General Discussion about Källa

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Gammaboy
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Gammaboy »

And should the Kalla always be left on or turned off when not in use? Sorry if this was mentioned elsewhere,
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Defender »

sorry I cant help you with experience with your question about the satellites but I would recommend to have an easy network approach as Fredrik said Modem => Router => GS108T (Switch) => Källo or as close you can get to that in your environment.
I leave all my equipment always powered on and only disconnect them from power during a thunder storm.
So yes leave the Källa on its only 22Watt - lets go Greta Thunberg
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by jajo »

Gammaboy wrote: 2021-10-15 19:14 I received my Kalla yesterday and thought it sounded very good right out of the box. I was using the Netgear GS108T switch between router and Kalla. When I went to set up a fixed IP I could see the switch on the list of devices but not the Kalla. I unplugged the switch and connected Kalla directly to the router, which allowed to be recognized as a device. I made the changes and rebooted Kalla, and music was restored. I then re-inserted the switch and now see the switch listed as a device with its IP and Kalla listed with its new fixed IP. It is playing music very nicely, but is my setup correct?

I am using a Netgear Orbi 10 router with two satellites. I know a Naim streamer can be hardwired to a satellite and operate, but curious if the sound quality of the Kalla would be be diminished when connected to a satellite instead of main router?
1) Your setup is perfectly correct. Nicely solved!

2) Leave Källa on. It needs some time to warm up until it reaches maximum performance if shut down. You could disconnect it from the power outlet in a thunderstorm or if you leave home for a longer time (a week or longer). Always shut it down from the web interface before disconnecting power.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Gammaboy »

Thanks.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by markiteight »

Off topic posts related to Exakt have been deleted. I ask, again, that you please take that discussion to an appropriate thread in an appropriate category.

Thank you,
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by sunbeamgls »

markiteight wrote: 2021-10-15 22:36 Off topic posts related to Exakt have been deleted. I ask, again, that you please take that discussion to an appropriate thread in an appropriate category.

Thank you,
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by jim123 »

springwood64 wrote: 2021-10-15 12:17
Defender wrote: 2021-10-15 09:22
Sunbeamgls I also would like to thank you for your honest opinion.
+1

It's been really interesting to read forum members impressions. So far it's only served to intensify my curiosity, and convince me not to rush into spending money on an LP12
Thank you Sunbeams, very interesting and balanced. Much appreciated. I shall read your review of the new KDSM and a head to head review with Kalla one day would be excellent.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Arjen »

Reading all of the recent posts about the Kalla, are you still enjoying music in the meantime and not only audiofreaking?
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by matthias »

Gammaboy wrote: 2021-10-15 19:14 I am using a Netgear Orbi 10 router with two satellites. I know a Naim streamer can be hardwired to a satellite and operate, but curious if the sound quality of the Kalla would be be diminished when connected to a satellite instead of main router?
Gammaboy,
would be very interesting if you can compare Källa hardwired to your Orbi satellite vs hardwired to router and switch looking for differences in musicality and SQ.
Thank you.

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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by jajo »

Gammaboy wrote: 2021-10-15 19:14 I am using a Netgear Orbi 10 router with two satellites. I know a Naim streamer can be hardwired to a satellite and operate, but curious if the sound quality of the Kalla would be be diminished when connected to a satellite instead of main router?
Forgot to answer this part.

Best thing is to test this in your setup, since all network equipment behaves differently. It is also a question about electric/ground connections.

From my experience with Källa 001, the part of the network that affects performance the most is between Källa and the nearest network device it is connected to. Performance is almost unaffected by changes further back in the network, but very sensitive to the closest step (in my case the Netgear GS108T-switch).

It seems like the further away something is changed in the network, the less it affects Källa. I recently connected my apartment ot a different switch in the basement (to get faster internet speeds) and that had absolutely no affect on the performance.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Defender »

just a short question: if you airplay spotify to the Källa isnt the volume setting additionaly depending on the volume setting of your IPhone? I assume in this case you want to set your IPhone to maximum volume?
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by jajo »

Defender wrote: 2021-10-16 14:00 just a short question: if you airplay spotify to the Källa isnt the volume setting additionaly depending on the volume setting of your IPhone? I assume in this case you want to set your IPhone to maximum volume?
No. The protocol Källa uses bypasses all sound processing on the client device.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by matthias »

Some older MacBooks do NOT support the protocol for sending music to Källa.

Did someone try Airfoil (which does support the protocol) with these Macs and Källa?

https://rogueamoeba.com/airfoil/mac/. (there is a free trial option)

There are reports that Airfoil might sound better than the standard protocol in Macs so it should be worth a try even in newer MacBooks which do support the protocol.

Thanks

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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by teatime »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-16 14:41 No. The protocol Källa uses bypasses all sound processing on the client device.
That's a strange way of putting it. As I understand it, in Airplay, audio data is sent separate from the information of intended volume. I assume either Källa simply doesn't obey the set volume, or it can signal that it doesn't do volume attenuation and the volume information isn't even sent by the device.

