JBL 308P and 708P

General HiFi discussion, using the Tune Method to evaluate performance

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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by ThomasOK »

Discodave wrote: 2021-10-08 19:59 Has anyone tried or have an opinion on using 109 stands with the 308s? Ta
Actually, I meant to ask that too. Since they are similar to Katan stands but probably a bit more stable with larger platforms top and bottom it seems like they might be a good option.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by lejonklou »

They're also a little lower in height than Katan stands. Might work well!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Discodave »

Aha!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by u252agz »

The main Hi Fi room was returned to me by my mother in law yesterday - bless her.

I could not resist quickly trying the 308s on my Q Acoustic stands ( small footplate but solid build and height of 600mm) and fed by Spotify/KDS2 and Sagatun Monos.

I did not have time to adjust the speaker posisitions- set at probably 1.7m apart and 100mm from a solid wall with the bass output reduced to the lowest number.

They sounded really, really good! Very musical, great dynamics and very coherent. For the money, they are just ridiculous value.

I think if I set them up properly and put them in place of my 242s - I would not feel shortchanged. They have a very different character compared to Tundra Monos and 242s but have that crucial ability to fully engage you and demand that you just sit and enjoy the music.

The only downside is that aesthetically, they are no shrinking violets and compared to the walnut 242s, cannot blend as well into the room furnishings.

They were returned to the guest bedroom before my wife could see them, and now biding their time, waiting for Giella Pi and a source to do them justice.

Jajo - If you are ever coming to the UK, I owe you at least a beer or two for this recommendation.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Discodave »

Lol at biding their time. Great stuff.

Also fantastic that the forum has come up with a pair of speakers that are both musical and a fraction of the price of their comparators, but ALSO provide amplification, saving another small fortune!

Im tempted to source a pair and store in the attic for a future time when I need speakers again.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by FairPlayMotty »

Discodave wrote: 2021-10-12 16:56 Lol at biding their time. Great stuff.

Also fantastic that the forum has come up with a pair of speakers that are both musical and a fraction of the price of their comparators, but ALSO provide amplification, saving another small fortune!

Im tempted to source a pair and store in the attic for a future time when I need speakers again.
A pair being delivered here on Friday night. Intended for the secondary system here. Nod to Jajo!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Discodave »

Apologies Jajo, Looks like i should have been doffing the cap to you. And so with a little fanfare.....I do :)
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by Defender »

great find! so does the smallest most musical system look like Källa directly connected to the JBL 308p and using the volume on the speakers - does that work and do we know how this influences musicality?
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by ThomasOK »

Defender wrote: 2021-10-12 17:25 great find! so does the smallest most musical system look like Källa directly connected to the JBL 308p and using the volume on the speakers - does that work and do we know how this influences musicality?
I would say probably not. For one thing I would guess (though I'm not sure) that the volume control on the 308P is a DVC and would likely be much less musical than a Kikkin or especially a Giella ∏. Even if it is not a DVC it is still highly unlikely to be near as musical as those devices. Then there is also the usability aspect with the knobs on the back of each one changing volume will be a PIA and trying to keep the two channels balance as you change the volume is likely to be an even bigger PIA. But you could do it if you really wanted to.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by u252agz »

I am planning a very small Giella Pi in between - this will allow me to connect the Grados when I’m in the mood.

By the way, the offer of a few beers does of course also extend to ThomasOK for supplying the pristine Mark 1 308p with the custom interconnects.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tokenbrit »

u252agz wrote: 2021-10-12 17:57 I am planning a very small Giella Pi in between - this will allow me to connect the Grados when I’m in the mood.

By the way, the offer of a few beers does of course also extend to ThomasOK for supplying the pristine Mark 1 308p with the custom interconnects.
Listening to Radio Paradise? ;) I can bring beers :)
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by u252agz »

As it happens, I am listening to Radio Paradise ( but in the kitchen with Sneaky/Rega brio and Ninkas , whilst cooking).

I also owe you some beers, for setting me up with RP - so no need to bring them!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by FairPlayMotty »

Ahead of receipt of my 308P I had a look at a few reviews of the 708P and 308P. There was some consensus that the 308P performs better with a subwoofer. At less than £90 the attached enables a subwoofer to be attached and the DSP to be adjusted via MiniDSP. Having a good quality subwoofer to hand I'll perhaps give it a try after a few months - my main passive speakers give me extremely deep and musical bass.
rps20211013_222828.jpg
rps20211013_222913.jpg
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by jajo »

FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-13 22:39 Ahead of receipt of my 308P I had a look at a few reviews of the 708P and 308P. There was some consensus that the 308P performs better with a subwoofer. At less than £90 the attached enables a subwoofer to be attached and the DSP to be adjusted via MiniDSP. Having a good quality subwoofer to hand I'll perhaps give it a try after a few months - my main passive speakers give me extremely deep and musical bass.

