Recommended network components

[lejonklou]

Summary of my experience is that some network separation can be good, but separating the music network was worse... Results could (well) be router dependent, so give it a try if your router has that feature - you may find a little more music :)

Thank you for reporting, tokenbrit!

Never tried this myself, so the information is useful.

[tokenbrit]

Thank you for reporting, tokenbrit!

Never tried this myself, so the information is useful.

You’re welcome. I don’t know how much my findings will translate to other home networks…. Ours was a little inelegant since a provider change that left us with a gateway rather than a cable modem. Thankfully the ISP put the gateway in bridge mode so I could properly manage our home network via our own router, with an AirPort Express as the client & AP for 108T & Källa. The first two guest networks were to move off IoT & work devices; the gateway proved fortunate as I could also move off the Internet phone… The musical benefit this brought made me think that isolating the music side of things would bring further benefit, but it didn’t seem to.

I admit I didn’t investigate first steps too much, or whether the negative effect of the final step was temporary, following a Spotify app update; a result of turning off DHCP, or something else. There’s no option on my router to assign priorities between main & guest networks, so I don’t know whether that was it. Reverting the iPads, AE, 108T and Källa one step to the main network was a musical relief so I’m happy now/for now ;)

If any of the above is applicable to the recommended network setup or what the AmpliFi mesh routers do ‘under the covers’ would depend on setup options, and have to be tested to confirm but, as you found with the recommended AmpliFi network configuration, there can be worthwhile gains to be had with experimentation & careful setup of the network. Maddeningly complicated for ‘just’ 1s & 0s :)

[matthias]

Ubiquity Alien router + mesh point is currently being tested.
Very promising so far!

I am curious about an update, Fredrik!
Thank you :-)

[lejonklou]

No back and forth comparison has been made between Ubiquity Amplifi Alien and HD. It’s too complicated reconfiguring everything on the network.

Our impression is that Alien is the best sounding router we’ve ever tried, even better than HD. And HD used to be the best by far. They both also work so reliably. Highly recommended!

[tokenbrit]

No back and forth comparison has been made between Ubiquity Amplifi Alien and HD. It’s too complicated reconfiguring everything on the network.

Our impression is that Alien is the best sounding router we’ve ever tried, even better than HD. And HD used to be the best by far. They both also work so reliably. Highly recommended!

Is this when used as a (mesh?) pair, or are the benefits apparent as a single router or access point?

Currently I use an Apple Airport Express as the access point for Kalla, with 108T in between, but don't use an HD as it didn't have the home wifi features I wanted... Wondering if the Alien would improve the sound if it replaced the Apple AE.

[lejonklou]

I haven't tried the Airport Express, so I can't comment on that one.

Yes, this is used as router and the dedicated mesh point next to Källa (with a Netgear 108T switch in between). They were bought as a package (Amplifi Alien Router Kit), so the mesh point is a similar looking unit with no screen, not another Amplifi Alien.

[Hermann]

No back and forth comparison has been made between Ubiquity Amplifi Alien and HD. It’s too complicated reconfiguring everything on the network.

Our impression is that Alien is the best sounding router we’ve ever tried, even better than HD. And HD used to be the best by far. They both also work so reliably. Highly recommended!

I made the effort because I had the opportunity to buy a cheap Alien router (almost new). I set up a third WiFi network with it and because the HD of my 2. system is also controlled by an Amplifi, it had to be reset. Audio is sent via a Fritzbox via WiFi to an AVM repeater (2 LAN connections) and from there to the routers using a BJC cable.

So all you have to do is change the WiFi router in the iPad mini and replug the cable to the Källa. I've been listening via the Alien for a few hours and I'm impressed. It will play for a week and then I'll switch back to the Amplifi HD.

The first impression is amazing. In fact, an improvement both musically and in transparency and in the presentation of background information that was previously not or only hinted at. In other words, the Alien manages to make the entire presentation more rounded and pleasant. But the blowing noises of the saxophone also suddenly reveal a lightness that impresses and conveys the experience more authentically.

