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Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 22:26
by FairPlayMotty
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-19 22:23
Source B clip A is missing in the upper set of clips (where source B clip B has been put in).
I had an early vote out but think I have to listen more to decide.
I'll have a look Beck, Gdrive jumps all over the place as you cut and paste.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 22:29
by FairPlayMotty
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-19 22:23
Source B clip A is missing in the upper set of clips (where source B clip B has been put in).
I had an early vote out but think I have to listen more to decide.
Well spotted sir, amended ;)
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 22:50
by beck
Sorry to be picky but now the volume is too low on source D clip A and source A clip B.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 22:55
by FairPlayMotty
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-19 22:50
Sorry to be picky but now the volume is too low on source D clip A and source A clip B.
It's the same preamp volume for three of the four sources and sounded identical in the room as measured by my ears and by the sound meter app.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 22:57
by beck
Never mind. I am going to pass on this. I have tried different ways of listening and I am quite sure I would not be able to pick one from the other if trying to identify a favorite after changing the position of the clips.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 23:06
by FairPlayMotty
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-19 22:57
Never mind. I am going to pass on this. I have tried different ways of listening and I am quite sure I would not be able to pick one from the other if trying to identify a favorite after changing the position of the clips.
No worries and thanks for the help ;)
You did surprise me with your early response and definitive agreement on source D for both clips.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 23:12
by beck
Well, I think I have become wiser but who knows? Have you tried listening to your own clips entering the same way as we do? I did not hear any difference in volume the first time around but after you made a change I hear it from the mentioned clips in my former post.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 23:16
by FairPlayMotty
I listened to all of them - the one thing I notice every time I do this is the differences are bigger in the room. Microphone quality I guess.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-19 23:39
by FairPlayMotty
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-19 23:12
Well, I think I have become wiser but who knows? Have you tried listening to your own clips entering the same way as we do? I did not hear any difference in volume the first time around but after you made a change I hear it from the mentioned clips in my former post.
To offer a little context here, I was aiming for consistency. So I used the same DAC (I have three), the same preamp input at the same volume if possible, and the same Linn silver RCA cables. One board outputs at a lower volume than the others so I adjusted the volume for it using the app and my ears. I'd be happier if all boards output at the same level.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-20 22:10
by FairPlayMotty
My daughter listened to all four sources today and with no prompting by me and listening to her music choices put them in the order I would in the room. She's had sufficient music education on a variety of instruments that she listens well. And I would pay a lot of money for seventeen year old ears! And for me, the ultimate musical change, erasing my memory of great albums so I could enjoy them afresh once more.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-21 19:14
by ThomasOK
On the first group of four clips Source B is also Clip B where the rest are Clip A. Among those three I like Source D the best and dislike Source A the most with Source C in the middle but probably closer to Source D. I haven't listened to the second set yet.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-21 19:22
by ThomasOK
OK, Clip B set. Source A was one notch quieter on my computer than the rest (whereas on Clip A, Source D was one step quieter). On this I would rank them from better to worse Source D, Source C, Source B, and Source A. Again I rather disliked Source A and it wasn't until I got to Source C that I was able to enjoy things enough to listen farther into the song than about 30 seconds. So Source D was again the best.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-21 19:31
by FairPlayMotty
ThomasOK wrote: ↑2020-01-21 19:14
On the first group of four clips Source B is also Clip B where the rest are Clip A. Among those three I like Source D the best and dislike Source A the most with Source C in the middle but probably closer to Source D. I haven't listened to the second set yet.
I've changed it twice in Gdrive. And played back what was posted. There is unfortunately nothing more I can do. The volume differences for one source are near impossible to correct. The output is much lower. Even using the sound meter app I cannot get it to be the same. And the power amps are already twenty one points higher for that source. It's very annoying.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-21 19:44
by FairPlayMotty
It's almost like motherboard manufacturers weren't expecting them to be used as HiFi :)
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-21 20:50
by FairPlayMotty
ThomasOK wrote: ↑2020-01-21 19:14
On the first group of four clips Source B is also Clip B where the rest are Clip A. Among those three I like Source D the best and dislike Source A the most with Source C in the middle but probably closer to Source D. I haven't listened to the second set yet.