rps20211013_222828.jpg
rps20211013_222913.jpg
I recommend the LSR310S subwoofer from the same series as the 308P. It is a very musical subwoofer that has a built-in filter that is tuned perfectly for 308P. Signal would then go to the subwoofer and then on to the 308P. A friend of mine use 308P with two LSR310S (one per channel) with superb results.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by FairPlayMotty »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07
FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-13 22:39 Ahead of receipt of my 308P I had a look at a few reviews of the 708P and 308P. There was some consensus that the 308P performs better with a subwoofer. At less than £90 the attached enables a subwoofer to be attached and the DSP to be adjusted via MiniDSP. Having a good quality subwoofer to hand I'll perhaps give it a try after a few months - my main passive speakers give me extremely deep and musical bass.

rps20211013_222828.jpg
rps20211013_222913.jpg
I recommend the LSR310S subwoofer from the same series as the 308P. It is a very musical subwoofer that has a built-in filter that is tuned perfectly for 308P. Signal would then go to the subwoofer and then on to the 308P. A friend of mine use 308P with two LSR310S (one per channel) with superb results.
Thanks Jajo, great to know but the miniDSP route with my subwoofer will be a cheaper test - the DSP cut off point for the subwoofer seems to be fairly well agreed. There seem to be some mutterings about a beneficial effect of a subwoofer for the 708P though by all accounts they deliver much deeper than the 308P so that seems dubious to me. The logic for the subwoofer seems to be taking the lower end strain away from the 8" woofer. Does that make sense to you?

I'm pleased that the DSP for both JBL models has been hacked and apparently the accuracy confirmed by JBL.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by jajo »

FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-14 01:17
jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07
FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-13 22:39 Ahead of receipt of my 308P I had a look at a few reviews of the 708P and 308P. There was some consensus that the 308P performs better with a subwoofer. At less than £90 the attached enables a subwoofer to be attached and the DSP to be adjusted via MiniDSP. Having a good quality subwoofer to hand I'll perhaps give it a try after a few months - my main passive speakers give me extremely deep and musical bass.

rps20211013_222828.jpg
rps20211013_222913.jpg
I recommend the LSR310S subwoofer from the same series as the 308P. It is a very musical subwoofer that has a built-in filter that is tuned perfectly for 308P. Signal would then go to the subwoofer and then on to the 308P. A friend of mine use 308P with two LSR310S (one per channel) with superb results.
Thanks Jajo, great to know but the miniDSP route with my subwoofer will be a cheaper test - the DSP cut off point for the subwoofer seems to be fairly well agreed. There seem to be some mutterings about a beneficial effect of a subwoofer for the 708P though by all accounts they deliver much deeper than the 308P so that seems dubious to me. The logic for the subwoofer seems to be taking the lower end strain away from the 8" woofer. Does that make sense to you?

I'm pleased that the DSP for both JBL models has been hacked and apparently the accuracy confirmed by JBL.
The DSP will however greatly affect the end result. My experience with miniDSP is not positive. The JBL sub has a great filter that has very little effect on the musicality of the 308P and makes the integration very good.

Give miniDSP a try of course but if it works bad, I recommend trying the JBL subwoofer instead.

Indeed the 708P works very well without subwoofer. The 8” driver handles lowend much better. I personally didn’t want to go the subwoofer path and that is why I got 708 to replace 308.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07 I recommend the LSR310S subwoofer from the same series as the 308P. It is a very musical subwoofer that has a built-in filter that is tuned perfectly for 308P. Signal would then go to the subwoofer and then on to the 308P. A friend of mine use 308P with two LSR310S (one per channel) with superb results.
I've been contemplating giving the 310 a try because integrating it into my system might help reduce bass output. My only complaint about the 308 so far is that in my small room I can't fully tame the bass. Even with the bass level switch in its minimum setting there's still too much of it. Granted I haven't tried optimizing their position yet, and that will happen first before I consider the subwoofer route. Fortunately the 308's bass performance is fantastic, so having a bit too much of it is kinda like getting a generous pour of a really good wine.

Assuming I can't tame the bass by optimizing speaker positions in the room, I have a couple quesitions: 1) Is the 310's musical performance up to the standards of the 308 (sounds like it might be), and 2) Do the 310's level controls provide a wider range of attenuation such that I'd be able to tame the bass in my room?
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by FairPlayMotty »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:32
FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-14 01:17
jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07

I recommend the LSR310S subwoofer from the same series as the 308P. It is a very musical subwoofer that has a built-in filter that is tuned perfectly for 308P. Signal would then go to the subwoofer and then on to the 308P. A friend of mine use 308P with two LSR310S (one per channel) with superb results.
Thanks Jajo, great to know but the miniDSP route with my subwoofer will be a cheaper test - the DSP cut off point for the subwoofer seems to be fairly well agreed. There seem to be some mutterings about a beneficial effect of a subwoofer for the 708P though by all accounts they deliver much deeper than the 308P so that seems dubious to me. The logic for the subwoofer seems to be taking the lower end strain away from the 8" woofer. Does that make sense to you?