Already a worthwhile investment, especially since one of the three Amplifi HDs will soon no longer be needed.

Setup Router.jpg

Setup Källa.jpg

[Hermann]

On to the impressions. My wife joined later and her first comment was: "Nobody will believe you." And I hope some people test the Ubiquiti Alien and confirm our impressions.

Does everything sound better? Yes, everything. Although there was no dedicated IP address saved in the Källa setup at the time.

The frequency range seems to be expanded.

The highs? Clearer, more transparent, tends to be a bit treble-heavy. If, for example, I suddenly hear bells on the Pentangle for longer than before, something has changed.

And the mids? My wife's comment on Kari Bremne's voice (Det Vi Hat - Glem ikkje): "Like the Graham (5/5)." Almost true, if the size of the Isobarik's voice were the same as the Graham's. Unfortunately, it is shown larger.

The bass? I'm lost! Really. What's going on there makes me laugh and doubt my years of searching for damping for the walls in front of the Briks. There were two bass traps (220x60cm) that caused visual chaos. They had to be removed again. A good 2.5m behind the actual listening point is the couch on which I often listen and accept bass cancellation. And now the alien with a bass that clears everything up. No hole from bass in my ears and an audible depth that I hadn't noticed before. Amazing

And the musicality? Again amazing and keeps us grinning and our bodies moving. I would say similar to the direction of the upgrade of the Sagatun Monos 1.3 to 1.7, although not entirely.

Is there another side? Yes, unfortunately. The treble bias worries me here and there, although I had it well under control up until now. Further measures are probably necessary.

And the room behind the bricks? The same size, although much more understandable, since, among other things, new information is heard with almost every piece of music.

Other disadvantages? Yes and no. I find myself thinking that my digital chain is starting to nibble to much on the LP12 domain.

Recommendation? Definitely try it out and see how the alien can help the domestic chain move forward.

Bottom line? Worth every cent, almost regardless of the price.

[matthias]

Hermann,
thank you for your impressions.
IIUC, the router is Amplifi Alien and the meshpoints Amplifi HD?

[Sopper]

Hermann,
thank you for your impressions.
IIUC, the router is Amplifi Alien and the meshpoints Amplifi HD?

No, Alien cannot be combined with any other AMPLIFI

[Hermann]

Hermann,
thank you for your impressions.
IIUC, the router is Amplifi Alien and the meshpoints Amplifi HD?

Correct. Each setup has its own WiFi network. Amplifi Alien to Amplifi HD one way, the other Amplifi HD to Amplifi HD. For each network an Amplifi HD is integrated as a mesh point, which is connected to the Källa.

[matthias]

Correct. Each setup has its own WiFi network. Amplifi Alien to Amplifi HD one way, the other Amplifi HD to Amplifi HD. For each network an Amplifi HD is integrated as a mesh point, which is connected to the Källa.

Maybe the small SQ disadvantages disappear when you replace the HD meshpoint with an Alien meshpoint?

[Hermann]

Thanks Matthias. I would if the Alien didn't give off exactly that impression. The power supply isn't perfect yet and the BJC cable between the AVM Repeater and the Alien can be swapped, which has a significant impact on the sound.

[Hermann]

My first attempt to integrate the Alien as a mesh point failed. The only option left was to set it up as a router.

[matthias]

I think it is beneficial to use Fredrik's configuration with both Alien router and Alien meshpoint to Källa.

From the Amplifi homepage:

"The Alien product line is not "mesh-able" with our other product lines (HD, Gamer's Edition or Instant), since this would cause a degradation to the Alien and cause poor performance."

[Hermann]

Thanks for the info Matthias. Based on the tip I looked it up and also found a test that even claimed that a connection between Alien and HD was not possible. Nevertheless, an HD is successfully connected to the Alien as a mesh point via WLAN.

It is not clear to me in which configuration Fredrik is running Alien and Meshpoint, if it is the device in the picture.

