Digital hifi systems biggest problem?

[beck]

Is digital hifi systems biggest problem that it is near impossible to control how unwanted vibration interact with the digital music signal from start to finish?
Even in an all analog setup like mine records with music recorded using digital processing seem much more sensitive to unwanted vibration. They very quickly become unnatural to listen to if the setup is not right.

[matthias]

Is digital hifi systems biggest problem that it is near impossible to control how unwanted vibration interact with the digital music signal from start to finish?
Even in an all analog setup like mine records with music recorded using digital processing seem much more sensitive to unwanted vibration. They very quickly become unnatural to listen to if the setup is not right.

Interesting, can you elaborate further?
Why do you think vibration is the cause?
Do you mean it does affect playback of LPs as well if the recording is made with DSP?
DSP is nearly always made with PCM, so what about digital recordings made with DSD?

Matt

[beck]

Sorry for an unfucused start on this tread. Let me ask the following:

Is unwanted vibration a bigger problem to the music signal when in digital form?

[matthias]

Sorry for an unfucused start on this tread. Let me ask the following:
Is unwanted vibration a bigger problem to the music signal when in digital form?

With other words:
Is the the mechanical set-up of a Klimax DS or DSM a bigger problem than the set-up of a LP12?
Maybe vibration in the digital domain is an area not explored yet?
So it is possible that a DS or DSM with the circuit boards isolated by a sub chassis like LP12 would outperform a stock one!

Matt

[beck]

Sorry for an unfucused start on this tread. Let me ask the following:
Is unwanted vibration a bigger problem to the music signal when in digital form?

With other words:
Is the the mechanical set-up of a Klimax DS or DSM a bigger problem than the set-up of a LP12?
Maybe vibration in the digital domain is an area not explored yet?
So it is possible that a DS or DSM with the circuit boards isolated by a sub chassis like LP12 would outperform a stock one!

Matt

Yes, that is my question! :-)

[matthias]

Isolating circuit boards by a sub chassis is what Naim did with the 552 pre amp.

Matt

[beck]

In a digital system the handling and storage of the music signal is spread out on different hardware (harddisk, streamer, d/a converters in speakers plus cables) that maybe all should be isolated from vibration? On a record player all handling and storage is centered on the platter that is isolated from unwanted vibration.

[matthias]

On a record player all handling and storage is centered on the platter that is isolated from unwanted vibration.

Yes, but there are vibrations in circuit boards of analog systems as well.
Some years ago I disconnected the speakers from the external passive filter of my SBL but left the connection from the XO to the amp. After turning up the volume at the preamp I could easily listen to the distorted music from the vibrating circuit board of the passive XO!!!
So, passing electrical signals through circuit boards does cause vibrations BUT I am not convinced that vibrations are digital systems biggest problem. IMO, there are more important topics in digital systems.

Matt

[Spannko]

I think you have a good point, beck. All circuits are appear to be influenced by vibrations, and the support can make or break an otherwise excellent system. I haven't heard the Harmomylium, but I know that it's been designed to allow components to maintain their musicality, and those who have heard it say it achieves its aim. It wouldn't work if components weren't sensitive.

[tokenbrit]

It should be a simple test, shouldn't it? If digital signals are more sensitive to vibration than analogue, then the difference in performance of NAS, and DAC/streamer should be more audible between good & less good support than turntable or pre-/power-amps.

[beck]

We agree that the music signal both in analog and in digital form is affected by unwanted vibration. My guess is that when it happens to the digital signal it very easily becomes unnatural to listen to. Maybe the analog signal changes in a way that is more aggreeable with the way we listen.

[Music Lover]

Digital hifi systems biggest problem?
That's something we still have to find out imho.
One thing is clear, everything affect the performance.
Sorry for the boring answer but every time I optimise one aspect in dig replay, something else can be improved.

[Ron The Mon]

...there are vibrations in circuit boards of analog systems as well.

Some years ago I disconnected the speakers from the external passive filter of my SBL but left the connection from the XO to the amp. After turning up the volume at the preamp I could easily listen to the distorted music from the vibrating circuit board of the passive XO!!!

So, passing electrical signals through circuit boards does cause vibrations BUT I am not convinced that vibrations are digital systems biggest problem. IMO, there are more important topics in digital systems.

Matt,
Any electrical function that causes a physical action means the corrolary: that same physical action will cause the same electrical function. Your premise is correct, your conclusion incorrect.

All vibrations will affect every electronic circuit. Every one of them. Most physical hi-fi connections are archaec. RCA dates back to the 1950s!! Fiber-optic to the early 1980s. Ethernet to the late 1980s. Ethernet is the worst; it is a terrible fitting. These connections exascerbate physical vibrations to a great degree.

The banana fittings on an SBL offer much greater contact than many other type speaker connections, though I consider them poor.

The bottom line is until you eliminate all vibrations from all your electrical connections, your views are void.

RTM