In either case I would expect there to be no way to "bypass" any sound processing done on the device before the data is sent, such as volume normalization (if that option is active in Spotify, for example) or any equalizer settings in whatever player the user happens to use. Somewhat silly examples, but technically valid, if I understand things correctly.

Also, any format transcoding and up/downsampling happens on the client device. Sound processing. Obviously cannot be bypassed.

I'm hard pressed to think of anything that can truly be bypassed, except volume attenuation (because the spec says it's separated from the audio data). I've never used an iphone, but perhaps it has different audio profiles for phone speaker and external devices (airplay) - that would make a lot of sense. And one would hope the external device will not have any additional sound processing (and in that sense "bypassed"), but that's up to Apple. I doubt it's even possible to know whether or not it's being done. They could add an audio fingerprint in a system update tomorrow, and you could do nothing about it. Certainly not bypass it.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by jajo »

teatime wrote: 2021-10-17 01:03
jajo wrote: 2021-10-16 14:41 No. The protocol Källa uses bypasses all sound processing on the client device.
That's a strange way of putting it. As I understand it, in Airplay, audio data is sent separate from the information of intended volume. I assume either Källa simply doesn't obey the set volume, or it can signal that it doesn't do volume attenuation and the volume information isn't even sent by the device.

In either case I would expect there to be no way to "bypass" any sound processing done on the device before the data is sent, such as volume normalization (if that option is active in Spotify, for example) or any equalizer settings in whatever player the user happens to use. Somewhat silly examples, but technically valid, if I understand things correctly.

Also, any format transcoding and up/downsampling happens on the client device. Sound processing. Obviously cannot be bypassed.

I'm hard pressed to think of anything that can truly be bypassed, except volume attenuation (because the spec says it's separated from the audio data). I've never used an iphone, but perhaps it has different audio profiles for phone speaker and external devices (airplay) - that would make a lot of sense. And one would hope the external device will not have any additional sound processing (and in that sense "bypassed"), but that's up to Apple. I doubt it's even possible to know whether or not it's being done. They could add an audio fingerprint in a system update tomorrow, and you could do nothing about it. Certainly not bypass it.
That is perfectly correct.

What I meant was that software volume does not have any effect on the output.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by matthias »

jajo wrote: 2021-10-17 02:33 What I meant was that software volume does not have any effect on the output.
IIUC, the software VC in the Spotify app is active and should be set to maximum for best quality.

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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by lejonklou »

matthias wrote: 2021-10-17 07:14 IIUC, the software VC in the Spotify app is active and should be set to maximum for best quality.
No, it has no effect when using Källa.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by matthias »

lejonklou wrote: 2021-10-17 07:45
matthias wrote: 2021-10-17 07:14 IIUC, the software VC in the Spotify app is active and should be set to maximum for best quality.
No, it has no effect when using Källa.
With respect to the post of teatime how does Källa know what happens in the app of the CP?
I mean when volume normalization is activated in the Spotify settings it has effect but not Spotify's own VC?
What about the VC of other apps like Qobuz, Youtube or Audirvana?
My understanding so far was that the VC of the protocol has no effect on Källa and Källa is agnostic about the app in the CP.
Thank you for clarification.

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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by lejonklou »

If the app does sound processing of the audio, that processing will also reach Källa. Sound Normalisation (adjustment of the volume of each song so that they sound equally loud) is one such process and it should be switched off in the app for maximum musicality.

Volume is usually not done by the app, but a separate instruction. Källa doesn't respond to that instruction.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Discodave »

When I use Spotify on Majik Ds or Sonos the option to toggle volume normalisation etc. is not there. Its is just greyed out.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

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My Kalla arrived on Thursday and sounded very good right out of the box and before the fixed IP was set up. The fixed IP was sorted out Friday and it was able to warm up as I listened throughout the weekend. I was not sure what to expect, but must say that I find the Kalla to be utterly captivating. Much like the other Lejonklou equipment I am lucky to own, the Kalla is remarkably musical and it is simply easier to hear what the musicians are up to, and very balanced.

The digital front end the Kalla replaced was a Naim ND5 XS2 feeding a Naim nDAC that was powered by a Naim 555PS, or a Kalla versus roughly $20k worth of Naim gear (new.) Naim is a terrific company that has been in business for roughly 50 years, but the Kalla is easily better IMO. With the Naim setup I found myself bouncing from one recording to the next. With the Kalla I find myself listening all the way through.

This morning I took the opportunity to compare the Kalla to my LP12 (Radikal, Karousel, Keel, Ekos SE/1, Kandid, Woodsong movingui plinth, Entity.) Turntable was setup and torqued by Tom O'Keefe. The presentation was clearly different between the two, but I cannot yet say which I prefer, and will to continue to experiment. Both are excellent and it may be a situation where some recordings are a bit better on vinyl and others better on the Kalla. More time is required. Overall, I could not be happier with both sources. (This is where Tom chimes in and recommends the Singularity.)