Meshpoint.jpg

[matthias]

Hermann,
AFAIK, Fredrik is using both Alien router and Alien meshpoint. It is not the device in your last post.
The Alien meshpoint has the same dimensions, form factor and color like the Alien router but no touchscreen display and only one LAN port:
https://eu.store.ui.com/eu/en/category/ ... -meshpoint

[Hermann]

Thanks again. I wasn't aware of the Alien Range Extender and it seems it's only available as set.

Regarding the slightly brighter reproduction, a BJC5b between the AVM Repeater and Alien helped, which also, to my surprise, sounds slightly more musical than the BJC6.

[Hermann]

If you are interested in Amplifi Alien, the Ubiquiti Store Europe offers the set and the router at a much lower price.

https://eu.store.ui.com/eu/en/category/ ... -meshpoint

https://eu.store.ui.com/eu/en/category/ ... i-aln-r-eu

[Whatsmynaim]

They have an EU and UK version. I'm guessing for Sweden it's the EU one, right?
Also. If you got the time maybe you can post clips comparing the BJC6 with the BJC5b. I only got BJC6 at the moment.

[matthias]

AFAIK, for people with a combined modem/router from their ISP who want to use the Amplifi Alien router there are two possibilities:

1.)To put the ISP router in "Bridge Mode"
or
2.)To create a subnet with Amplifi Alien

1.)Seems to be impossible with "Fritzboxes" and some other ISP modem/routers.
2.)IIUC, according to tokenbrit's posts above is a subnet musically inferior.

So the very best solution is to have a separate modem without router.

[tokenbrit]

AFAIK, for people with a combined modem/router from their ISP who want to use the Amplifi Alien router there are two possibilities:

1.)To put the ISP router in "Bridge Mode"
or
2.)To create a subnet with Amplifi Alien

1.)Seems to be impossible with "Fritzboxes" and some other ISP modem/routers.
2.)IIUC, according to tokenbrit's posts above is a subnet musically inferior.

So the very best solution is to have a separate modem without router.

I said that, in my circumstance, with my router (not an Amplifi) my finding was a 'guest' network & vlan sounded musically inferior - I did not suggest that it was a 'rule'. Need to try & determine for yourself...

[matthias]

I said that, in my circumstance, with my router (not an Amplifi) my finding was a 'guest' network & vlan sounded musically inferior - I did not suggest that it was a 'rule'. Need to try & determine for yourself...

Yes, of course,
the subnet might be the only option when "Bridge Mode" is not possible.

[Hermann]

They have an EU and UK version. I'm guessing for Sweden it's the EU one, right?
Also. If you got the time maybe you can post clips comparing the BJC6 with the BJC5b. I only got BJC6 at the moment.

Hello Whatsmynaim
The EU version is probably the right one for Sweden. Regarding BJC 5 and 6, it is not easy to document this change with a recorder. Even the switch from AVM repeaters to Amplifi HD was not audible, although the improvement in my system was very large. The decision to use the BJC 5b again is solely due to the Alien router, which obviously copes better with the cable. However, it is not the one to the Källa, but from the last remaining AVM repeater to the Alien router. Used there, it sounds more balanced. This impression is also unlikely to be heard in a comparative recording. The cable between the AVM repeater and the first Amplifi Alien is easy to replace and I am happy to post clips. Between the 2nd Alien, the switch and Källa, the effort would be disproportionately high in my setup and I would like to avoid that.

Hi Matthias, or simply set up a second WiFi network. The bridge mode can be set in the amplifiers. I don't know to what extent this affects the sound, it wasn't an option for me.

A second alien router has been in use since yesterday morning. It's impossible to describe it objectively, but the night was long, very, very long...

[matthias]

Hi Matthias, or simply set up a second WiFi network.

Hi Hermann,
yes, to set up a second WiFi network for Audio with the Alien router in series to the existing home network with the ISP modem/router is the right thing to do. In this configuration the connection is from a LAN port of the ISP router to the WAN port of the Alien router. So it is not necessary to put the ISP router in "Bridge Mode".
Thanks for this advice.