With which power supply: 308T, 108T, or Henri?
Recommended network components
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Re: Recommended network components
Henri. I’ll try the 308T ps again now that everything’s run in, just to make sure.
Re: Recommended network components
I have compared Netgear GS-308T to 108T a couple of times during the last days. And in short, my choice is the 108T. But it's not an easy choice.
My impression of 308T is this: Take a 108T and remove some kind of filter in it. Then you get more of everything. The music just pours out with less effort and even feels a little louder. Individual notes can appear very natural and touching.
The downside is that it's also slightly messy. That imaginary filter of the 108T brought a little more order to the performance. But on some songs I found 308T gripping.
The power supplies I got with these two switches are similarly sized, same power rating but different model numbers.
GS-108T: AD810000, 12V, 1A
GS-308T: AD2071000, 12V, 1A
Not yet sure which of the power supplies I prefer. I compared the switches first with their own power supplies, then swapped power supplies and compared the switches again. I found the differences between the switches virtually the same regardless of which power supply they used.
My impression of 308T is this: Take a 108T and remove some kind of filter in it. Then you get more of everything. The music just pours out with less effort and even feels a little louder. Individual notes can appear very natural and touching.
The downside is that it's also slightly messy. That imaginary filter of the 108T brought a little more order to the performance. But on some songs I found 308T gripping.
The power supplies I got with these two switches are similarly sized, same power rating but different model numbers.
GS-108T: AD810000, 12V, 1A
GS-308T: AD2071000, 12V, 1A
Not yet sure which of the power supplies I prefer. I compared the switches first with their own power supplies, then swapped power supplies and compared the switches again. I found the differences between the switches virtually the same regardless of which power supply they used.
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Re: Recommended network components
I felt it sounded a bit louder too, and “noisy”. I likened the extra loudness and noisyness to what we hear with dynamically compressed music; the type we’ve experienced as a result of the loudness wars.lejonklou wrote: ↑2022-12-18 23:24
My impression of 308T is this: Take a 108T and remove some kind of filter in it. Then you get more of everything. The music just pours out with less effort and even feels a little louder. Individual notes can appear very natural and touching.
The downside is that it's also slightly messy. That imaginary filter of the 108T brought a little more order to the performance. But on some songs I found 308T gripping.
However, the biggest problem for me was the loss of musicality when listening to this https://open.spotify.com/track/1Jxw7qW ... JT_RUg-oxQ
Re: Recommended network components
Since the Netgear GS-308T is a managed switch would it be possible that the settings have an influence on musicality?
Matt
Modified mains distribution / Macbook / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
Modified mains distribution / Macbook / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
Re: Recommended network components
In looking for the Netgear GS108T it seems only v3 is available, while many of you are referring to v2 in this thread. Is there any experience/view on any possible difference between v2 and v3?
Also - would be very interested in hearing folks' experience of different Mesh routers. I understand the Ubiquitous Amplify HD is a favourite, but it now seems impossible to buy anywhere, and is also quite old (5 years+). Any experiences of newer Wifi 6 Mesh options such as the ASUS Zen XT8, Deco X60... etc?
Also - would be very interested in hearing folks' experience of different Mesh routers. I understand the Ubiquitous Amplify HD is a favourite, but it now seems impossible to buy anywhere, and is also quite old (5 years+). Any experiences of newer Wifi 6 Mesh options such as the ASUS Zen XT8, Deco X60... etc?
Re: Recommended network components
I found used gs108t v2 here:
https://itastore.se/produkt/netgear-prosafe-gs108t-v2/
But there is no power supply included, but they are really cheap,
https://itastore.se/produkt/netgear-prosafe-gs108t-v2/
But there is no power supply included, but they are really cheap,
Re: Recommended network components
The GS308T is a managed switch and a number of settings are set to Enable by default that might be better set to Disable. Adjust the settings below and listen. If you don't like it, reset the settings. For me, it was a welcome surprise.
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Re: Recommended network components
Thank you ITB!
I will try these settings and compare again against the 108T.
I will try these settings and compare again against the 108T.
Re: Recommended network components
Interesting. Thanks ITB.
Wondering if the default settings vary by region? On my North Am 308T, all 3 Trap Flags settings are Enabled; but Auto-Video Status is Disabled, and only Validate IGMP IP Header is Enabled; IGMP Snooping Status is Disabled. These are all default on my 308T as I deliberately didn't change anything with the new switch...