I'm pleased that the DSP for both JBL models has been hacked and apparently the accuracy confirmed by JBL.
The DSP will however greatly affect the end result. My experience with miniDSP is not positive. The JBL sub has a great filter that has very little effect on the musicality of the 308P and makes the integration very good.

Give miniDSP a try of course but if it works bad, I recommend trying the JBL subwoofer instead.

Indeed the 708P works very well without subwoofer. The 8” driver handles lowend much better. I personally didn’t want to go the subwoofer path and that is why I got 708 to replace 308.
Many thanks Jajo!
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

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markiteight wrote: 2021-10-14 01:34 Assuming I can't tame the bass by optimizing speaker positions in the room, I have a couple quesitions: 1) Is the 310's musical performance up to the standards of the 308 (sounds like it might be), and 2) Do the 310's level controls provide a wider range of attenuation such that I'd be able to tame the bass in my room?
2) (assuming your problem is with the amount of bass below 80Hz) It would appear so with the recommended crossover setting, and the 310's own volume control. The way I read the 3-series manual is you can attenuate the sub output effectively dialing down the bass volume relative to the 308 volume of frequencies above 80Hz. Without the 310 you're adjusting the volume of all frequencies reproduced by the 308s.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by markiteight »

tokenbrit wrote: 2021-10-14 02:35 2) (assuming your problem is with the amount of bass below 80Hz) It would appear so with the recommended crossover setting, and the 310's own volume control. The way I read the 3-series manual is you can attenuate the sub output effectively dialing down the bass volume relative to the 308 volume of frequencies above 80Hz. Without the 310 you're adjusting the volume of all frequencies reproduced by the 308s.
Hey there's a thought! I should RTFM. When R-ing TFM I came across this little gem: "...ideal balance is achieved when the position of the volume control on the subwoofer is set to the same position as the volume control on the main speakers." I have the 308's level controls set to maximum, so it sounds like anything less than max on the 310's level control will be attenuating its output relative to the main speakers.
tokenbrit wrote: 2021-10-14 02:35 Without the 310 you're adjusting the volume of all frequencies reproduced by the 308s.
Yes, with the Volume control knob that's the case. But there's also an LF Trim switch that offers a -2, 0, or +2 dB bass contour. I thought I had that set to the -2 position but on closer inspection it turns out both speakers are set to +2! No wonder I've been battling too much bass. I don't know how they got there except that maybe while blindly moving the switch I momentarily forgot that I was reaching down from above and all the controls are therefore inverted. Oopssss...
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by tokenbrit »

Haha. I guess that what happens when you get it bass ackwards :D Good that it was something simple...
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by u252agz »

My 308s are in a smallish guest bedroom ( 5m x4m) and too close to the window ( 75mm) - they sound good on the -2 dB setting. On '0' there is too much bass - good quality but too much.

In the Hi Fi room downstairs they were also too close to the wall behind, I think ( 125mm) but sounded great with the -2 setting.

I wish Jajo had not mentioned the 310s.

It looks like something I may have to explore when I have run out of things to do.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by jajo »

markiteight wrote: 2021-10-14 01:34 Assuming I can't tame the bass by optimizing speaker positions in the room, I have a couple quesitions: 1) Is the 310's musical performance up to the standards of the 308 (sounds like it might be), and 2) Do the 310's level controls provide a wider range of attenuation such that I'd be able to tame the bass in my room?
1) Yes, properly installed it improves musicality versus only using 308P

2) Yes, you have a gain knob to adjust level below the lowpass filter (set to 80hz)

Good idea to start with tuning of the 308 first. Most bass problems are related to wrong placement. Good thing is that in all systems I’ve installed with 308+310, the position of 308 has not changed after adding the 310.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

Post by FairPlayMotty »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07 My experience with miniDSP is not positive.
What was that experience Jajo? Apparently the JBL DSP code has been hacked and verified by JBL.
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Re: JBL 308P and 708P

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FairPlayMotty wrote: 2021-10-14 22:10
jajo wrote: 2021-10-14 01:07 My experience with miniDSP is not positive.
What was that experience Jajo? Apparently the JBL DSP code has been hacked and verified by JBL.
I’ve owned one miniDSP and tested a few more and they never performed well. Even in passthrough mode they destroy the musicality.
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