General discussion about HAKAI

A DIY digital music streamer with exceptional performance

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Azazello
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-19 09:39

David Neel wrote:I will make further comparisons with the ADS/3, but if I can make the HAKAI work better with my music library (even if re-ripping is required) then I suspect its musicality will win.
So what's the verdict this far? We are dying from curiosity!

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Re: HAKAI

Post by David Neel » 2018-08-19 11:07

The verdict so far is provisional! First the issues in getting it up and running:

1. The difficulties I had getting Volumio to work were immensely frustrating but can be overcome with strict adherence to Azazello's instructions.
2. The difficulties I had getting Volumio to communicate with my LSNAS were in the fine detail of Windows settings on the LSNAS and I have overcome them by trial and error (happy to respond by PM if anyone else encounters this).
3. In the middle of all this I triggered a contract breaker and plunged my flat into darkness. When everything was powered back up again nothing worked until I realised that all the IP addresses had changed on reboot....

Then a couple of qualifications:

1. Replacement of my GS105 and Belkin ethernet cables with GS108T and Blue Jeans cables is an upgrade worth doing on its own, but I only gave the ADS/3 a few minutes to confirm this. In retrospect I should have got used to this change first.
2. I'm also in the middle of evaluating some filtering power strips and power cables, and I need to complete this as much as possible before some items have to be returned tomorrow. I did try to do a very structured process, but confusion reigned with too many variables. I will therefore complete this evaluation without the HAKAI.

Finally, initial impressions:

1. There is great openness and delicacy with HAKAI, it is very musical. The presentation is rather different from the ADS/3, and this seems to work better on some tracks than others.
2. It is more sensitive to power strip changes than the ADS/3. I have been swapping the Linn power cord ( and the same Linn silvers) between HAKAI and ADS/3.

So the HAKAI will not be used for a couple of days while I complete the power strip comparisons, and I've removed my ADS/3 from sale. I need to emphasise that if I sell the ADS/3 it will not necessarily mean the HAKAI is better, but rather the HAKAI being close enough and enjoyable enough as a secondary source. I've spent rather a lot in the last year, and I'm likely to need some spare cash when Fredrik releases his MC phono stage.

And before the HAKAI is definitively compared, I'll need a Deltaco SATA cable - I have a plan.
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-19 14:42

Thank you for the report David! Looking forward to hear about your long-term conclusions.

One thing that might not have been discussed is that the variation during burn-in are quite big. I think you should listen to the HAKAI for a few weeks, feel how it feels, and then go back to the ADS, rather than the opposite :) That way, you will get a better feel for the ups and downs, and what the stable performance is.

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Re: HAKAI

Post by David Neel » 2018-08-19 19:34

Azazello wrote:Thank you for the report David! Looking forward to hear about your long-term conclusions.

One thing that might not have been discussed is that the variation during burn-in are quite big. I think you should listen to the HAKAI for a few weeks, feel how it feels, and then go back to the ADS, rather than the opposite :) That way, you will get a better feel for the ups and downs, and what the stable performance is.
Thanks, Azazello!

Power strip evaluations now finished. ADS/3 reflashed to latest Davaar - nice! Deltaco SATA cable installed in Hakai. Now I've removed the ADS and will listen to Hakai instead while it burns in.
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Lego » 2018-08-20 22:19

That's a week now I've been using Volumio and I must say I take back what I said about it being flaky, I think it's very robust and stable as I've had absolutely no issues with it .

Using their app combined with Volumios's hotspot keeps things simple . Obviously make sure you change hotspot password :0)

The only thing that took a bit getting used to is when streamer is powered up it takes the app about 45 sec to see Nas drives .

So what do you think guys is building a Hakai Nas going to have a more musical effect than building a streamer first !?
Last edited by Lego on 2018-08-21 07:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: HAKAI

Post by fatjulio » 2018-08-20 23:56

It seems the big challenge in sourcing the components is the motherboard. I've been looking around and have found some of the n3150n-d3v in far away places that don't ship outside their country. I'm in New Zealand, so I'm far away anyway. How have people been going sourcing a motherboard?