I'll give them a try here strictly for improvement to the 308T. Will be interested to read any change in your findings against the 108T, Fredrik.
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Re: Recommended network components
"Wondering if the default settings vary by region?"
It's even possible that units sold in the same region can have different default settings. It all depends on which version of firmware the GS308T is shipped with. Now let's hope that for example firmware version 1.0.5.7 is responding to the tweaks the same way 1.0.2.2 does.
It's even possible that units sold in the same region can have different default settings. It all depends on which version of firmware the GS308T is shipped with. Now let's hope that for example firmware version 1.0.5.7 is responding to the tweaks the same way 1.0.2.2 does.
Re: Recommended network components
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Re: Recommended network components
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Re: Recommended network components
The switch doesn't prompt to do so after changing the settings, but did you reboot your GS308T following the settings change(s)? (no reason; just asking :)
Re: Recommended network components
Only "Apply" no reboot.
Re: Recommended network components
What port is on the GS108T is best to plug the streamer and what port is best to plug the feed from the router?
LP12 / Entity / Sagatun Monos / Tundra Monos / Harbeth M30.1 / Rythmik E22's
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Re: Recommended network components
Port 8 is the most musical, port 1 the least. So plug your streamer into 8 and router into 7.
https://www.lejonklou.com/tips/recommended-setup/
Re: Recommended network components
Thank you for that!!markiteight wrote: ↑2023-01-29 02:57Port 8 is the most musical, port 1 the least. So plug your streamer into 8 and router into 7.
https://www.lejonklou.com/tips/recommended-setup/
Are you guys just using the GS108T as plug and play device or should I login to the switch using a web browser and configure it? If so, what are the best configuration settings? Are the settings ITB posted above also optimal for the GS108T?
LP12 / Entity / Sagatun Monos / Tundra Monos / Harbeth M30.1 / Rythmik E22's
Re: Recommended network components
Apparently the settings can be heard on both 108T and 308T, and the musical effect of them is similar. I received a tip about this on email from a gentleman that was going to evaluate them.
I plan to do so myself but haven’t had any time lately as I’m deep down a production rabbit hole.
I plan to do so myself but haven’t had any time lately as I’m deep down a production rabbit hole.
Re: Recommended network components
I'm the person who's been having a play with the settings in the GS108T. I've come to these settings and like it. You may need to pull the speakers forward a tad.
System: SNMP: Trap Flags: all enable (these are on by default)
Switching: Voice LAN: disable
Switching: STP: enable
Switching: Multicast: Auto Video: enable
Switching: Multicast: IGMP Snooping configuration: all 3 enable
These aren't definitive, but a place to start.
System: SNMP: Trap Flags: all enable (these are on by default)
Switching: Voice LAN: disable
Switching: STP: enable
Switching: Multicast: Auto Video: enable
Switching: Multicast: IGMP Snooping configuration: all 3 enable
These aren't definitive, but a place to start.
Re: Recommended network components
Thanks for these suggestions, 'julio :)fatjulio wrote: ↑2023-02-08 08:11 I'm the person who's been having a play with the settings in the GS108T. I've come to these settings and like it. You may need to pull the speakers forward a tad.
System: SNMP: Trap Flags: all enable (these are on by default)
Switching: Voice LAN: disable
Switching: STP: enable
Switching: Multicast: Auto Video: enable
Switching: Multicast: IGMP Snooping configuration: all 3 enable
These aren't definitive, but a place to start.
I had tried ITB's suggested settings for the 308T but, over time, found myself a little less engaged with the music... I know your settings are for the 108T, but your post prompted me to revisit my switch configuration. I reverted my changed settings to the defaults for the 308T, but that made it feel like the musicians had a little too much coffee, so I enabled 'Auto Video' and the IGMP Snooping configuration options that apply to the 308...
I didn't evaluate the changes individually - enabled both Auto Video & Snooping Status - so my findings are listening enjoyment rather than empirical application of the Tune Method. As such I can't say that it's strictly musically better, but it certainly not worse, and the new settings suit me, my system in my room. Long story short: it feels like the musicians are enjoying themselves again - the music flows.
