Playground for practical listening exercises

[lejonklou]

Short sofa, judging by those clips.

But on the long sofa clip, left channel seemed to be covered and muddled, which made me a little less certain of the comparison.

[TMV]

Could long sofa "come back" after re-tuning the speakers?

[Charlie1]

Short sofa more engaging for me too.

I slightly compromise my system for room aesthetics. It’s important to me to have a nice environment to listen in. I suspect you’d quickly get used to any improvement so is it really worth it? - assuming you don’t prefer the short sofa for comfort/asthetics/practical reasons.

[Spannko]

Of the two, I preferred the short sofa too. Are we listening to your LP12 on the Mana table?

[springwood64]

Are we listening to your LP12 on the Mana table?

Yes. It's now playing with Akito 3B and Adikt instead of the old worn Akito 1 and ATVMN95C

[springwood64]

Interesting that the feedback is unanimous in preferring the short sofa - not what I expected!

I'm not sure how to explain that - in the room the short sofa sounds so difficult that I get stressed listening to the music. It took me a while to link the change in the system to the change in the sofa arrangement.

When I reverted to the long sofa against the balcony wall the stress vanished.

Behind the sofa is a double glass balcony door (triple glazed with aluminium frame), which I guess is reflecting the high frequencies. When music with a lot of highs plays, I hear a harsh distortion that seems to cause almost instant stress.

The long sofa covers about 80% of the width of the doors whereas the short sofa just 25%

To retain the short sofa I would definitely have to retune the speaker positions, but I wonder how much success I would have, given the 2m or so width of reflecting glass I would need to negate.

[Spannko]

Are we listening to your LP12 on the Mana table?

Yes. It's now playing with Akito 3B and Adikt instead of the old worn Akito 1 and ATVMN95C

I thought so. I noticed what I’d describe as an audiophile/hifi sound creeping into your system when you added the mana table. Like you, I initially found “short sofa” uncomfortable to listen to, but since the “long sofa” didn’t really provide a musical solution, I voted for SS.

[Charlie1]

Had another listen.

Think I might have been suckered in by the better sound/balance of the short sofa clip. Obviously, is not the same for you in the room.

[springwood64]

Are we listening to your LP12 on the Mana table?

Yes. It's now playing with Akito 3B and Adikt instead of the old worn Akito 1 and ATVMN95C

I thought so. I noticed what I’d describe as an audiophile/hifi sound creeping into your system when you added the mana table.

Hmm. Interesting. Maybe I should experiment with de-Mana-ing the shelf. I've got an idea that might be worth a try.

[Spannko]

Yes. It's now playing with Akito 3B and Adikt instead of the old worn Akito 1 and ATVMN95C

I thought so. I noticed what I’d describe as an audiophile/hifi sound creeping into your system when you added the mana table.

Hmm. Interesting. Maybe I should experiment with de-Mana-ing the shelf. I've got an idea that might be worth a try.

I look forward to hearing the results of your experiments 😊

[tokenbrit]

Interesting that the feedback is unanimous in preferring the short sofa - not what I expected!

I'm not sure how to explain that - in the room the short sofa sounds so difficult that I get stressed listening to the music...

Have you listened to the clips and, if so, do you get the same stress from the 'short sofa' clip as you do in the room?

Of course, the clips may be missing elements that cause your in-room stress but, between the clips, it just felt to me like the fundamentals were better with Short: more together with Short than with Long, which seemed disjointed & out of time with(in) itself in comparison.

[Tendaberry]

Another vote for "short sofa", but they sound so different and I perceived "long sofa" as louder, so it was difficult.
But judging by your recording, you might need a better version of Tapestry, I can recommend this one: https://www.discogs.com/release/2600549 ... g-Tapestry
Yours sounds a bit like my UK reissue from the mid-70's.

[Spannko]

….. judging by your recording, you might need a better version of Tapestry, I can recommend this one: https://www.discogs.com/release/2600549 ... g-Tapestry
Yours sounds a bit like my UK reissue from the mid-70's.

Good thinking Tendaberry. It didn’t occur to me that the version we’re listening to could be a poor one.

[Whatsmynaim]

springwood, why not try to cover the last 55% of the glass doors (where the long sofa used to be) with maybe some thin fabric? To prevent high frequencies bouncing around causing a stressful sound.
It might be the thing that solves the problem while keeping the musicality intact.

[springwood64]

Have you listened to the clips and, if so, do you get the same stress from the 'short sofa' clip as you do in the room?

If I listen to the clips at high volume on the system, I don't hear the same harshness as I heard from 'short sofa' (as I'm currently set up with long sofa), but short still sounds harsher to me than long.

If I listen via headphones on my PC I can hear a difference. Both sound a little unpleasant and but I'm not sure which I'd choose.

So maybe the clips are not really conveying what I'm hearing.

[springwood64]

...you might need a better version of Tapestry, I can recommend this one: https://www.discogs.com/release/2600549 ... g-Tapestry
Yours sounds a bit like my UK reissue from the mid-70's.

I actually have two copies and the other one sounded a little worse.

However it's not just Tapestry that caused stress - most recordings on LP and on Kalla sound worse to me with short sofa.

[springwood64]

springwood, why not try to cover the last 55% of the glass doors (where the long sofa used to be) with maybe some thin fabric? To prevent high frequencies bouncing around causing a stressful sound.
It might be the thing that solves the problem while keeping the musicality intact.

I have found that drawing the curtains over the glass doors (and other large glass areas) has a small benefit, but interestingly it is dwarfed by the sofa. Our curtains are double-lined, so they are reasonably substantial, but perhaps its not surprising that the much bulkier sofa has more impact on reflected frequencies.

Although I could also experiment with the absorption panels I tested earlier this year, placing those in front of the doors.

[springwood64]

Which do you prefer?

Wood: https://photos.app.goo.gl/p9czAFHWMYevKXqr8

Glass: https://photos.app.goo.gl/GnQmcUH9zaNK2X1n6

Used the iPad to record these so hopefully better quality.

[Whatsmynaim]

This one was tricky with no obvious winner in my ears.
Wood sounds more focused but also got a boxy tone to it. I think I pick Glass since it sounds less shut in and flows a tiny bit better.
But since they're musically almost equal it probably comes down to how it sounds for you in the room.

[lejonklou]

I agree this one was very tricky.

Hard to pick a winner.

[Charlie1]

I prefer wood.

[tpetsch]

I agree, very close but I feel Glass is ever so slightly more in tune, notice that the guitar and voice are more in sync with Glass, with Wood the guitar seems to lag a bit. But like was said this could be a recording/PC playback anomaly.

[springwood64]

Could long sofa "come back" after re-tuning the speakers?

I missed this comment: good point. I do plan to revisit the speaker tuning at some point.

A lot has changed since I last tuned them. I have to wait until everyone is out of the house for a few hours though ...

[Tendaberry]

Tricky one: I prefer Tracy's singing on glass, but the bass has more of its usual stride on wood.

[springwood64]

But judging by your recording, you might need a better version of Tapestry, I can recommend this one: https://www.discogs.com/release/2600549 ... g-Tapestry
Yours sounds a bit like my UK reissue from the mid-70's.

IMG_20240906_124810781_MFNR.jpg

Found this one down the back of a sofa...

Def better than my others