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Re: HAKAI

Post by mrco99 » 2018-08-21 06:47

I agree - haven't been able to track one of the two preferred motherboards down. I did miss out on one offered here locally that got snapped away right under my nose by a fellow 'Hakaier' :-)

I am all for helping each other out, so should you find one which can be shipped to The Netherlands then I will gladly forward it to you.

Cheers,

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Re: HAKAI

Post by Charlie1 » 2018-08-21 10:43

I am a bit of a numpty when it comes to all this. Is it possible for me to replace our Sneaky DS with Nait, and then connect the Gigaport DAC to both the Nait and Mac? Is that all I need to do for Internet streaming from Google Play? Would I need, or benefit from, installing any specific s/w on the Mac (assuming I can't run Volumio)?

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Re: HAKAI

Post by Lego » 2018-08-21 12:33

Charlie1 wrote:I am a bit of a numpty when it comes to all this. Is it possible for me to replace our Sneaky DS with Nait, and then connect the Gigaport DAC to both the Nait and Mac? Is that all I need to do for Internet streaming from Google Play? Would I need, or benefit from, installing any specific s/w on the Mac (assuming I can't run Volumio)?
Yes you could do this and flash an ssd with Volumio and put it in your mac or any other old laptop you dont need.I have bubble and it sees the volumio as a renderer but I get an error when I try and stream Google Play .But it does work with iphone according to Azazello
Last edited by Lego on 2018-08-21 12:39, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Sopper » 2018-08-21 15:13

Gigabyte GA-N3050N-D3H - arrived
Streacom F1CWS Evo - ordered
Streacom Nano160 - ordered
Intel 320 SSD - shipped
Kingston ValueRAM 2 x 4GB 1600MHz SO-DIMM - ordered
ESI Gigaport HD+ - ordered

Ethernet Cables, usb Cable, SATA cable - another time, all from abroad

So, next week good to go... :)
# HAKAI # Sagatun mono + Tundra mono # Harbeth SHL5+ 40th Ann # Mogami Neglex III 2803 + 2804

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Re: HAKAI

Post by maffe » 2018-08-21 18:41

I just had to try Volumio, so I bought a raspberry pi3 b+ And Connected to a Nait2 and Tukans.
Works just fine, no problem with flashing the microSD and get it up and running connected to Ethernet. Web UI worked to do the set up, no need to hook up to screen or keyboard.
Using the web UI to browse a large catalog on the NAS running MinimServer could have been easier.
Tried using Kazoo as control point, it do work but won’t play ALAC-files then, that do work using the web UI Tidal support yet, but airplay from iPhone works since the RPI have WiFi and BT. Guess that wouldn’t work on the “Hakai”?

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Re: HAKAI

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-22 10:20

Lego wrote:That's a week now I've been using Volumio and I must say I take back what I said about it being flaky, I think it's very robust and stable as I've had absolutely no issues with it.
Unfortunately, I think it is really really unstable specifically with HAKAI, while it might work just fine with other systems.

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Re: HAKAI

Post by David Neel » 2018-08-22 11:35

My experience is that, once up and running, the only issues have happened when switching between DS and Hakai - neither Volumio nor BubbleDS likes to lose its exclusivity on the LSNAS.
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Lego » 2018-08-22 12:34

Azazello wrote:
Lego wrote:That's a week now I've been using Volumio and I must say I take back what I said about it being flaky, I think it's very robust and stable as I've had absolutely no issues with it.
Unfortunately, I think it is really really unstable specifically with HAKAI, while it might work just fine with other systems.
Are you using your wireless network or volumios wireless network to control Azazello ?
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-22 15:04

Lego wrote:Are you using your wireless network or volumios wireless network to control Azazello ?

I'm using my wireless network. Are there more ways?

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Re: HAKAI

Post by Lego » 2018-08-22 15:51

Go to the wifi settings on your device(mobile/tablet) and you'll see volumio's network appear.

Sign in, I think the password is Vovumio2, check their site. It works well with their app.