I also spent time comparing the Orbi router to the Orbi satellite and did not hear a difference. I tried the Kalla with the Sagatun/ Tundra stereo versions with Linn Majik 140's and it sounded great as well. I briefly compared Tidal MQA to Spotify and thought Spotify was much better.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by matthias »

Gammaboy,
great report thank you for sharing. :-)
What did you use as control point for Källa?

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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Gammaboy »

I am using my iPhone SE. Expect to upgrade to the recommended iPhone 11 at some point.
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Källa 007's next stop

Post by macrotech2 »

Well, here we go. Källa 007 arrived with me on Friday morning. Huge thanks again to John at Kantata for arranging its tour schedule.

To give a bit of background, I believe I've already experienced a step change in digital sound when I listened to my current Vitus RD-101 DAC around eighteen months ago. The Vitus brought a similar type of improvement over my then KDS/3 to what you get from Lejonklou amps over Linn amps. All types of music sounded more natural, it was easier to follow what each musician was playing and the emotional impact of the music was much greater. It made the KDS/3 sound flat, lifeless and, yes, muddled. I can well believe the comments of Linn Organik listeners who claim a massive improvement. I've already heard it can be done.

The rest of the system is Sagatun Monos / Tundra Monos into Avalon Idea Mk 2 speakers.
The only Linn remaining in the system is two pairs of silver interconnects.
All housed in a Quadraspire SV2T rack on Quadraspire QX7 floor protectors.

007 arrived earlier than expected so I intended to take around 45 min setting it up, leaving it to warm up, then off to work.
It's easy to install and the web interface is simple to use to set up a fixed IP address.
A clever touch is that Källa detects if its network settings are incompatible with your network (as was the case here) and resets itself to DHCP.
Interestingly there's a software update option in the interface.
I also like the tone generator which allows you to generate a sine wave over the audible range. Good for testing your hearing and system and system frequency limits perhaps?

I normally use Lumin to access my QNAP NAS drive and build up playlists from that intermingled with selections from Qobuz. Here I used my IPhone 12 Max Pro with the Qobuz app exclusively for my listening, initially concentrating on the Qobuz tracks that had been in the Vitus playlist. Interestingly I am now considering dumping the NAS drive completely, though that's not very handy if you lose your internet connection! I will try MConnect to access songs on the NAS later. I didn't try Spotify as I don't have a premium account and the first advert was too much for me. Also something to try later.

I'd done a lot of listening in the days before Källa arrived and also got my wife Amber, who doesn't normally listen to the system, to hear a few tracks and choose some of her favourites. As usual, it all sounded consistently excellent and I was thinking it would be difficult to beat. My only minor niggle is of a slightly "warm" character to the overall sound, but that's not a tune dem comment really,

I mentioned earlier that I intended to spend about 45 minutes setting up. I left the house, reluctantly, two hours later. As others have said, you have the usual Lejonklou warm up requirements, but my interest was piqued from switch on. I've now listened for many hours over several days.

I was instantly struck by how "clean" the music sounded compared to the Vitus, which means instruments sound more realistic with no hint of any digital nastiness whatsoever. Amber (who loved the ability to stream Amazon Music direct from her phone) also commented that it sounded very clear, but with more depth and no hint of a clinical nature that she disliked on my previous streamers.

There is an effortless flow that gets more to the heart of anything you play. The individual instruments are just there to be heard in the mix but they all come together to convey the overall message. It's as though you can see through the music if that makes any sense at all. The old cliché of hearing new details in familiar pieces applies big time here, with very subtle tonal changes, hitherto unnoticed cymbal brushstrokes or, for example, a never noticed extra harpsichord layer in the Stranglers Golden Brown.

Tracks covered a wide range of styles including:
Oscar Peterson, You Look Good to Me from We Get Requests. The Vitus got slightly confused when the piano picks up but Källa has no issues keeping all three instruments separated and playing their own melodies.
Whirl-Y-Reel 1 by Afro Celt Sound System. Much easier to follow the intertwined instruments with new rhythms apparent.
Martha Tilston, Stags Bellow. Her voice sounded more expressive and no slight harshness in the louder parts which were there on the Vitus.
Bad Guy, Billie Eilish. No problem with the heavy bass partially obscuring some of the subtler instruments.
Lou Reed, Walk on the Wild Side. Delicate cymbal brushes not heard before.
Jimi Hendrix has never sounded so good, etc. etc.

I could go on and on. Källa handles anything thrown at it and just delivers sublime music every time. This is a fantastic achievement by Fredrik and his team. Brilliant job guys.

I have ordered one.
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Re: General Discussion about Källa

Post by Spannko »

Great write up macrotech2! Thanks for sharing.
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