Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

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Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by lejonklou »

Posts pertaining to the Ubiquity AmpliFi HD mesh router have been extracted from the Recommended Network Components thread and placed here for easier reference. This is currently a work-in-progress so I apologize for any continuity issues you encounter.

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Routers:
I've only tried a handful of them and results have been random. I tested a fancy mesh system last year, which turned out to be really bad musically. Not just for Källa, but for all units that could generate sound. Apple TV, for instance. I believe that the musical performance of the router is an intrinsic property and not a question of matching. It's just been so consistent.

This weekend I installed two Ubiquiti Amplifi HD in our home, replacing an old Technicolor router. The advice came from Jajo - and I think we know by now what kind of weight his advice carries.

This is a modern mesh system. I have one Amplifi unit in the hall (the main one) and a second in our living room. The second unit is connected by cable to a Netgear GS-108T switch, which in turn is connected to Källa. The switch and second router are powered by a separate power strip, as described in the recommended setup sketch
https://www.lejonklou.com/tips/recommended-setup/
Switch first, router second in the strip.

The result is nothing short of a revelation! During the first hour, the music was kind of stiff, but then gradually opened to a level I have never experienced before in our home. My wife made a comment during dinner that it felt like we had a live concert in the living room.

As mentioned, I haven't tested more than a handful of routers before this one, but they all pale in its shadow. Biggest upgrade I've done since Källa arrived in our home.

Ubiquiti Amplifi HD - best router so far, by a mile. And the speed and coverage in the home is excellent as well.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by tokenbrit »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 Ubiquiti Amplifi HD - best router so far, by a mile. And the speed and coverage in the home is excellent as well.
Thanks Fredrik and Jacob, for the recommendation. Is this it?
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by tokenbrit »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 Routers:
...
This weekend I installed two Ubiquiti Amplifi HD in our home... I have one Amplifi unit in the hall (the main one) and a second in our living room.
Just to confirm: are 2 HDs needed for coverage or just for separation, and presumably they are connected to each other via Mesh/wireless? Presumably 2 HDs are better than the more typical mesh setup of 1 HD Router and 1 (or more) MeshPoint(s)
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by anthony »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 Routers:
I've only tried a handful of them and results have been random. I tested a fancy mesh system last year, which turned out to be really bad musically. Not just for Källa, but for all units that could generate sound. Apple TV, for instance. I believe that the musical performance of the router is an intrinsic property and not a question of matching. It's just been so consistent.

This weekend I installed two Ubiquiti Amplifi HD in our home, replacing an old Technicolor router. The advice came from Jajo - and I think we know by now what kind of weight his advice carries.

This is a modern mesh system. I have one Amplifi unit in the hall (the main one) and a second in our living room. The second unit is connected by cable to a Netgear GS-108T switch, which in turn is connected to Källa. The switch and second router are powered by a separate power strip, as described in the recommended setup sketch
https://www.lejonklou.com/tips/recommended-setup/
Switch first, router second in the strip.

The result is nothing short of a revelation! During the first hour, the music was kind of stiff, but then gradually opened to a level I have never experienced before in our home. My wife made a comment during dinner that it felt like we had a live concert in the living room.

As mentioned, I haven't tested more than a handful of routers before this one, but they all pale in its shadow. Biggest upgrade I've done since Källa arrived in our home.

Ubiquiti Amplifi HD - best router so far, by a mile. And the speed and coverage in the home is excellent as well.
Fredrik, how much does the net gear 108 reduce differences between routers, if at all?
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by matthias »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 I have one Amplifi unit in the hall (the main one) and a second in our living room. The second unit is connected by cable to a Netgear GS-108T switch, which in turn is connected to Källa.
Fredrik,
did you compare with vs without switch between Amplifi and Källa?
Thanks
Last edited by matthias on 2022-02-27 15:13, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by macrotech2 »

Fascinating. Fredrik, do you or Jajo have ideas why these differences occur?
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by matthias »

This router is also appreciated by another good manufacturer:

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/ ... ost-755528
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by Spannko »

tokenbrit wrote: 2022-02-27 05:32
lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 Routers:
...
This weekend I installed two Ubiquiti Amplifi HD in our home... I have one Amplifi unit in the hall (the main one) and a second in our living room.
Just to confirm: are 2 HDs needed for coverage or just for separation, and presumably they are connected to each other via Mesh/wireless? Presumably 2 HDs are better than the more typical mesh setup of 1 HD Router and 1 (or more) MeshPoint(s)
Good question. I’ve just ordered an Amplifi HD, but reading this again it looks like I need 2.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by lejonklou »

tokenbrit wrote: 2022-02-27 05:13 Thanks Fredrik and Jacob, for the recommendation. Is this it?
Yes!
tokenbrit wrote: 2022-02-27 05:32 Just to confirm: are 2 HDs needed for coverage or just for separation, and presumably they are connected to each other via Mesh/wireless? Presumably 2 HDs are better than the more typical mesh setup of 1 HD Router and 1 (or more) MeshPoint(s)
In my situation it's needed, because in the hall, we have a fiber entering the apartment and a fiber modem bolted to the wall. I have the first Amplifi there, fed by the fiber modem. It covers most of the apartment.

Now, I can run a long ethernet cable from this Amplifi to Källa. That works, but the long cable doesn't sound very good. Therefore I have placed a second Amplifi next to the system, which allows for two 2.5-3 m ethernet cables to be used (one to the switch and the second from switch to Källa). This sounds quite a bit better.
anthony wrote: 2022-02-27 06:30 Fredrik, how much does the net gear 108 reduce differences between routers, if at all?
I don't think it reduces the musical difference between routers at all. The switch does something and it seems that in most cases, it's for the better. See next reply.
matthias wrote: 2022-02-27 08:06 did you compare with vs without switch between Amplifi and Källa?
Yes. Directly from Amplifi to Källa works fine. But it's somehow a little sterile and the bass notes are a bit false. Adding the GS-108T switch between Amplifi and Källa creates harmony. Everything gels and flows effortlessly. Bass notes are precise and true.
macrotech2 wrote: 2022-02-27 09:05 Fascinating. Fredrik, do you or Jajo have ideas why these differences occur?
After some more practical experiments today, we have concluded that the router seem to matter a lot more than the switch. Due to the vast numbers of routers out there, the impossible task of testing them all and the fact that many already have one they're happy with, we previously didn't pay that much attention to them.

I don't know much about exactly how the router and the switch affects the music. We mainly collect practical experience and look for patterns. If I decided to make a switch of my own, I'd certainly look deeper into the technical aspects of what happens and why.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by tokenbrit »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 21:47 ... I can run a long ethernet cable from this Amplifi to Källa. That works, but the long cable doesn't sound very good. Therefore I have placed a second Amplifi next to the system, which allows for two 2.5-3 m ethernet cables to be used (one to the switch and the second from switch to Källa). This sounds quite a bit better.
Thanks. Good to know that a Mesh setup can sound better than a long ethernet cable. Out of interest, how long? I use a 5m BJC from router to 108T then 2.5m BJC from switch to Källa - would be interesting to compare against an Amplifi HD in my setup. A few configurations to try... Is it easy to set up the Amplifi HD as a 2nd router to extend or segment your network, or is it simply a client of the 1st HD?
Last edited by tokenbrit on 2022-02-28 19:18, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by matthias »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 21:47 After some more practical experiments today, we have concluded that the router seem to matter a lot more than the switch.
Agree completely Fredrik,
would be interesting to compare the Amplifi HD to the Amplifi Alien:

https://eu.store.ui.com/collections/wir ... ef65&_ss=r
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by Defender »

thats an really interesting find - thank you for it

I have a Fritzbox which is modem and router in one go. Currently my GS108 is connected to the fritzbox with one Ethernet cables through wall sockets.
If I would integrate one HD I could have it right next to the GS108 so in this case the Ethernet cable would not go directly from the fritzbox to the GS108 but first to the HD and from there to the GS108.

I am wondering what the improvement comes from - the HD in itself or the wireless connection in between the two HD‘s

uups I realised its the same question tokenbrit was asking
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by macrotech2 »

Hi Fredrik. Having read about the changes again and the necessity to use two routers, what was the setup before? Were you using a long cable from hall to the 108 switch?

