Thinking of upgrading from 4200/D to Tundra Stereo.
However, has anyone compared KK1/D and 'X' power amp to the Boazu? What I'm asking is, can the Boazu pre-amp section compete with KK1/D?
Benefit of Boazu is that I could then afford to upgrade my arm to SE/1 version, but if the KK1D is better than Boazu preamp section then I don't think I'll bother.
Also, I know the Tundra Stereo is a good match for 242s, but can the Boazu handle them too? The spec's state they deliver the same power. I know I don't have 242s but I wouldn't want to rule out them being used one day.
Amp Options
Moderator: Staff
Re: Amp Options
Funny you should ask. I had an interesting experience involving this that I haven't managed to report yet. This seems the appropriate time and place.
I had a customer in having me check a recent setup I had done on his LP12. He was actually the first customer to call me back and say he was not happy with the sound of the setup and new cartridge in his system. I had installed an Adikt in his LP12/Valhalla/Ittok and rebuilt the Valhalla. Then did a full setup and put on a new felt mat. He and his son both thought their system sounded too bright. So they came in together and brought it in for a check. I went over it and made a small adjustment to arm height but it was actually in fine shape. So we listened to it compared to the store Majik LP12 and we all agreed that they were tonally very similar. Musically they weren't far apart either. I then asked them if they would like to hear the fully loaded LP12 Klimax and they were excited to do so. I had it hooked through a KK/2 and 2200 into some big Dynaudio Contour speakers. I put on a track from Jethro Tulls' Aqualung and the son said it was one of his favorites. They fully enjoyed how much music was coming out of the system. Then, just out of curiosity as I had brought the Boazu in that morning and hadn't done any comparisons yet, I asked if they would like to hear a comparison and they did. So without telling them what I was doing (I already had the Boazu on the shelf plugged in and warming up) I switched to the Boazu. Almost immediately the son said "I like this better." and the father also felt the Boazu was more musical. I told them that I agreed as it was indeed more tuneful with better pace and flow. They asked what had changed and I told them it was the Lejonklou Boazu at $4199 vs. the Linn KK/2200 at $18,700. They were quite taken aback that the Boazu would be that much better.
To be honest I was as well. The last time I did a comparison with the KK/2 was when the Sagatun was upgraded to 1.1. Since the 1.0 and the KK/2 were neck and neck I had wanted to see if the .1 upgrade would push the Sagatun ahead. At the time I still found they were very close with the Sagatun 1.1 better in some aspects and the KK/2 better in others. I liked the Sagatun a little better overall, as I had with the 1.0, but there was no clear overall winner. I had not gotten around to doing a Sagatun 1.3/Tarandus vs. KK/2 comparison. So when I made the offer to do the comparo it was in large part because I wanted to hear how close the Boazu would come at less than a quarter of the price - I had no expectation that it would actually be better. But it was, and clearly so.
Over the next several weeks I had the opportunity to do the comparison for six more people. They were owners of various pieces of Hi-Fi gear - not just Linn people. All except one felt that the Boazu was easily more musical. The one had a hard time deciding, liking the KK/2200 by a little on the first track but preferring the Boazu on the second track (it had just been plugged back in so warmup could have been part of this). He is an owner of big, tube McIntosh electronics and huge JBL horn speakers fronted by a fully loaded LP12 so he is used to somewhat different sound. One of the others was not a Linn fan so he wasn't surprised when the Boazu was better. He is more a fan of another line of transistor electronics but was more thoroughly convinced when he heard the Boaze easily dispatch their $9000 amp. So a fair number of people did indeed prefer the Boazu to the KK/2200 combo. They were, of course, compared plugged into the same power strip, with Linn AC cables and K20 on the Linn gear and Boazu and Linn Silvers connecting the preamp and power amp.
It was a very interesting finding. I'd like to hear what others have found if they have had a chance to do this comparison.
In regards to the other question, the Boazu has the same power amp stage as the Tundra 2 with the exception of using a less expensive TIM (the same one used on the original Tundra and Tundra Mono) and, of course, sharing power supplies with the preamp stage. So it has basically the same abilities when it comes to driving speakers.