Curious whether others find the same or similar. Hoping more will try ITB's &/or fatjulio's settings, and report back. Just reporting my findings in case they help someone here who feels like switching things a bit - it's easily reversible if you don't like the change.
Notes for my 308T
I'm using the PSU from my 108Tv2 (NA)
IGMP Snooping Configuration options are just IGMP Snooping Status (needs to be enabled) & Validate IGMP IP header (already enabled by default)
I couldn't find Voice LAN (Status) [dis|en]able other than a Voice VLAN Configuration, Admin Mode, which defaults to disabled.
Auto-Video Status (needed to be enabled)
All other settings default
My 308T (& 'WAP') use static IP(s)
Re: Recommended network components
I agree with the above findings on my GS108Tv3. With ITBs settings I noticed myself turning the volume down and having shorter listening sessions. With fatjulio’s settings I kept wanting to turn the volume up and found myself immersed in the music.
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Re: Recommended network components
I've been a bit slow on all of this.
I bought a GS308T to compare with my GS108T many months ago, but it didn't get connected for a long time. Then I just plugged it in (with the 108 PS) and didn't bother with comparing as it was straight out of the box. But I didn't notice much difference.
Then I saw ITB's settings and implemented them on the 308. Not much change, so I left them. Lots of travelling interrupted my listening, and somewhere in all this my Entity became 1.2, and I was listening to vinyl MUCH more.
So tonight I have reverted the 308 to factory settings. Better, immediately noticeable. Then I plugged back in a cold 108 (factory settings also). This took a couple of back-and-forth comparisons, but I have a definite musical preference for the 108. It's now warm and no contest.
I guess my next task is to try fatjulio's settings, but that may have to wait a while - I'm just very pleased to have my Kalla back on top form. Once more I have experienced how seemingly minor and hifi-acceptable changes can significantly but unobtrusively reduce musicality.
I bought a GS308T to compare with my GS108T many months ago, but it didn't get connected for a long time. Then I just plugged it in (with the 108 PS) and didn't bother with comparing as it was straight out of the box. But I didn't notice much difference.
Then I saw ITB's settings and implemented them on the 308. Not much change, so I left them. Lots of travelling interrupted my listening, and somewhere in all this my Entity became 1.2, and I was listening to vinyl MUCH more.
So tonight I have reverted the 308 to factory settings. Better, immediately noticeable. Then I plugged back in a cold 108 (factory settings also). This took a couple of back-and-forth comparisons, but I have a definite musical preference for the 108. It's now warm and no contest.
I guess my next task is to try fatjulio's settings, but that may have to wait a while - I'm just very pleased to have my Kalla back on top form. Once more I have experienced how seemingly minor and hifi-acceptable changes can significantly but unobtrusively reduce musicality.
From observation to understanding the road can be long - Carlo Rovelli
Strange things are afoot at the Circle K :/
Back story: I updated the firmware on my 108Tv2 and, through a mix of frustration, accidental unawareness, & stupidity (mostly the latter), cannot revert to the factory firmware image. I bought a 308T, tried it, and didn't notice much difference against my updated 108T so left the 308T installed. I tried ITB's then fatjulio's settings, preferring those from fatjulio on the 308T despite that they were suggested for the 108T... Prompted by David Neel's post above, I put the 108T back in with a view to comparing over time against the 308T. To 'make it fair', I reverted the 108T to factory configuration settings, reapplied the same static IP, etc. then applied fatjulio's suggested settings, same as worked on the 308T. This is where it gets weird...
On my 108Tv2, I checked SNMP Trap Flags (enabled), disabled Voice VLAN Status, enabled Auto-Video Status, and enabled all 3 IGMP Snooping Configuration options. The only thing I didn't do was to 'enable STP' - I assumed that was Spanning Tree State, but wasn't sure, and didn't know what to do with STP Operation Mode, so left it/them as default settings for the time being...
