Apologies for the slight off topic given the split thread, but the formatting of this did make me laugh! :-)
Thoughts around a Lejonklou Streamer
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- rowlandhills
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Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
KRDSM, Tundra to 242s
Silvers, K400, Hutter rack
Silvers, K400, Hutter rack
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
I heard MQA on the HiFi show High End in Stockholm last weekend. It sounded OK on an expensive Meridian system. No comparisons were made with regular files, although I had explained before the demo to the Meridian rep about my professional interest in how it actually performs AND repeatedly asked for a comparison during the demo. The answer was "It won't be a fair comparison because regular files vary in performance bla bla bla", to which I asked if we could please have a quick UNfair comparison? No, we couldn't. Which was ridiculous because the songs he played were famous and could be streamed from Tidal in an instant, to that Meridian streamer he was using.matthias wrote:MQA, the next big format?ThomasOK wrote:I was wondering if Lejonklou is investigating MQA and do you have any thoughts about it? I know little about it but it is starting to get talked up as the next big format.
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f8-ge ... ces-27127/
Matt
After this disappointment, I read some more about MQA on the web and couldn't find a single person reporting about the musical benefits of the format after having done a comparison. So apparently their strategy is to avoid comparisons as far as possible. Seems serious, doesn't it?
The fact that I signed up for more information for manufacturers on the MQA website and never heard back from them doesn't really bother me. But that they actively avoid comparisons really does.
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Matt, notice I said talked up, I have no experience with it at all.
Fredrik, that is rather disappointing. I see in the linked Computer Audiophile thread that one of the first posts was someone else who complained of Meridian not doing comparisons of the difference between MQA files and normal files. Seems to be the corporate way. Does tend to make you wonder what they have to hide.
I had a similar problem listening to Raidho speakers a couple of years ago. They played about four pieces and it occurred to me that none of them had any highs. I asked the person putting on the demo, who I know, if we could listen to something that had cymbals in it. He just said: "There is that." got up and walked away to talk to someone else. Guess cymbals weren't a good idea!
Fredrik, that is rather disappointing. I see in the linked Computer Audiophile thread that one of the first posts was someone else who complained of Meridian not doing comparisons of the difference between MQA files and normal files. Seems to be the corporate way. Does tend to make you wonder what they have to hide.
I had a similar problem listening to Raidho speakers a couple of years ago. They played about four pieces and it occurred to me that none of them had any highs. I asked the person putting on the demo, who I know, if we could listen to something that had cymbals in it. He just said: "There is that." got up and walked away to talk to someone else. Guess cymbals weren't a good idea!
The LP12 Whisperer
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer and above all lover of music.
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Thomas, sorry, no offense intended, but after reading the pages on the CA forum I was fed up with MQA. I have to say I do like neither the technology nor the philosophy behind it. MQA is not lossless like FLAC or ALAC and Fredrik would have to pay a lot of money for a MQA licensed streamer.ThomasOK wrote:Matt, notice I said talked up, I have no experience with it at all.
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
If MQA can compete with up to 24/192 just using the bandwidth of 24/48 FLAC makes it interesting. What they do seem to be hidden, or maybe I have not searched enough? As Fredrik stated it seem to sound ok, but I have only heard it using a Meridian USB-DAC connected to the PC. Not the most ultimate test... My impression is that it kind of sharpen the sound, but without degrading the information. Impressive accomplishment if it works generally.matthias wrote:Thomas, sorry, no offense intended, but after reading the pages on the CA forum I was fed up with MQA. I have to say I do like neither the technology nor the philosophy behind it. MQA is not lossless like FLAC or ALAC and Fredrik would have to pay a lot of money for a MQA licensed streamer.
We plan to investigate this further and maybe even release music on MQA.
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/blogs ... -flac-674/hcl wrote: If MQA can compete with up to 24/192 just using the bandwidth of 24/48 FLAC makes it interesting. What they do seem to be hidden, or maybe I have not searched enough? As Fredrik stated it seem to sound ok, but I have only heard it using a Meridian USB-DAC connected to the PC. Not the most ultimate test... My impression is that it kind of sharpen the sound, but without degrading the information. Impressive accomplishment if it works generally.
We plan to investigate this further and maybe even release music on MQA.
Kind regards
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Excellent, I hadn't read this before. Thank you Matt!matthias wrote:http://www.computeraudiophile.com/blogs ... -flac-674/hcl wrote: If MQA can compete with up to 24/192 just using the bandwidth of 24/48 FLAC makes it interesting. What they do seem to be hidden, or maybe I have not searched enough? As Fredrik stated it seem to sound ok, but I have only heard it using a Meridian USB-DAC connected to the PC. Not the most ultimate test... My impression is that it kind of sharpen the sound, but without degrading the information. Impressive accomplishment if it works generally.
We plan to investigate this further and maybe even release music on MQA.
Kind regards
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Thanks, but what is the conclusion from that apart from that MQA:ed files should be played through a MQA capable player? What I'm most interested in is what kind of filtering they apply to achieve the really short impulse response they claim to have (addressing the time smearing issue of ordinary anti-aliasing filters)? I haven't seen that covered anywhere.matthias wrote:http://www.computeraudiophile.com/blogs ... -flac-674/hcl wrote: If MQA can compete with up to 24/192 just using the bandwidth of 24/48 FLAC makes it interesting. What they do seem to be hidden, or maybe I have not searched enough? As Fredrik stated it seem to sound ok, but I have only heard it using a Meridian USB-DAC connected to the PC. Not the most ultimate test... My impression is that it kind of sharpen the sound, but without degrading the information. Impressive accomplishment if it works generally.
