my house. Its not soo much about volume its more about „filling the house with music“. That is one thing I really miss.
Another thing with the 308 is that I get the feeling there is almost only one „right“ volume for the individual music (this is a neutral statement).
With the 308 I realise that I like Apple Lossless over Wave and Flac and DSD (which … meaning DSD … I formerly appreaciated really much) is the least precise and structured and engaging of the formats.

u252agz: sometimes a bass line makes fun and I turn up and the HF gets into a more unpleasant region but my room is 30 m2 and has an open kitchen/dining area attached to it so I am probably asking for too much from this tiny speakers

Defender wrote: ↑2022-01-15 12:50 „filling the house with music“

OT, but anyway this is a strong point of 3677s.

Cat made me do it :P

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:07

Defender wrote: ↑2022-01-15 12:50 „filling the house with music“

OT, but anyway this is a strong point of 3677s.

+1

maffe wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:21
Cat made me do it :P

Nice photo, maybe these would fit:

https://blackcatcable.com/

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:35

Nice photo, maybe these would fit:

https://blackcatcable.com/

That could end up in a Cat-astrophe!

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-14 10:46

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-14 10:38 Which ones and what were the issues

Look at this thread, hum issues with AC powered speakers, further being unable to use AC powered speakers in my environment, no desire to change anything regarding speakers.......:-)

You use an Lp12 Matt there are only hum issues with Linn Ds and Hakais.What do you have that'll cause a hum issue

maffe wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:21
Cat made me do it :P

Haha and great image Maffe.I'm considering putting my LP12 on a wall shelf.What were the benefits.?

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-15 15:02 You use an Lp12 Matt there are only hum issues with Linn Ds and Hakais.What do you have that'll cause a hum issue

Even at maximum output I have no hum with my 3677s Lego, only a slight hiss!

Lego wrote: ↑2022-01-15 15:05
Haha and great image Maffe.I'm considering putting my LP12 on a wall shelf.What were the benefits.?

Ergonomics and in this case on a budget. Would love to have a better looking solution, this was ment as a test, that I still using since 2 years now.

matthias wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:35

maffe wrote: ↑2022-01-15 13:21
Cat made me do it :P

Nice photo, maybe these would fit:

https://blackcatcable.com/

I like the photo too. I don't know about the cables but I think their poster would fit nicely.