By the way, as regards to the LP12 and the customer system being bright, he called me back a few days later to tell me he hooked up the LP12 at home but didn't get to listen very long as the 30 year old Rotel amp he was using promptly blew up and took a few of the drivers in his original Isobariks with it. Somehow he suspects the near failure amp might have something to do with the bad sound and is now getting repairs sorted out. Maybe he needs a new amp? I have a couple of suggestions! ;-)
I had a customer in having me check a recent setup I had done on his LP12. He was actually the first customer to call me back and say he was not happy with the sound of the setup and new cartridge in his system. I had installed an Adikt in his LP12/Valhalla/Ittok and rebuilt the Valhalla. Then did a full setup and put on a new felt mat. He and his son both thought their system sounded too bright. So they came in together and brought it in for a check. I went over it and made a small adjustment to arm height but it was actually in fine shape. So we listened to it compared to the store Majik LP12 and we all agreed that they were tonally very similar. Musically they weren't far apart either. I then asked them if they would like to hear the fully loaded LP12 Klimax and they were excited to do so. I had it hooked through a KK/2 and 2200 into some big Dynaudio Contour speakers. I put on a track from Jethro Tulls' Aqualung and the son said it was one of his favorites. They fully enjoyed how much music was coming out of the system. Then, just out of curiosity as I had brought the Boazu in that morning and hadn't done any comparisons yet, I asked if they would like to hear a comparison and they did. So without telling them what I was doing (I already had the Boazu on the shelf plugged in and warming up) I switched to the Boazu. Almost immediately the son said "I like this better." and the father also felt the Boazu was more musical. I told them that I agreed as it was indeed more tuneful with better pace and flow. They asked what had changed and I told them it was the Lejonklou Boazu at $4199 vs. the Linn KK/2200 at $18,700. They were quite taken aback that the Boazu would be that much better.
To be honest I was as well. The last time I did a comparison with the KK/2 was when the Sagatun was upgraded to 1.1. Since the 1.0 and the KK/2 were neck and neck I had wanted to see if the .1 upgrade would push the Sagatun ahead. At the time I still found they were very close with the Sagatun 1.1 better in some aspects and the KK/2 better in others. I liked the Sagatun a little better overall, as I had with the 1.0, but there was no clear overall winner. I had not gotten around to doing a Sagatun 1.3/Tarandus vs. KK/2 comparison. So when I made the offer to do the comparo it was in large part because I wanted to hear how close the Boazu would come at less than a quarter of the price - I had no expectation that it would actually be better. But it was, and clearly so.
Over the next several weeks I had the opportunity to do the comparison for six more people. They were owners of various pieces of Hi-Fi gear - not just Linn people. All except one felt that the Boazu was easily more musical. The one had a hard time deciding, liking the KK/2200 by a little on the first track but preferring the Boazu on the second track (it had just been plugged back in so warmup could have been part of this). He is an owner of big, tube McIntosh electronics and huge JBL horn speakers fronted by a fully loaded LP12 so he is used to somewhat different sound. One of the others was not a Linn fan so he wasn't surprised when the Boazu was better. He is more a fan of another line of transistor electronics but was more thoroughly convinced when he heard the Boaze easily dispatch their $9000 amp. So a fair number of people did indeed prefer the Boazu to the KK/2200 combo. They were, of course, compared plugged into the same power strip, with Linn AC cables and K20 on the Linn gear and Boazu and Linn Silvers connecting the preamp and power amp.
It was a very interesting finding. I'd like to hear what others have found if they have had a chance to do this comparison.
In regards to the other question, the Boazu has the same power amp stage as the Tundra 2 with the exception of using a less expensive TIM (the same one used on the original Tundra and Tundra Mono) and, of course, sharing power supplies with the preamp stage. So it has basically the same abilities when it comes to driving speakers.
By the way, as regards to the LP12 and the customer system being bright, he called me back a few days later to tell me he hooked up the LP12 at home but didn't get to listen very long as the 30 year old Rotel amp he was using promptly blew up and took a few of the drivers in his original Isobariks with it. Somehow he suspects the near failure amp might have something to do with the bad sound and is now getting repairs sorted out. Maybe he needs a new amp? I have a couple of suggestions! ;-)
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Re: Amp Options
Thanks Thomas. Plenty to think about.
