New Keltik midrange unit

We use the Tune Method to evaluate performance

Moderator: Staff

poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Hi All,

Just a small update on whats been happening in the ups and downs of the Hi Fi hobby!!

Couple of problems: the Digital Board on the Kinos "blew up" and is now with Linn for repair. This, just after getting the Klimax XO returned; DC leakage on the phonos - 2 new resistors.

However, the interesting part for fellow Keltik owners, is that there is now a new midrange "kit" which will be available in about 2 weeks time.
This consists of Peerless drivers, new gaskets, and some sort of jig to help you fit the slightly different sized units.

The drive units look more "flimsy" than the ones they replace but apparently this is due to the fact that this is a true midrange unit the previous being a mid/bass. The significance is that it is claimed that this results in an improvement in performance!

Once I get all the gear up and running again, and the new units installed - Ill let you know.

Steve.
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Yes, there are new midrange speakers for Keltiks. Mine arrived at the dealers on Monday, I receive them tomorrow. I ordered them two months ago.

Keltiks are fabulous speakers, I let you know how the new mids perform.

Kevin
Pediatrik
Active member
Active member
Posts: 100
Joined: 2007-01-31 17:19
Location: Visby, Sweden

Post by Pediatrik »

New mid-drive units for Keltik?! Interesting! Even if I have a LOT of source upgrading to do before I even think about my Keltiks it will be interesting to hear your report! By the way, anyone who have compared the old filters with the new Chakra ones?
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Hi Kevin,

Interested to hear how you get on. I received 2 Peerless SC14WG49 mid ranges from Linn just over a week ago. They didnt fit, holes dont allign, no new gaskets to cope with the "rounded" flange etc. so I sent them back.

Apparently they are just finallising a "pack" which will contain all the items required to make them fit properly. Only relating this in case, like me, you are anticipating the "new" sound and you also experience the same problem? If you dont have a problem, please could you let me know serial numbers etc.

cheers
Steve.
User avatar
monkeydevil
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 77
Joined: 2007-01-31 18:25
Location: Stockholm

Post by monkeydevil »

poppop wrote: However, the interesting part for fellow Keltik owners, is that there is now a new midrange "kit" which will be available in about 2 weeks time.
This consists of Peerless drivers, new gaskets, and some sort of jig to help you fit the slightly different sized units.
This is wonderful! It really is amazing that Linn offers an upgrade for a speaker that was discontinued so many years ago!

Now I am anxious to hear what you guys think of the upgrade. Is it big and how's the "sound" and musicality compared to newer/current speaker designs? Could second hand upgraded Keltiks be the thing?
Pediatrik
Active member
Active member
Posts: 100
Joined: 2007-01-31 17:19
Location: Visby, Sweden

Post by Pediatrik »

monkeydevil wrote:Could second hand upgraded Keltiks be the thing?
Of course!!! :twisted:

Considering the price, you get a LOT of bang for the bucks nowadays! The recent developments with Chakra-filters, new midrange etc etc makes it possible to keep a pair of Keltiks for a looong time! You need a pile of amps running them, but that is also the case with aktiv Akurate 242:s and even the new Majik 140:s. The interesting comparison would be between a pair of properly set up Keltiks and a pair of aktiv Majik 140. Could be tricky to arrange the demo though...
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Steve,

I have the same issue. The drivers I received have the same part number, and the half round on the flange. So, no way to seal and the existing rings will not work either. Holes are slightly askew as well.

I'm pessimistic as to whether or not this is actually an upgrade. It appears that Linn ran out of replacements and sourced an alternative.

That said, I still think that Keltiks are and have been a great value. I still have keltiks in my second system, and they are incredible - so musical.

Incidentally, I have compared them to 350A's and the Keltiks were much better (the 350's may have had a bit more detail, but not nearly as musical).

Steve, keep me posted on when you receive an acceptable solution.

Kevin
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Kevin,

Yes, like you I was none too sure about them, but they are Peerless. Having spoken to the "techies" Im fairly optimistic that once we have all the bits they will be worthwhile! Ill keep hold of the old ones though, just in case!

If you are still keen to give it a try, what you need is: PACK 1325 - the keltik midrange replacement kit. I was hoping to receive this sometime this week, but havent heard anything as yet.

The worrying bit, of course, is why they distributed something in the UK and US that doesnt fit, and nobody seemed to check??

Fingers crossed, Ill keep you posted.