I'm told if you refresh the page Thomas the clips are fine.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-23 09:48
by beck
FairPlayMotty wrote: ↑2020-01-20 22:10
My daughter listened to all four sources today and with no prompting by me and listening to her music choices put them in the order I would in the room. She's had sufficient music education on a variety of instruments that she listens well. And I would pay a lot of money for seventeen year old ears! And for me, the ultimate musical change, erasing my memory of great albums so I could enjoy them afresh once more.
Yes, it is nice to get help from good “fresh” ears. :-)
You have to understand though that what we do here has nothing to do with being young. A 70 year old person with bad hearing can with the right attitude hear what we listen for on this forum. It is not a problem not to have “perfect” hearing. It is something completely different.
We listen for the interaction of the instruments playing kind of like when you listen to a band for how they play together. Tight versus not tight. In tune versus not in tune and more.
Here because of the artificial sound from hifi systems we just have a lot more to try to “push” back into their “right” place.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-23 11:33
by V.A.MKD
+1 for "fresh ears", I check from time to time that with my wife ... if she dance ... it's good way ... lucky me she don't have my password from forum / here or she have it ... I will see soon :), if I'm not present here in near future :) she definitely have it ... :)))))
Also "fresh ears" + "fresh mind" = free from technical issues is good way ...
beck wrote: ↑2020-01-23 09:48
FairPlayMotty wrote: ↑2020-01-20 22:10
My daughter listened to all four sources today and with no prompting by me and listening to her music choices put them in the order I would in the room. She's had sufficient music education on a variety of instruments that she listens well. And I would pay a lot of money for seventeen year old ears! And for me, the ultimate musical change, erasing my memory of great albums so I could enjoy them afresh once more.
Yes, it is nice to get help from good “fresh” ears. :-)
You have to understand though that what we do here has nothing to do with being young. A 70 year old person with bad hearing can with the right attitude hear what we listen for on this forum. It is not a problem not to have “perfect” hearing. It is something completely different.
We listen for the interaction of the instruments playing kind of like when you listen to a band for how they play together. Tight versus not tight. In tune versus not in tune and more.
Here because of the artificial sound from hifi systems we just have a lot more to try to “push” back into their “right” place.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-29 16:35
by maffe
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-29 17:44
by V.A.MKD
Hmmm ... all are very close ... must to go 2-3 times with TM, with 2 different headphones = double pass all clips ...
No. 1 for me is Clip 3 - easier to follow all instruments and all are playing together in Tune, easier to follow the rhythm and its real ... ;
No. 2 for me is Clip 2 - less in Tune and more HiFi ... (cat was not counted ... :));
No. 3 for me is Clip 1 - Lower section or bass is with some issue ...
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-31 21:04
by ThomasOK
Yep, I would rank them 3, 2, 1 as well. Clip 3 is the only one I really enjoyed. On Clip 1 I found the intro instrument actively annoying. Clip 2 wasn't as bad but didn't flow and move like Clip 3.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-31 23:14
by Lego
On initial listening I preferred clip 2 to 1 immediately, when I got to clip 3 I couldn't say clip 3 was better than clip 2.. I find the guitar sings more in clip 2..so I'd have to go with 2. I wish I didn't know what I was listening to though
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-01-31 23:16
by Lego
Thanks for posting that maffe did you find Tinker board output lower than Hakai? Although I always felt the Hakai was a bit too hot
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-02-01 02:31
by Spannko
Clip 3’s best for me too.
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-03-02 20:21
by OscarH
Time to test the new Hakai on the block.
This first one is just to benchmark the previous digital playback solution (little HP laptop into the Hegel H80 amp’s built in DAC) against the no-frills Hakai (3050N-D2P MB, else exactly to spec, but no cable upgrades etc).
EDIT: I should add that the HP plays from its own hard drive whereas the hakai plays from a Hakai NAS.
My own expectation bias is through the roof...
I’ve tried to match the volumes however the two setups have vastly different output levels.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/qr51c6i4ty7c ... or0pa?dl=0
Re: HAKAI playground
Posted: 2020-03-02 20:29
by beck
Both are good but TWO is great in that the band members seem to play perfectly together. So TWO is my choice.