Obviously, change the password if that's going to be your daily driver
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Re: HAKAI

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-23 12:53

Its probably good if we try to stay strict on topic in this thread, since it's going to be important for everyone trying to build a HAKAI. Please start new threads for discussions about DAC-technology and things like that :)

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Re: HAKAI

Post by lejonklou » 2018-08-23 14:27

I will give HAKAI a separate forum category (Azazello's idea). That way we can have multiple discussions around the various parts of hardware, software versions, theoretical discussions, etc.

I just need to build some more Tundra 2.5's first, there's a bunch of them on order.

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Re: HAKAI

Post by matthias » 2018-08-23 16:48

lejonklou wrote:I will give HAKAI a separate forum category (Azazello's idea). That way we can have multiple discussions around the various parts of hardware, software versions, theoretical discussions, etc.
Very good idea, but then we should delete the HAKAI thread from the "Inside" to have only one HAKAI thread.
Thanks

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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by ThomasOK » 2018-08-23 17:04

I agree, with HAKAI in two places people won't know which one to post on and things will get messy.
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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by tokenbrit » 2018-08-24 20:14

Just looking for clarification on motherboards: I've been looking for the recommended Gigabyte Mini-ITX motherboards here in the US, with similar challenges to others. In the process, I did come across a GA-N3050N, listed as a mini-itx format board, but this one is GSM Plus, and looks quite different from the GA-N3050N-D2P... Just sharing to help clear up any confusion, especially my own, in case someone thinks they've struck gold: it looks like the GSM Plus version is not a match. Happy for someone else to check & verify. Thks.

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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by David Neel » 2018-08-24 21:38

Motherboards!

I struck lucky by finding a N3050N-D2P on ebay. So far, so good. Built a HAKAI. Then I got greedy. I wanted to see whether a HAKAI NAS would beat my LSNAS. So I bought a 3150N-D3V for its extra SATA ports, "untested". When I realised it had no HDMI, and I had no means of seeing what was going on, there was no way of reconciling that it didn't work at home, but when I took it to my local pc repair shop, it booted perfectly into Volumio! Watch the for sale forum...

So I have a J3455-D3V on order....
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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by lejonklou » 2018-08-24 22:46

tokenbrit wrote:Just looking for clarification on motherboards: I've been looking for the recommended Gigabyte Mini-ITX motherboards here in the US, with similar challenges to others. In the process, I did come across a GA-N3050N, listed as a mini-itx format board, but this one is GSM Plus, and looks quite different from the GA-N3050N-D2P... Just sharing to help clear up any confusion, especially my own, in case someone thinks they've struck gold: it looks like the GSM Plus version is not a match. Happy for someone else to check & verify. Thks.
I believe that the GSM Plus board you're looking at is not powered by an ATX power supply. I have one of those, we labelled it MR8 at the time and it's still occasionally playing music at my lab. The problem is that it requires a really optimised DC power supply to perform well. So skip it and remember that ATX power is required for this DIY project.

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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by Azazello » 2018-08-24 23:29

David Neel wrote:Motherboards!

I struck lucky by finding a N3050N-D2P on ebay. So far, so good. Built a HAKAI. Then I got greedy. I wanted to see whether a HAKAI NAS would beat my LSNAS. So I bought a 3150N-D3V for its extra SATA ports, "untested". When I realised it had no HDMI, and I had no means of seeing what was going on, there was no way of reconciling that it didn't work at home, but when I took it to my local pc repair shop, it booted perfectly into Volumio! Watch the for sale forum...

So I have a J3455-D3V on order....
Not sure I understand what you are trying to say? Is the 3150N-D3V much better then the N3050N-D2P..?

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Re: General discussion about HAKAI (Split from original thread)

Post by tokenbrit » 2018-08-24 23:30

lejonklou wrote:I believe that the GSM Plus board you're looking at is not powered by an ATX power supply... So skip it and remember that ATX power is required for this DIY project.
Thanks Fredrik. That was my take on it given what you said about the 3160TN... Will wait for a recommended m'board to become available... (and watch for a review of the J3455-D3V ;)

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