Steve.
User avatar
Music Lover
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1673
Joined: 2007-01-31 20:35
Location: In front of Lejonklou/JBL/Ofil

Post by Music Lover »

kevinm wrote: Incidentally, I have compared them to 350A's and the Keltiks were much better (the 350's may have had a bit more detail, but not nearly as musical).
What amps did you use with Keltik?
I assume you had same source/pre comparing with 350A (and in same room)
It's all about musical understanding!
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

What amps did you use with Keltik?
I assume you had same source/pre comparing with 350A (and in same room)


I use Klimax Chakra twins on the tweeter and midrange, and Klimax solos for the bass. (I know that the solos would be better on the tweeters, but one channel of a chakra twin is not enough for the two bass speakers. And, remember this is a second system). Currently, the sourece on this system is a CD12, and the pre is a 5103 (weak link I know).

For the comparison, the source was the same, the pre on the Keltiks was Kisto, and the pre on the 350A's was Klimax Kontrol.

Room was not the same, but both systems were setup properly.

I believe that the Keltiks came out a few years too early. When setup properly, they were great with Klouts and internal cards, with the newer electronics, they are amazing. (I do have the Ninka tweeter and the 007/6 midrange in them)

Kevin

Steve, thanks for the information.
User avatar
monkeydevil
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 77
Joined: 2007-01-31 18:25
Location: Stockholm

Post by monkeydevil »

Kevin, you seem to have a great second system! :shock: One gets quite curious about your first system... 8)
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Post by ThomasOK »

Just to clear up a couple of things Linn did indeed run out of the previous Keltik midrange - they have been unavailable for a few months. I have not seen the new driver but if it is the Peerless model mentioned it is actually a midbass driver and not a midrange only as someone stated.

I don't know whether it is truly an upgrade or just an attempt to make a replacement available. It will be interesting to hear what you think of the performance with the new units.

Fredrik, since this thread seems to be turning to a Keltik upgrade one it might be worth splitting it and giving this part a new name.
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Thomas,

According to the email from the Techies at Linn;

"As far as build quality goes, the only bit of the unit which is 'inferior' to the SPKR 007 is the basket. The original SPKR 007 was designed as a bass/mid and therefore had a stronger chassis. The replacement unit is a true midrange and is therefore not designed with sub-100Hz in mind, and so does not require such a robust chassis. In all other ways it is a better unit for the job"

Now, if this isnt the case, it appears that once again we have a problem; in that first the speakers didnt fit, and now there appears to be complete contradiction from Linn representatives?

Steve.
User avatar
ThomasOK
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 4358
Joined: 2007-02-02 18:41
Location: United States
Contact:

Post by ThomasOK »

I must preface this by saying that I have not seen this driver yet. However, if the driver IS the Peerless SC14WG49 it is listed on the Peerless data sheet as a "Midwoofer" and is shown as having a frequency response that is only about 1dB down at 100Hz. Peerless does indeed make midranges such as the PL11MH09 which is a good 7dB down at 100Hz but, interestingly enough, it has a cast magnesium chassis!

So it sounds like someone doesn't have their story straight.

Here are the links on these two drivers:

http://www.tymphany.com/datasheet/printview.php?id=213
http://www.tymphany.com/datasheet/printview.php?id=157
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Thomas,

Ill certainly use the spec. sheet to point this out to the technical dept. at Linn in Glasgow.

It may well be that this is the "best" fit/match available! But as you can see from the information provided it appears to be being sold on the basis of an improvement/upgrade - because it is a "dedicated" mid range unit.

It does appear to lie with linn at present, and it will be interesting to hear what they say, if anything.

The proof, as always will lie with how it sounds.

Steve.
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Monkeydevil,

My primary system is in an acoustically treated dedicated room with dedicated circuits (3x 250v and 2x 125v). It is setup for both 2 channel and multi-channel including a 110 inch (54x96) screen.

Source: DCS stack (Elgar plus, Verdi, Verona) for CD and SACD, and a Camelot Roundtable for DVD

Processor: Linn Kisto

Amps: 4x Halcro DM88s (solos on steroids) for the front speakers, 3x Klouts for the rear (all run on 250v)

Speakers: YG Acoustics ANAT Reference II as the front (I’ve only had these for a couple of weeks and am still playing with positioning and setup), Aktiv Kabers for the rear

Bass Speakers: 3x 5150s

Stands: Sistrum on the front, Sound Organisation on the rear

Cabling: Stealth Indra interconnects (except to rear speakers and bass speakers which is Linn black), Stealth Dream speaker cable to fronts, and Linn K600 to the rears.

We do have an Aktiv Ekwal with Klout as a center channel, but do not currently have it in the room.

System is approaching a live performance.

We also have a distributed Knekt system and have a Kremlin, Classic CD, Aktiv Keildhs, and Aktiv on-wall Sekrits both with Klouts (and a couple of lk100s that are no longer used). I have been thinking about selling most of the items for the distributed system.