We plan to investigate this further and maybe even release music on MQA.
Kind regards
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
IMO, regarding Ethernet Streaming the most interesting thing at the moment is AES67 Ravenna.
There are rumours that in autumn are coming OEM Ravenna boards with I2S output on the market.
Ravenna is able to do DSD up to DSD512 and PCM.
Matt
There are rumours that in autumn are coming OEM Ravenna boards with I2S output on the market.
Ravenna is able to do DSD up to DSD512 and PCM.
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Thanks Matt!matthias wrote:IMO, regarding Ethernet Streaming the most interesting thing at the moment is AES67 Ravenna.
There are rumours that in autumn are coming OEM Ravenna boards with I2S output on the market.
Ravenna is able to do DSD up to DSD512 and PCM.
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
At the moment there are two interesting threads on other forums about Audio over IP(AES67):
http://www.head-fi.org/t/806827/audio-o ... uter-audio
and
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-n ... net-28878/
These threads are mostly about Dante, but there will be upcoming Ravenna devices as well.
Matt
http://www.head-fi.org/t/806827/audio-o ... uter-audio
and
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-n ... net-28878/
These threads are mostly about Dante, but there will be upcoming Ravenna devices as well.
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Linn uses now in the new Katalyst DAC the AK4497 DAC chip. Interesting!
Matt
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
AKM DACs are very good!
But how the digital signal is handled before it reaches the DAC is way more important. Source first applies there too, just like it does in the rest of the system.
But how the digital signal is handled before it reaches the DAC is way more important. Source first applies there too, just like it does in the rest of the system.
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Yes, for sure.lejonklou wrote: But how the digital signal is handled before it reaches the DAC is way more important. Source first applies there too, just like it does in the rest of the system.
They claim that they have optimised every parameter important for the DAC.
I am curious to listen to it and to compare to my personal references.
Matt
- macrotech2
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Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
They claim to now have a rock steady reference level which wasn't there before apparently. Perhaps this will reduce the effects of "noise" getting mixed in with the digital signal from Ethernet cables and within the unit. I wonder whether the perceived changes from software updates will now reduce as well.
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Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
macrotech2 wrote:They claim to now have a rock steady reference level which wasn't there before apparently.
Well...to just take ONE example, Linn claiming "independent Power Supplies".matthias wrote:They claim that they have optimised every parameter important for the DAC.
Looking at the pics on a KDS/3, the PSU has one cable feeding the circuit board. The cable and connector look very (if not identical) to my KDS/2.
But I can be wrong.
I think the markting department got a bit too faar this time as well. We all remember the "source is in the speaker" that is now removed from the Exakt description.
It's all about musical understanding!
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
IMO, the usual marketing bla-bla, the clock they use is not top spec too.Music Lover wrote: Well...to just take ONE example, Linn claiming "independent Power Supplies".
Looking at the pics on a KDS/3, the PSU has one cable feeding the circuit board. The cable and connector look very (if not identical) to my KDS/2.
But I can be wrong.
I think the markting department got a bit too faar this time as well. We all remember the "source is in the speaker" that is now removed from the Exakt description.
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
I don't think it will. Those are two completely different things in my experience.macrotech2 wrote:They claim to now have a rock steady reference level which wasn't there before apparently. Perhaps this will reduce the effects of "noise" getting mixed in with the digital signal from Ethernet cables and within the unit. I wonder whether the perceived changes from software updates will now reduce as well.
We've made some spectacular break throughs in exactly that area in these last few months. How to retrieve and transport digital data to a streamer/DAC is a fascinating challenge.
The rock steady reference voltage circuit Linn are now using in the KDS/3 can be found in my preamps Sagatun Mono and stereo. Great chip.
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Is this a case of 'the master has now become the student' ?lejonklou wrote:
The rock steady reference voltage circuit Linn are now using in the KDS/3 can be found in my preamps Sagatun Mono and stereo. Great chip.
Kalla/Sag M/Tun M3/242/LP12/Slip7
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Majik LP12/Boazu/110s
Kalla/Giella Pi/JBL308/RS2e
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Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Fredrik,lejonklou wrote: We've made some spectacular break throughs in exactly that area in these last few months. How to retrieve and transport digital data to a streamer/DAC is a fascinating challenge.
can you elaborate further or is it a secret?
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Not yet, I'm afraid. As soon as it's a product, I'll elaborate.matthias wrote:Fredrik,
can you elaborate further or is it a secret?
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Fredrik,
may I ask whether your system will support higher rate DSD?
Matt
may I ask whether your system will support higher rate DSD?
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
The specifications are not final yet. We've just laid the foundation, so lots of work and decisions remain.matthias wrote:Fredrik,
may I ask whether your system will support higher rate DSD?
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
Fredrik,
congratulations on the very successful launch of Boazu at two major events.
Will the streamer or DAC be your next product?
Matt
congratulations on the very successful launch of Boazu at two major events.
Will the streamer or DAC be your next product?
Matt
Re: The New Lejonklou Streamer
There seem to be some good reports about Daphile:
https://www.daphile.com/
It is a headless Linux based music server and player OS.
Do some members of this forum have experiences with this software?
Merry Christmas to all!
Matt
https://www.daphile.com/
It is a headless Linux based music server and player OS.
Do some members of this forum have experiences with this software?
Merry Christmas to all!
Matt
Matt
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677
MBP / Exposure pre + power (both modified) / JBL3677