Do you think the gap between Ekos SE and SE/1 is bigger then Akurate to Klimax Radikal? I seem to recall Fredrik thinking the newer arm is quite a bit better. Whereas, no one here seems to think the Klimax Radikal offers very much more.
Do you think the gap between Ekos SE and SE/1 is bigger then Akurate to Klimax Radikal? I seem to recall Fredrik thinking the newer arm is quite a bit better. Whereas, no one here seems to think the Klimax Radikal offers very much more.
Re: Amp Options
Boazu sounded just great with my 242s.Charlie1 wrote:Thinking of upgrading from 4200/D to Tundra Stereo.
Also, I know the Tundra Stereo is a good match for 242s, but can the Boazu handle them too? The spec's state they deliver the same power. I know I don't have 242s but I wouldn't want to rule out them being used one day.
I did not feel I was losing much - until the upgraded Monos ( Sagatun and Tundras ) returned from Sweden.
PS When I had KDS/1 and AK/1 and Tundra stereo - the jump from Ninkas to 242s was incredible. So its definitely a good idea not to rule them out!
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Re: Amp Options
I never really got a chance to evaluate the Ekos SE vs the SE/1. I wasn't expecting any difference and there was a gap between selling my SE and getting my SE/1. So I can't be of much help in this regard. Nor really on the Klimax Radikal. Between the changes in my personal life and work at home I haven't had time to do the comparisons I want to do between the Klimax and Akurate Radikals. I do intend to do it and my kitchen rebuild is almost done so I hope to address a number of Hi-Fi concerns this fall. But I unplugged the stereo before I went on vacation the second week of August and didn't get around to plugging it in until this past weekend. (It didn't help that there was a living room full of IKEA cabinet boxes until recently.)Charlie1 wrote:Thanks Thomas. Plenty to think about.
Do you think the gap between Ekos SE and SE/1 is bigger then Akurate to Klimax Radikal? I seem to recall Fredrik thinking the newer arm is quite a bit better. Whereas, no one here seems to think the Klimax Radikal offers very much more.
However, I should point out that, as the power supply is further up the hierarchy than the tonearm a small improvement there should be more important than a larger one in the arm. But until I do my tests I can't say for certain there is a real musical difference in the Radikals. My impression is that my KR is a bit more musical than the AR it replaced but previous tests made me feel that any difference was likely due to unit to unit variation. This is why I need to do a more scientific and conclusive test of the two.
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Re: Amp Options
Thanks Thomas.
Re: Amp Options
Great to know, thanks.u252agz wrote:Boazu sounded just great with my 242s.
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Ozzzy189
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Re: Amp Options
Charlie is being spoilt here with such an informative and detailed response, he's indeed got a lot of thinking to do and a few calls to make! That was a great read Thomas, thank you, made my wait for a blood test much more bearable!
Give Chris Fuller a bell dude, he can sort you out with something I'm sure, and if you want to hear pre upgraded sagatun monos and stereo give me a call.
Regards
Ozzzy
Give Chris Fuller a bell dude, he can sort you out with something I'm sure, and if you want to hear pre upgraded sagatun monos and stereo give me a call.
Regards
Ozzzy
ADS3/SagMono/Tundra 2.2- . Totem Tribe Tower.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
Lejonklou demos available in the N of England.
Re: Amp Options
And Boazu has just been upgraded to 1.1 even more musical !
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Re: Amp Options
Thanks guys!
Re: Amp Options
Not sure it's related to the original posters question on the thread but it was asked a few posts up. I have heard a demo of radikals (akurate to Klimax) at Billy Vs near London. There is a clear musical improvement going to Klimax. Both sound great but once you hear the Klimax after the Akurate version it's obviously better. Then Ian Ritchie used 2 Klimax radikals, one powering the motor, other phono stage and again there was a very noticeable improvement in musicality - quite shockingly so.