From there, I went to my iPad Mini to Airplay some music to Kalla, except there was no Lejonklou option under Speakers & TVs... I rebooted the iPad Mini, the access point, the 108T, but still nothing. So I reverted the 108Tv2 config, and voila: Kalla reappears; retry the new config & it disappears :(
With the default settings, my 108T sounds a little hifi in comparison to my 308T with the updated config, but I'd like to find out what my 108T can do (despite the firmware snafu)
Anyone any idea what I'm doing wrong? I'd really like to try 108T vs 308T head-to-head with fatjulio's config. It's working on the 308T, but not on my 108T. Did I bork my 108T more than I realise by deleting the original firmware? Should I just be happy with my reconfigured 308T? Why is digital so complicated? (even tho' Kalla isn't ;)
And it gets weirder: I reapplied the suggested 108T config, one parameter at a time, watching to see if Lejonklou disappeared from Airplay. This time the settings took, so I'll live with it for a while before trying the 308T again...
Weirder still: a few hours later 'Lejonklou' has gone again - it's as if Airplay can't (re)discover the Kalla... So I went back over the config: enabled STP (spanning tree) but that made no difference. When I disabled Block Unknown Multicast Address, under IGMP Snooping Configuration, Lejonklou reappeared in Airplay Speakers & TVs. My guess is that Airplay is OK is if knows about Kalla, while you're changing the switch config, but can't rediscover it if the (unknown) multicast address gets blocked, in my network setup, at least. That logic is speculation on my part, but makes sense in my head - just not sure how much is network (settings/components) dependent...
If anyone has a problem with your switch (re)configuration causing things to disappear in Airplay, try disabling 'block unknown multicast address'... Interestingly that option isn't available on the 308T. Thanks for reading :D
My managed switch sits between wireless access point & Kalla - all 3 with static IPs (same BJC Ethernet cables used)
My GS108Tv2 is currently on Boot Version: B5.1.0.2; Software Version: 5.0.2.22 - oldest available from Netgear is 5.0.1.9 but that wouldn't load... don't recall whether any of the 5.0.1.x series worked - .2.22 worked so I stuck with it (because this one goes to 11 (x2) :)
On my 108Tv2, I checked SNMP Trap Flags (enabled), disabled Voice VLAN Status, enabled Auto-Video Status, and enabled all 3 IGMP Snooping Configuration options. The only thing I didn't do was to 'enable STP' - I assumed that was Spanning Tree State, but wasn't sure, and didn't know what to do with STP Operation Mode, so left it/them as default settings for the time being...
From there, I went to my iPad Mini to Airplay some music to Kalla, except there was no Lejonklou option under Speakers & TVs... I rebooted the iPad Mini, the access point, the 108T, but still nothing. So I reverted the 108Tv2 config, and voila: Kalla reappears; retry the new config & it disappears :(
With the default settings, my 108T sounds a little hifi in comparison to my 308T with the updated config, but I'd like to find out what my 108T can do (despite the firmware snafu)
Anyone any idea what I'm doing wrong? I'd really like to try 108T vs 308T head-to-head with fatjulio's config. It's working on the 308T, but not on my 108T. Did I bork my 108T more than I realise by deleting the original firmware? Should I just be happy with my reconfigured 308T? Why is digital so complicated? (even tho' Kalla isn't ;)
And it gets weirder: I reapplied the suggested 108T config, one parameter at a time, watching to see if Lejonklou disappeared from Airplay. This time the settings took, so I'll live with it for a while before trying the 308T again...
Weirder still: a few hours later 'Lejonklou' has gone again - it's as if Airplay can't (re)discover the Kalla... So I went back over the config: enabled STP (spanning tree) but that made no difference. When I disabled Block Unknown Multicast Address, under IGMP Snooping Configuration, Lejonklou reappeared in Airplay Speakers & TVs. My guess is that Airplay is OK is if knows about Kalla, while you're changing the switch config, but can't rediscover it if the (unknown) multicast address gets blocked, in my network setup, at least. That logic is speculation on my part, but makes sense in my head - just not sure how much is network (settings/components) dependent...
If anyone has a problem with your switch (re)configuration causing things to disappear in Airplay, try disabling 'block unknown multicast address'... Interestingly that option isn't available on the 308T. Thanks for reading :D
My managed switch sits between wireless access point & Kalla - all 3 with static IPs (same BJC Ethernet cables used)
My GS108Tv2 is currently on Boot Version: B5.1.0.2; Software Version: 5.0.2.22 - oldest available from Netgear is 5.0.1.9 but that wouldn't load... don't recall whether any of the 5.0.1.x series worked - .2.22 worked so I stuck with it (because this one goes to 11 (x2) :)