Kevin
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Steve,

Have you heard anything or received the installation PACK? I've not heard anything back yet.

Thanks,
Kevin
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Hi Kevin,

No not a thing. I think we have been talking a bit about this on the other forum.

Given the comments from Thomas re. the Peerless driver, and the fact the pack is now a few days late, it was my intention to give them a call early this coming week for an update. Ill let you know if there is any progress.

Just as an aside. I didnt realise that Peerless now apparently supply most of the drivers for Linn. The existing 007/6 has the Linn logo well stamped on the flange. Wonder if they are stopping "personalising" them for cost reasons?

Steve.
User avatar
Music Lover
Very active member
Very active member
Posts: 1673
Joined: 2007-01-31 20:35
Location: In front of Lejonklou/JBL/Ofil

Post by Music Lover »

kevinm wrote: Bass Speakers: 3x 5150s
YEAH!
I take it you like live feeling, playing musik :mrgreen:

Tell me more about the Halcro amps. How are they compared with Solo?
It's all about musical understanding!
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Steve,

I'm hoping to hear back this coming week. "it's being investigated," was the info I received.

It is my understanding as well that Peerless makes most of the drivers for the current line of speakers. I assume the lack of the Linn logo on this driver is because they selected an off-the-shelf speaker. Which I do applaud Linn for continuing to support the older speakers, and finding a driver.

One of my 007/6's developed a slight buzz at high volumes which is how I found out about the replacement. Curiously, I also ordered a replacement mid for my Kabers (small child pushed in dust cap) at the same time, and I received the last 007/6 (it was written on the packaging). So, I put it in the Keltik for now.

Of course, knowing that I have a pushed in dust cap is driving me crazy. I put the sock grills back on so I can't see it.

Music Lover,

I ended up with 3 5150s's, as my last room was 20x35 ft with 12 foot ceilings, so a lot of volume. I use them primarily for movies and concert DVDs (yes very lifelike). My current room is an L shaped which is 16x32 on the down portion of the L and the side is 16x16.

Up until a couple of weeks ago I used Keltiks as the front speakers in this room, and in two channel (without the 5150s) the music just flowed (no problem with bass).

I just listened to Eric Clapton Live at Hyde Park DVD, it's incredible. You can "feel" the music as if you're there.

The comparison that I would use for the Halcro amps is that the difference between the Klimax Chakra twins and the solos is similar to the difference between the solos and Halcros. I was using the Halcros as the tweeter and mid amps for the Keltiks and solos on the bass.

The ANAT speakers are only available as passive on the top module, so I'm in process of getting cabling to bridge the Halcro amps which I'm told take them to another level.

Kevin
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Kevin,

Had an email response today. PAC 1325 is now avalable for order.
Ive placed an order via my dealer, and would therefore expect a delivery in the next few days.

The view still seems to be that this is a better "mid range" than previous models. Ill ceratinly let you know in a few weeks how I think it sounds.

However, as like me, you already have had the drivers, you may just want to go ahead and place an order and give them a try?

11/11/07 - confirmed delivery W/C 26/11.

Steve.
alrad2002
New member
New member
Posts: 5
Joined: 2007-11-12 06:20
Location: Australia

Post by alrad2002 »

Hi folks! I've been watching this thread with great interest as I also have a Keltik with a buzzy mid. Has anyone had a chance to install this new replacement and take it for a test drive?

Eagerly awaiting your impressions!

Cheers!

Allen
poppop
Active member
Active member
Posts: 127
Joined: 2007-02-02 09:28
Location: N.E. Scotland.

Post by poppop »

Allen

As above, I wont be taking delivery until the week commencing 26/11.
If others have them I too would be delighted to hear about how they sound.

If its of any interest, Neil at Wilmslow audio was able to source a Monacor SPW-150/8S unit with very similar specs. Ive ordered a couple to try - only about £80 the pair.

Like you I also have a "buzzy" mid at certain volumes with certain tracks. Thought it would be fun/interesting to experiment and hear if I noticed any difference - better or worse!

Steve.
alrad2002
New member
New member
Posts: 5
Joined: 2007-11-12 06:20
Location: Australia

Post by alrad2002 »

Steve,

My bad.....didn't see that this thread had spilt over to page 2!

I guess I'll just have to be patient then.......

Cheers!

Allen
kevinm
New member
New member
Posts: 9
Joined: 2007-09-11 21:13
Location: Potomac, MD USA

Post by kevinm »

Steve,

Did you receive the installation kit on the 26th? Have you installed the new mids?

Thanks,
Kevin
Post Reply