Do you now have two separate WiFi networks or just one? I wonder if there’s any advantage using a
separate network just for Källa. I currently use Ethernet over mains to get the network into the living room and hadn’t considered using wireless router to router (whatever the technical name for that is?)
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by Defender »

this device is out of stock almost everywhere in Germany and even in their own shop
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by Stephan »

Yes, its out of stock everywhere in Sweden also it seems :-(
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by lejonklou »

macrotech2 wrote: 2022-02-28 12:35 Hi Fredrik. Having read about the changes again and the necessity to use two routers, what was the setup before? Were you using a long cable from hall to the 108 switch?

Do you now have two separate WiFi networks or just one? I wonder if there’s any advantage using a
separate network just for Källa. I currently use Ethernet over mains to get the network into the living room and hadn’t considered using wireless router to router (whatever the technical name for that is?)
Before we got a fiber connection in the hall, we had a DSL modem connected to a telephone jack. So completely different.

I have set it up as one WiFi network only. One Amplifi (in the hall) is assigned as the main router and the second Amplifi (in the living room) as an extension. They spontaneously set themselves up that way.

Every client connects to the nearest Amplifi, so for instance the iPad in the living room connects to the Amplifi by the HiFi system (which is connected by cable to Källa). Now, if I play music from the iPad, then carry it with me to the kitchen and leave it there, the iPad will now connect to the Amplifi in the hall. The effect this has on the musical quality is close to none. By that I mean that I have trouble noticing anything, but I'm not ruling out there might be a tiny difference.

It's easy to set up a separate WiFi in the Amplifi app. I tried this by creating an extra 5 GHz WiFi on the living room Amplifi. Then I let the iPad forget the main WiFi and connected it to the new living room one only. This could possibly have caused some trouble with range, if I carried the iPad far away from the living room and it's separate WiFi, but regardless of that, I wanted to see (and hear) how it worked. My impression is that it sounded exactly the same as when both routers had only one shared WiFi. As I didn't get any sense of a musical improvement, I returned to a single WiFi.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by lejonklou »

tokenbrit wrote: 2022-02-28 02:24
lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 21:47 ... I can run a long ethernet cable from this Amplifi to Källa. That works, but the long cable doesn't sound very good. Therefore I have placed a second Amplifi next to the system, which allows for two 2.5-3 m ethernet cables to be used (one to the switch and the second from switch to Källa). This sounds quite a bit better.
Thanks. Good to know that a Mesh setup can sound better than a long ethernet cable. Out of interest, how long? I use a 5m BJC from router to 108T then 2.5m BJC from switch to Källa - would be interesting to compare against an Amplifi HD in my setup. A few configurations to try... Is it easy to set up the Amplifi HD as a 2nd router to extend or segment your network, or is it simply a client of the 1st HD?
When I began writing this post, I thought I'd have some answers for you. But there are too many parameters at work for me to know exactly what does what. I have only tried alternatives that I find practically and aesthetically acceptable, which rules out a cable from the hall.

I have no idea whether the Amplifi HD can work as an extender for another manufacturer's router. I'm also unsure of how this will sound. I suspect the main router will have a strong influence on the musical performance. I have only tested two Amplifi HD connected as a mesh WiFi, that works beautifully.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by tokenbrit »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-03-01 00:57 When I began writing this post, I thought I'd have some answers for you...
That's OK. At some point we've got to experiment for ourselves, & see what works best in our setup ;) Thanks for sharing what works there so that we have a good starting point :)
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by Spannko »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-03-01 00:57
I have no idea whether the Amplifi HD can work as an extender for another manufacturer's router. I'm also unsure of how this will sound. I suspect the main router will have a strong influence on the musical performance.
The Amplifi HD can work as a switch/WAP type thingy (sorry, I don’t know what it’s called in this mode). That is, installed immediately before the GS108T, being supplied by Ethernet from the ISP router, and working as a local WAP. The change in sound is immediately noticeable: bigger soundstage, clearer, more detailed, superficially impressive. However, musically it’s quite a bit worse, totally uninteresting. So even though it’s apparent that the Amplifi HD does something really well, I wouldn’t recommend it being used in this mode.

