Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2021-03-13 20:57
Interesting beck, thanks. I'm going to listen again to Daddy Lessons on vinyl and digital to check if I hear the same.
https://www.lejonklou.com/forum/
The most important lesson to learn is to trust ourselves and at the same time be willing to admit that we all can make mistakes........springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-13 20:57 Interesting beck, thanks. I'm going to listen again to Daddy Lessons on vinyl and digital to check if I hear the same.
I've never heard that explanation before: very interesting. Early in my career I developed mathematical filters for vehicle navigation systems (using the American Omega submarine navigation system), so overshoot and undershoot are familiar to me from long ago. I initially tried smoothing filters (alpha-beta) to reduce the distortions created by noise. However if I wanted the cars to stay near the roads, the overshoot and undershoot was far too great. The vehicle plots looked as though they were driven though treacle, desperately trying to get back on the road after every change in direction. Ease off the filtering and the cars leapt sporadically into nearby rivers or randomly reversed before shooting forward again.beck wrote: ↑2021-03-14 08:19 The most important lesson to learn is to trust ourselves and at the same time be willing to admit that we all can make mistakes........
I also prefer your “run” clip to your “time” clip.
One more thing: listening to vinyl will never be the same as listening to digital though I find that trying to close the gab between the two formats can be useful........
Remember this guy:
https://youtu.be/zaeugL-1QJo
Listen from 15.30 and learn why vinyl sounds different!
Same here. :-)springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-14 09:04
It is fun to try and close the gap between the two. I've found it useful to use my vinyl to guide my tuning of the digital, and the insight this forum provides via feedback is also a spur for me to listen again.
I don't know who this guy is, but he's wrong. A digital reproduction doesn't go "from zero to one" without overshoot or ringing unless the frequency range is infinite. And it's never infinite.beck wrote: ↑2021-03-14 08:19 Remember this guy:
https://youtu.be/zaeugL-1QJo
Listen from 15.30 and learn why vinyl sounds different.
Me too. He seems like the funny uncle in the family that always has a good story to tell! :-)
To my knowledge there isn't any "simple and catchy" one that explains it all.springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-15 08:49 Has anyone encountered a robust explanation of why vinyl replay of digital recordings is so often more enjoyable? Why does my 40 year old entry level turntable still sound more enjoyable than any digital replay I have tried?
The more I find out about digital the more it appears that it's supposed robustness is a lie - at least in relation to musical reproduction. The more research is done by people really listening the more it is found that all kinds of things that aren't supposed to make any difference make quite notable changes in the music. This has been shown here by numerous clips of things like the network switch, the power supply to that switch, different ethernet cables and their directions and all the different components that have been tried to come up with the LS-NAS and HAKAI.springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-15 08:49 That's a pity, I liked the story.
Has anyone encountered a robust explanation of why vinyl replay of digital recordings is so often more enjoyable? Why does my 40 year old entry level turntable still sound more enjoyable than any digital replay I have tried?
Prefer the first one,markiteight wrote: ↑2021-03-25 04:56 Here are a couple clips comparing HAKAI in "normal" configuration (HAKAI based NAS, Netgear GS108t, BJC cables) vs. the same file played directly into HAKAI via a USB thumb drive. Which do you prefer?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yai65spsctmem ... 3.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e237ukf5z6x13 ... F.MOV?dl=0
Second clip!springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-25 14:20 Comparison of Volumio (MPD 0.21.16, Intel 320 160GB SSD) and SnakeOil (MPD 0.21.22, Intel 320 120GB SSD)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kmzqafgr6zeilig/3B.mp4?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xflwrt20eo8014b/3C.mp4?dl=0
I prefer the first (top) clip.springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-25 14:20 Comparison of Volumio (MPD 0.21.16, Intel 320 160GB SSD) and SnakeOil (MPD 0.21.22, Intel 320 120GB SSD)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kmzqafgr6zeilig/3B.mp4?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xflwrt20eo8014b/3C.mp4?dl=0
More funk & hit from 2; softer but a bit more expressive from 1 - I'm with 'DN'markiteight wrote: ↑2021-03-25 04:56 Here are a couple clips comparing HAKAI in "normal" configuration (HAKAI based NAS, Netgear GS108t, BJC cables) vs. the same file played directly into HAKAI via a USB thumb drive. Which do you prefer?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yai65spsctmem ... 3.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e237ukf5z6x13 ... F.MOV?dl=0
The difference here is much smaller than I would expect it to be. I wonder why? Leaning towards the second clip.markiteight wrote: ↑2021-03-25 04:56 Here are a couple clips comparing HAKAI in "normal" configuration (HAKAI based NAS, Netgear GS108t, BJC cables) vs. the same file played directly into HAKAI via a USB thumb drive. Which do you prefer?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yai65spsctmem ... 3.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e237ukf5z6x13 ... F.MOV?dl=0
To which comparison are you referring, mine or Pete's?
Thanks, Matt. I appreciate your feedback. System deets here: https://www.lejonklou.com/forum/viewtop ... 223#p40223
I'll take door number 2.springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-25 14:20 Comparison of Volumio (MPD 0.21.16, Intel 320 160GB SSD) and SnakeOil (MPD 0.21.22, Intel 320 120GB SSD)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kmzqafgr6zeilig/3B.mp4?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xflwrt20eo8014b/3C.mp4?dl=0
I've been wondering the same thing. I'm laboring under the impression that storing music files on a NAS and feeding them to the streamer via a switch has the potential to be the most musical solution. Is that a safe assumption? If that's true then it's apparent from the closeness of these clips that the NAS, in its current state, is playing down to the USB stick's level. I hope that's the case because that means there's even more music to be had!
second clip...springwood64 wrote: ↑2021-03-25 14:20 Comparison of Volumio (MPD 0.21.16, Intel 320 160GB SSD) and SnakeOil (MPD 0.21.22, Intel 320 120GB SSD)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kmzqafgr6zeilig/3B.mp4?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xflwrt20eo8014b/3C.mp4?dl=0
Originally I thought Clip 1 by a small margin. More back and forth leads me to go with clip 2 by a small margin. Close enough for me.markiteight wrote: ↑2021-03-25 04:56 Here are a couple clips comparing HAKAI in "normal" configuration (HAKAI based NAS, Netgear GS108t, BJC cables) vs. the same file played directly into HAKAI via a USB thumb drive. Which do you prefer?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yai65spsctmem ... 3.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e237ukf5z6x13 ... F.MOV?dl=0
I actuay thought there was more funk and drive with 1, which is why I initially instinctively thought it was more musical. However, on repeated listens the more laid back nature of 2 revealed itself to be more musical imo. Just.tokenbrit wrote: ↑2021-03-25 20:52More funk & hit from 2; softer but a bit more expressive from 1 - I'm with 'DN'markiteight wrote: ↑2021-03-25 04:56 Here are a couple clips comparing HAKAI in "normal" configuration (HAKAI based NAS, Netgear GS108t, BJC cables) vs. the same file played directly into HAKAI via a USB thumb drive. Which do you prefer?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yai65spsctmem ... 3.MOV?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e237ukf5z6x13 ... F.MOV?dl=0