The second Amplifi HD will be arriving today, so I can try them as they’re intended to be used and as recommended by Fredrick.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by anthony »

Spannko wrote: 2022-03-01 08:43
lejonklou wrote: 2022-03-01 00:57
I have no idea whether the Amplifi HD can work as an extender for another manufacturer's router. I'm also unsure of how this will sound. I suspect the main router will have a strong influence on the musical performance.
The Amplifi HD can work as a switch/WAP type thingy (sorry, I don’t know what it’s called in this mode). That is, installed immediately before the GS108T, being supplied by Ethernet from the ISP router, and working as a local WAP. The change in sound is immediately noticeable: bigger soundstage, clearer, more detailed, superficially impressive. However, musically it’s quite a bit worse, totally uninteresting. So even though it’s apparent that the Amplifi HD does something really well, I wouldn’t recommend it being used in this mode.

The second Amplifi HD will be arriving today, so I can try them as they’re intended to be used and as recommended by Fredrick.
Interesting, my amplifi arrives today, Fredrik should have bought shares in them. It is also on Linns recommended list.
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Re: Ubiquity AmpliFi HD

Post by matthias »

lejonklou wrote: 2022-02-27 02:24 The result is nothing short of a revelation! During the first hour, the music was kind of stiff, but then gradually opened to a level I have never experienced before in our home. My wife made a comment during dinner that it felt like we had a live concert in the living room.
This is really great, otoh it shows that the routers and their configuration have to be regarded as very serious audio components and finding (or designing) the most musical ones is a great task.
Last edited by matthias on 2022-03-01 12:27, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Recommended network components

Post by matthias »

Spannko wrote: 2022-03-01 08:43 The Amplifi HD can work as a switch/WAP type thingy (sorry, I don’t know what it’s called in this mode). That is, installed immediately before the GS108T, being supplied by Ethernet from the ISP router, and working as a local WAP. The change in sound is immediately noticeable: bigger soundstage, clearer, more detailed, superficially impressive. However, musically it’s quite a bit worse, totally uninteresting. So even though it’s apparent that the Amplifi HD does something really well, I wouldn’t recommend it being used in this mode.
Thanks for sharing.
Did you try to replace your existing router with ONE Amplifi HD, so that your ISP router works as modem only and feeds the Amplifi HD via a short ethernet cable?
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Re: Recommended network components

Post by macrotech2 »

matthias wrote: 2022-03-01 11:12
Spannko wrote: 2022-03-01 08:43 The Amplifi HD can work as a switch/WAP type thingy (sorry, I don’t know what it’s called in this mode). That is, installed immediately before the GS108T, being supplied by Ethernet from the ISP router, and working as a local WAP. The change in sound is immediately noticeable: bigger soundstage, clearer, more detailed, superficially impressive. However, musically it’s quite a bit worse, totally uninteresting. So even though it’s apparent that the Amplifi HD does something really well, I wouldn’t recommend it being used in this mode.
Thanks for sharing.
Did you try to replace your existing router with ONE Amplifi HD, so that your ISP router works as modem only and feeds the Amplifi HD via a short ethernet cable?
That’s what Spannko has done isn’t it, apart from possibly the length of cable?
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Re: Recommended network components

Post by matthias »

macrotech2 wrote: 2022-03-01 11:22 That’s what Spannko has done isn’t it, apart from possibly the length of cable?
Maybe, if this is the case the secret of the musicality of the HD is not the router function per se but a two router config separated by wifi.
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Re: Recommended network components

Post by macrotech2 »

matthias wrote: 2022-03-01 11:45
macrotech2 wrote: 2022-03-01 11:22 That’s what Spannko has done isn’t it, apart from possibly the length of cable?
Maybe, if this is the case the secret of the musicality of the HD is not the router function per se but a two router config separated by wifi.
Which is what I was wondering about as well. Any comments on this from your other experiments Fredrik/Jajo?
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